Duggars expecting child #19

Again you cannot defend your position so you bring in unrelated issues to support it.

 

You "think" it based on what? What exactly defines them as a cult and by what standard have you determined this?

 

You did not answer it in that thread. And if all you have is the "common sense"defense well then your case is revealed.

 

Where is that commandment?

Go back and read my edit.

But to answer your wrest, the commandment was given to mankind. In your example, you compare a large family to drunkenness, sloth and wreckless behavior. There are explicit commandments concerning drunkenness and sloth and wrecklessness, but where is the commandment to limit the size of one's family?

 

Still waiting for someone to post an unscriptural assertion or trend in Quiverfull.com .

 

To argue that because God does not forbid a particular practice does not and cannot mean He desires the opposite. That is arguing from silence and is not a viable means of interpreting Scripture or governing life.

When the Lord gave dominion over creation to man, one could make the argument that reproduction is included in that. I happen to think that is a good and fair interpretation seeing that there is not a single text that specifically states God retained dominion over reproduction. Obviously, inspite of God giving the human race that dominion, God can intervene as He pleases (and has).

I have not read every single post in this thread, but I have not seen the "condemnation" some have claimed. I do not condemn the Duggar Family, nor do I question there love for the Lord Jesus. I do however believe the Quiverfull Movement and the Gothard Movement are replete with scriptural error that all too often lead to parents making poor decisions for themselves and their families.

 

Please list one.

 

Their holding Psalm 127 as a "proof text" for their specific practice would be one. To say that God commands his people to do what the Duggars have done based on that text is a stretch. I can see how they get there, I disagree with the way they get there.

Not that Piper is inspired, I think he offers an interesting thought from Desiring God on the subject...

"just because something is a gift from the Lord does not mean that it is wrong to be a steward of when or whether you will come into possession of it. It is wrong to reason that since A is good and a gift from the Lord, then we must pursue as much of A as possible. God has made this a world in which tradeoffs have to be made and we cannot do everything to the fullest extent. For kingdom purposes, it might be wise not to get married. And for kingdom purposes, it might be wise to regulate the size of one's family and to regulate when the new additions to the family will likely arrive. As Wayne Grudem has said, 'it is okay to place less emphasis on some good activities in order to focus on other good activities.'

Just a thought...

 

TT, I'm totally with you on this one. People often don't realize the ramifications of following Gothard in such a hardcore way.

 

I didn't see the sentiment that large families are compulsory on the website. I haven't researched them fully, though. Could you cite them?

 

So we have labeled them Gothard followers so we can jusify any thing now huh?

 

Rev Mitchell, they are Gothard followers. This is a huge problem. Gothard does not teach the Bible - he teaches Gothardism. I am posting the info I had on a previous page because it was at the bottom and some may not have seen it.

Gothard does not teach grace but legalism; he also imbues people with fear based on his rules.

Do you realize he taught that having a Cabbage Patch doll in the home would cause a miscarriage? This is the level we are dealing with with Gothard.

Read Vienot's book. Vienot has met with Gothard and has had to deal with Gothard because in his area (Chicago), there are a lot of Gothard followers and many, many problems have arisen, including churches that split over Gothard (those that followed Gothard would not stay with those that did not).

I know this is not a thread about Gothard, but since this family are Gothardites, it's important to understand what they do in light of that. One should not dismiss it.

 

According to the Duggar website, Jim Bob recommends Gothard and Vision Forum Ministries as "essential faith-building tools".

 

More info on Gothard. This is from a very conservative ministry and I know them personally and can vouch for them:
http://www.pfo.org/evol-fad.htm

If you don't get the book by Veinot, at least read this article. There is not enough space to list all of his wacky teachings - and I mean wacky!

 

Yea I know what he teaches and quite frankly he weird. In fact i have his book "Institute In Basic Life Principles" on my shelf along side other false teachings.

But here is the thing;

Whether or not their children leave home before marriage is not of any real consequence. Whether or not you have a cabbage patch doll in the home is not of any consequence. And by the way Bill Gothards teaching gets taught in Baptist churches all over the country.

My 21 year old is a sophomore in college and she lives at home because she cannot sustain herself yet. But believing just the opposite while not common is in no way harmful. It is like believing fish only swim in circles that go left. It is weird but who cares? demonizing such ideas as a cult is over the top.