Your View On The Roman Catholics

[Peggy]

Would you say the same about Mormons? I'm curious, what do you think the reason for the Reformation was?
Joseph Smith invented a new religion that does not have it's basis in Christianity.

I'm curious what part of the Reformation is that you refer to? There are many complicated facets of the Reformation so I can't make a specific response to a general question.


Out of curiousity, do you believe that it's insulting for them to pronouce us anathema, say that our churches are not legitimate, or that we cannot be saved outside of the Catholic Church?

Do you know what anathema means? Do you know when it was pronounced? I have read that the Pope and the Catholic catechism does recognize non-Catholic Christians as brothers and sisters in Christ, whereas you don't want to extend the same courtesy. We have more in common than you think: Salvation through Christ, the virgin Birth of Jesus, the Triune God, etc etc as explained in the classic Christian creeds. This is why I consider my Catholic friends as brothers and sisters in Christ, as they do me. I'm pretty sure when we get to Heaven we won't be segregated by denominational affiliation, nor will we be judged on a "correct view of justification".

Jesus himself says how we will be judged in Matthew 25. Honestly, it seems that Jesus is teaching that we will be judged on our works of mercy done out of love for him, not "faith alone". As James says, "faith without works is dead". So Jesus does call us to have faith working through love.

Mat 25:33 And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left.
Mat 25:34 Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.
Mat 25:35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me,
Mat 25:36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.'
Mat 25:37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink?
Mat 25:38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?
Mat 25:39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?'
Mat 25:40 And the King will answer them, 'Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.'
Mat 25:41 "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
Mat 25:42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink,
Mat 25:43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.'
Mat 25:44 Then they also will answer, saying, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?'
Mat 25:45 Then he will answer them, saying, 'Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.'
Mat 25:46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

I think we will be surprised to see who is and who is not in heaven.

 

[DHK]

The bare minimum that a Catholic must know and adhere to in doctrine to be a Catholic is the knowledge that one needs to know to be confirmed. There is enough heresy taught in confirmation classes such as to say that one cannot believe what the RCC teaches and be saved at the same time. You can't sit on the fence. You either believe one or the other (justification by faith).

 

[Baptist4life]

The bare minimum that a Catholic must know and adhere to in doctrine to be a Catholic is the knowledge that one needs to know to be confirmed. There is enough heresy taught in confirmation classes such as to say that one cannot believe what the RCC teaches and be saved at the same time. You can't sit on the fence. You either believe one or the other (justification by faith).

Amen and Amen! At least there are some of us who know the Truth! :thumbsup:

 

[fbcodr]

Just as many Roman Catholics as Baptists are Christians. Being saved isn't about knowledge is it about receiving grace through faith.

Very few Roman Catholics are born again Christians!!! Very many Baptist are born again Christians. That's because it isn't about knowledge as it is about receiving grace through faith.:thumbsup:

 

[Jim1999]

In the 1950's, in Quebec, Canada, the Roman Catholic Church had political power and had Baptists jailed for preaching the gospel. Now tell me that the RC Church accepts outsiders as Christians! Sorry, I don't buy that from the official church's standpoint.

Cheers, and God bless freedom in Christ,

Jim

 

[JohnDeereFan]

Joseph Smith invented a new religion that does not have it's basis in Christianity.

That doesn't answer the question.

I'm curious what part of the Reformation is that you refer to? There are many complicated facets of the Reformation so I can't make a specific response to a general question.

Sure. I didn't think you'd answer the question.

Do you know what anathema means? Do you know when it was pronounced?

Yes and yes.

I have read that the Pope and the Catholic catechism does recognize non-Catholic Christians as brothers and sisters in Christ, whereas you don't want to extend the same courtesy.

How can I extend that "courtesy" to them when they're not Christians?

We have more in common than you think: Salvation through Christ, the virgin Birth of Jesus, the Triune God, etc etc as explained in the classic Christian creeds. This is why I consider my Catholic friends as brothers and sisters in Christ, as they do me.

The problem is that whatever we have in common does not negate the significant differences.

I'm pretty sure when we get to Heaven we won't be segregated by denominational affiliation, nor will we be judged on a "correct view of justification".

Really? You might want to take a good look at John 2.

Honestly, it seems that Jesus is teaching that we will be judged on our works of mercy done out of love for him, not "faith alone". As James says, "faith without works is dead". So Jesus does call us to have faith working through love.

Ah, so you believe in works righteousness. No wonder you don't see the problems with Catholic heresies.

 

[Peggy]

Ah, so you believe in works righteousness. No wonder you don't see the problems with Catholic heresies.

No, I believe that what the Bible says is true

Jas 2:24 You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

Gal 5:6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love.

 

[Jim1999]

Both those verses refer to life after grace, and not a works based salvation. They do not juxtapose "by grace are you saved through faith and not by works lest any man should boast........."

Cheers,

Jim

 

[brucebaptist]

Show me. Prove to me that they believe this. Let me edit this. Yes Catholics believe immaculate conseption, that she was perpetual virgin, that she has an honored place in heaven and called "Queen of heaven" I'm not sure this is a must but you can't preach against it. However, their connotations of what this means and what you mean are two different things. What I'm questioning is this Show me that they believe this.

heres a list of their dogmas... he is right.

http://jloughnan.tripod.com/dogma.htm

and heres a few of their quotes from over the years. amazing...

http://www.lightministries.com/id605.htm

 

[brucebaptist]

Rather than side track another thread, I'll start this one. Personally, I do not believe Roman Catholics are Christians. From some of the posts on another thread, there seem to be some who think they might be. What do you think?

the catholic teachings are not Christian. at least according to the Bible. they call mary a "co-saviour".... that is unbiblical and antichrist. it takes glory away from Christ and gives it to their system.

as an ex-catholic... i can say, that when God took the scales off my eyes and saved me from romanism... i was convicted to get out of that system. the Holy Spirit said GET OUT!

Revelation 18:4 - Then I heard another voice from heaven say: "Come out of her, my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues;

if a muslim gets saved he will come out of that cult. if a jw gets saved he will come out of that cult. when an athiest gets saved he comes out...

you cannot stay in a false religion and be a saved any more than you can continue to be an adulterer and fornicator and be saved.

i think (based on the Word) the main reason for this is obedience... if you are following the pope and his sacramental system, then you are not following Christ. they give 2 different gospels...

i have had 2 other close relatives (bro and niece) get saved and both of them left the catholic church. what is unique to them that my catholic relatives dont have is:
a true passion for Christ
a passion for truth
a desire to please God
they are obedient to the Words of Christ
hate their sins
have fruits of true repentance
they love the Bible...

i cannot say any of those things about my catholic relatives... they...
love the "church"
love the mass
love the rosary
love statues and relics
love their sins
love gambling
hate the Word
show no fruits of repentance

Revelation 5:9
And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

as the verse above proves... the Lord will save His chosen sheep from every fold of the earth... when He does... they will forsake their evil deeds as well as their false religions...

 

[brucebaptist]

Nothing in your quote suggest that they loose salvation if they don't attend. It seems to say they aren't guaranteed it either. I'll look at the referrence in the CCC.

you may want to review this... for starters.

http://www.guidedbytruth.com/anathema.php

 

[DHK]

Very few Roman Catholics are born again Christians!!! Very many Baptist are born again Christians. That's because it isn't about knowledge as it is about receiving grace through faith.:thumbsup:

Eph.2:8,9 teaches that salvation is by grace through faith. You would not know the above stated truth or doctrine apart from teaching or doctrine taught from the Bible. The gospel is knowledge gained from the Bible. Salvation is based on knowledge gained from the Bible. Apart from the revelation in the Bible we have nothing. Our faith is not blind faith. It is based on doctrine--doctrine that has been revealed to us in the Word of God--the Bible. Yes, salvation is about knowledge--the knowledge of the gospel.

If your salvation is more about experience than about the knowledge of the gospel I would question it. That is the essence of much of the Charismatic movement, especially "The Third Wave."

 

[Marcia]

There are some who have trusted Christ and hold to those things out of ignorance, just as there are some Baptists who have trusted Christ and hold to extra-Biblical teachings out of ignorance also.

It's not a matter of what some Baptists believe and what some Catholics believe, but what are the differences between Catholic and Baptist doctrine?

 

[Baptist4life]

I believe that those on here who've posted that they think RC's are Christian have to be ignorant (meaning, not aware) of what the RCC truly teaches and believes. I'll say it again....RC's are NOT Christians. Believing they are Christians, and therefore not trying to witness to them, is only condemning them to a life without Christ, and an eternity in Hell.

 

[Baptist4life]

It's not a matter of what some Baptists believe and what some Catholics believe, but what are the differences between Catholic and Baptist doctrine?

I would ask..........what are the differences between Catholic and Christian doctrine?

 

[donnA]

I beleive there are Roman Catholics who are christians, but the RCC faith is not christian, nor do they teach biblical salvation, as a whole my answer is no, but yes for some individuals.
Like others have said, there are some baptists who aren't actually christians. But the baptists faith is biblical, and they do teach biblical salvation. Otherwise I wouldn't be a baptist. And I would still be RCC.
There are 10 page sof comments I don't think I'm going back to read all of them.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

I believe that those on here who've posted that they think RC's are Christian have to be ignorant (meaning, not aware) of what the RCC truly teaches and believes. I'll say it again....RC's are NOT Christians. Believing they are Christians, and therefore not trying to witness to them, is only condemning them to a life without Christ, and an eternity in Hell.

When the pope came to Washington and then to New York, a while back, our evangelism team went to both of those places to share the Gospel with the Catholics there.

Not only were the Catholics completely ignorant of even the most basic Christian doctrines, but you'd be amazed how much heat we took from our fellow "Christians" for being so hateful and bigoted as to want to share the Gospel with them.

 

[donnA]

I believe that those on here who've posted that they think RC's are Christian have to be ignorant (meaning, not aware) of what the RCC truly teaches and believes. I'll say it again....RC's are NOT Christians. Believing they are Christians, and therefore not trying to witness to them, is only condemning them to a life without Christ, and an eternity in Hell.

I would ask..........what are the differences between Catholic and Christian doctrine?

Sometimes people don't really bother to find out the truth and understand what the RCC beleive and assume they are christians (as a whole, not the individual). If the RCC salvation is true then ours is not and we're all going to hell, or pergatory rather.

 

[Steven2006]

I beleive there are Roman Catholics who are christians, but the RCC faith is not christian, nor do they teach biblical salvation, as a whole my answer is no, but yes for some individuals.
Like others have said, there are some baptists who aren't actually christians. But the baptists faith is biblical, and they do teach biblical salvation. Otherwise I wouldn't be a baptist. And I would still be RCC.
There are 10 page sof comments I don't think I'm going back to read all of them.

This is my position as well and I think a reasonable one. But you won't convince those that feel the need to declare that they know with absolute certainty that every single individual catholic person is bound for hell without exception.

 

[Johnv]

I would ask..........what are the differences between Catholic and Christian doctrine?

One can also ask the differences between Baptist doctrine and general Christian doctrine. The answer is certainly not "none".