Closed communion - as doctrine

[paul wassona]

The application referrs to direct irreverence as exemplified in gluutony and drunkenness. It doesn't refer to whether someone has sinned, or if someone doesn't subscribe to a preestablished list of doctrines, etc. That said, it's not necessarily wrong for a church to exclude such from communion, but the verse in question is not a prooftext for doing so.

So now you say drunkeness and gluttoney aren't sin?

Adultery is gluttoney and being drunk with the wine of fornication.

The passage means to knowingly being under conviction for sin and partaking of the Lord's Supper, or do you somehow belive the Holy Ghost has misplaced the power to convict saints?

Adultery IS irreverence for the atoning blood of Christ and His body broken for our transgressions. Anyone who is known for being in any illicit affair is to be denied communion as the effort to reconcile them back into fellowship.

Churches have become so afraid of losing members they overlook too many sins ( afraid they can't pay the bills because offerings decrease), this places men in charge of God's ordinance. :1_grouphug:

Let the truth be known, it's only the carnal that would not attend. Yet sinners see the hypocrisy and see no use in going to a comprimised church.:tear:

Churches have laid aside the principles, purposes and practices of discipline in an effort to keep the financial statement looking good.:sleep:

What I learned is if God is obeyed and kept as the head He takes care of all the finances.:thumbsup:

 

[paul wassona]

I'm curious as to what text in that passage makes you think so, and what that applies to.

Maybe it's the one where if a man judge himself, or maybe the one where he is to examine himself.

Ah, heck, of course it is.:tonofbricks:

 

[paul wassona]

So very true.

When you use the phrase L-church - I would call it LO-church (local - only church)

Even the U-church believes in the local church as well.

Salty

What I'm waiting for is the verses that show CC to be a doctrine.

I have known pastors who won't even observe communion at all because they say we all have sin and would be drinking damnation to our souls.

The key is that we all should examine ourselves, giving open opportunity for the Lord to show us our wrongs. Then we should judge ourselves and repent of those sins before taking communion, or we could go ahead and take the chance for God to judge us!

We even have an altar call BEFORE the communion service exactly for that purpose.:thumbsup:

 

[Johnv]

So now you say drunkeness and gluttoney aren't sin?

Never said that, Harold. Not once.

The passage means to knowingly being under conviction for sin and partaking of the Lord's Supper...

That's not what the passage is referring to. The passage starts by saying "When you come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord’s supper. For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? what shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not..." and then he goes on to say "... he that eats and drinks unworthily, eats and drinks damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord’s body."

The passage is expressly referring to gluttony and drunkenness.

 

[Tom Butler]

So very true.

When you use the phrase L-church - I would call it LO-church (local - only church)

Even the U-church believes in the local church as well.

Salty

I like your abbreviation better than mine. Consider it stolen

 

[Tom Butler]

What I'm waiting for is the verses that show CC to be a doctrine.

It's not a doctrine, it's a practice.

I have known pastors who won't even observe communion at all because they say we all have sin and would be drinking damnation to our souls.

Stay away from them, very far.

The key is that we all should examine ourselves, giving open opportunity for the Lord to show us our wrongs. Then we should judge ourselves and repent of those sins before taking communion, or we could go ahead and take the chance for God to judge us!

We even have an altar call BEFORE the communion service exactly for that purpose.:thumbsup:

Examining ourselves is a separate issue from the restrictions of the Lord's table. Of course we should. And the idea of an altar call prior to communion sounds like a good idea to me.

 

[paul wassona]

Never said that, Harold. Not once.

That's not what the passage is referring to. The passage starts by saying "When you come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lords supper. For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken. What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? what shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not..." and then he goes on to say "... he that eats and drinks unworthily, eats and drinks damnation to himself, not discerning the Lords body."

The passage is expressly referring to gluttony and drunkenness.

And all this time I thought it was all about discerning the Lord's body. John, it's not about the rich, the poor, the drunks and gluttons, it's about our approach to the Lord's table.

 

[Johnv]

And all this time I thought it was all about discerning the Lord's body. John, it's not about the rich, the poor, the drunks and gluttons, it's about our approach to the Lord's table.

Certinaly, this is covered elsewhere in scripture. This specific passage, however, was addressing a succinct problem, that of abusing the custom of communion for the purpose of gluttony and drunkenness.

 

[paul wassona]

Certinaly, this is covered elsewhere in scripture. This specific passage, however, was addressing a succinct problem, that of abusing the custom of communion for the purpose of gluttony and drunkenness.

Truth. Also it was about the way they approached it and what they did, or didn't do after getting there. I didn't see it til today, but you called me "Harold" in quoting me. Have I earned a pet name? Your's is "Q". Sometimes I skip over and don't see everything when scrolling up or down on my phone.

 

[Revmitchell]

And all this time I thought it was all about discerning the Lord's body. John, it's not about the rich, the poor, the drunks and gluttons, it's about our approach to the Lord's table.

It is about the irreverent physical manner in 1 Cor 11

 

[Johnv]

but you called me "Harold" in quoting me.

We all know you're Harold Garvey, we just can't prove it. At least not yet.

 

[paul wassona]

We all know you're Harold Garvey, we just can't prove it. At least not yet.

I hadn't known I entered a courtroom? You all will have a very tough go at it to prove I am somebody that I am not. You might see it to your benefit to pray about this before taking communion and real soon, "Q". Might it be you should go back before the Continuim and ask for your Q power of omniscience back!

 

[Johnv]

Doesn't matter. You're Harold Garvey, and most of us know it.

 

[David Michael Harris]

Is closed communion Biblical or is a local church going against scripture if they do practice closed communion?

If an individual believes in closed communion and visits an "open communion" church but refused to partake, is he wrong; would it be sinful not to partake?

Salty

PS, this was started due to a post about a BB member trying to find a CC church.

Closed bread and wine to Christians who are not of your local fellowship is daft.

Why? If they are the Lord's. Seems daft if you ask me.

 

[paul wassona]

It should come to assessment of this thread that communion should only be closed to those who are in known sin by the congregation. This is admonishable to those and is a doctrine. All the posts have helped me to know more than I did and I thank you all for the posts that help me.

 

[David Michael Harris]

We eat and drink judgement on ourselves. Non Christians cop for it later.

 

[Mexdeaf]

ALL RIGHT, Paul and Johnv,

It's time to shake on it and make up!!:laugh:

 

[David Michael Harris]

My first Baptist fellowship always said, the Table is open to all who love the Lord.

And why always the second Lord's Day in the month I will never know.

As often as you do Jesus said. Guess that makes sense. I prefer once a week or more. I wish every day.

 

[Johnv]

It should come to assessment of this thread that communion should only be closed to those who are in known sin by the congregation.

Yet, in scripture's account of the last supper, Jesus served Judas, knowing full well of what he was doing.

That said, I'm not saying I disagree with the idea of denying communion to anyone who is in known sin. I'm just saying that the "unworthy" passage in Corinthians wasn't written to address that.

Further, I, as an elder in my church, and who is one of the people who serves communion weekly, do not believe I am authorized by either scripture or the church to deny communion to anyone who approaches me during communion time.

 

[paul wassona]

Closed bread and wine to Christians who are not of your local fellowship is daft.

Why? If they are the Lord's. Seems daft if you ask me.

Daftness must be some sort of excercise because many are doing it. Jesus told all of his to do communion and warnings are found with his saying to do it. A pastor would do well to encourage people to do communion on a regualr basis. He would need to discourage others until they got it right from doing communion. It isn't the pastor's or the church's role to deny it, but theirs to observe and do it.