The smoking gun, of the Earth’s age

[stilllearning]

On another thread, when we were talking about the Bible’s record of creation, someone said......
“I can't agree on the day thing.”
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Well, here is the Scripture, that you have to ignore, if you reject that a creation day, is more than a 24 hours.........
Luke 3:23-38
V.23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was [the son] of Heli,
V.24 Which was [the son] of Matthat, which was [the son] of Levi, which was [the son] of Melchi, which was [the son] of Janna, which was [the son] of Joseph,
V.25 Which was [the son] of Mattathias, which was [the son] of Amos, which was [the son] of Naum, which was [the son] of Esli, which was [the son] of Nagge,
V.26 Which was [the son] of Maath, which was [the son] of Mattathias, which was [the son] of Semei, which was [the son] of Joseph, which was [the son] of Juda,
V.27 Which was [the son] of Joanna, which was [the son] of Rhesa, which was [the son] of Zorobabel, which was [the son] of Salathiel, which was [the son] of Neri,
V.28 Which was [the son] of Melchi, which was [the son] of Addi, which was [the son] of Cosam, which was [the son] of Elmodam, which was [the son] of Er,
V.29 Which was [the son] of Jose, which was [the son] of Eliezer, which was [the son] of Jorim, which was [the son] of Matthat, which was [the son] of Levi,
V.30 Which was [the son] of Simeon, which was [the son] of Juda, which was [the son] of Joseph, which was [the son] of Jonan, which was [the son] of Eliakim,
V.31 Which was [the son] of Melea, which was [the son] of Menan, which was [the son] of Mattatha, which was [the son] of Nathan, which was [the son] of David,
V.32 Which was [the son] of Jesse, which was [the son] of Obed, which was [the son] of Booz, which was [the son] of Salmon, which was [the son] of Naasson,
V.33 Which was [the son] of Aminadab, which was [the son] of Aram, which was [the son] of Esrom, which was [the son] of Phares, which was [the son] of Juda,
V.34 Which was [the son] of Jacob, which was [the son] of Isaac, which was [the son] of Abraham, which was [the son] of Thara, which was [the son] of Nachor,
V.35 Which was [the son] of Saruch, which was [the son] of Ragau, which was [the son] of Phalec, which was [the son] of Heber, which was [the son] of Sala,
V.36 Which was [the son] of Cainan, which was [the son] of Arphaxad, which was [the son] of Sem, which was [the son] of Noe, which was [the son] of Lamech,
V.37 Which was [the son] of Mathusala, which was [the son] of Enoch, which was [the son] of Jared, which was [the son] of Maleleel, which was [the son] of Cainan,
V.38 Which was [the son] of Enos, which was [the son] of Seth, which was [the son] of Adam, which was [the son] of God.

This record goes from Joseph, all the way back to Adam.
No way could the Earth be older than about 6000 years.

 

[Jerome]

Well, here is the Scripture, that you have to ignore, if you reject that a creation day, is more than a 24 hours.........

I reject that a creation day, is more than a 24 hours.
Why would I have to ignore that scripture?

 

[preachinjesus]

You can actually still propose an old, or very old, earth view and affirm Scripture including the genealogies.

 

[stilllearning]

Hi Jerome

Sorry, I misspoke.

I meant to say.......

“Here is the Scripture, that you have to ignore, if you believe that a creation day, is more than a 24 hours.........

 

[KenH]

Well, here is the Scripture, that you have to ignore, if you reject that a creation day, is more than a 24 hours.........

You are assuming that the genealogy you quoted is complete and lists every person ever born in that line, that it is not just listing the major people in that genealogy.

I am not saying you are wrong, but you are making an assumption.

Also, just to throw this in for general purposes, coming up with the correct age for the earth is not necessary to be saved.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

Its not the smoking gun. Sorry. The list could be incomplete, They're basing it off of their writen knowledge which was far from complete. Heck they thought wind came out of gates from the differing sides of the earth.

 

[stilllearning]

Hi KenH

You said........

“You are assuming that the genealogy you quoted is complete and lists every person ever born in that line, that it is not just listing the major people in that genealogy.”

No, I am not assuming that, I am stating it as a fact.

The passage clearly lists fathers and sons.

Now it is true, that in some cases Scripture refers back to a person’s grandfather.

But, that is not clear here: (And even if it did happen a couple of times, my point still stands.
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You also said........

“Also, just to throw this in for general purposes, coming up with the correct age for the earth is not necessary to be saved.”

The subject of salvation, has not come in this thread!

 

[stilllearning]

Hello Thinkingstuff

I could not believe, that you said..........

“They're basing it off of their writen knowledge which was far from complete. Heck they thought wind came out of gates from the differing sides of the earth.”

When you said “they”, I guess your talking about Luke etc.

Not one word of Luke, was “based” upon anything that Luke knew or thought he knew.
The words, in the book of Luke(along with every other Bible writer), were given to them by God.
(This is called inspiration!)

 

[Zenas]

Hello Thinkingstuff

I could not believe, that you said..........


When you said “they”, I guess your talking about Luke etc.

Not one word of Luke, was “based” upon anything that Luke knew or thought he knew.
The words, in the book of Luke(along with every other Bible writer), were given to them by God.
(This is called inspiration!)

And you know this how? I hope you're right and I govern my life as though this is true because I have faith that it is. But I really wish the evidence were stronger.

 

[stilllearning]

Hello Zenas

You asked..........

“And you know this how? I hope you're right and I govern my life as though this is true because I have faith that it is. But I really wish the evidence were stronger.”

All the evidence we need is..........
2 Timothy 3:16-17
V.16 All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
V.17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
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“All Scripture”, means every word found in the 66 books of the Bible.

 

[Robert Snow]

I don't know and it isn't important at all, but I tend to believe in an old earth. Surely much older than 6000 years.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

Hello Thinkingstuff

I could not believe, that you said..........


When you said “they”, I guess your talking about Luke etc.

Not one word of Luke, was “based” upon anything that Luke knew or thought he knew.
The words, in the book of Luke(along with every other Bible writer), were given to them by God.
(This is called inspiration!)

Why are you suprised? Luke was a gentile who used his resources to gather information about Jesus geneology. And record keeping before the babylonian captivity wasn't that great. God did not dictate his words to Luke. He inspired Luke to write what he knew and understood. There is a big difference. The bible was not dictated saved for aspects of the law or Torah. Apart from that we gather inspiration.

 

[KenH]

I am stating it as a fact.

You can state that you believe it as a fact; however, that doesn't make it so.

 

[stilllearning]

Hello again Thinkingstuff

I am very sorry to hear about your opinion of Scripture.
I can tell you, that if I shared that opinion, I would not be a Christian.
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As for Luke being a gentile, I am not so sure of that, because of..........
Romans 3:1-2
V.1 ¶ What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit [is there] of circumcision?
V.2 Much every way: chiefly, because that unto them were committed the oracles of God.

But once again, you would say that this is just Paul’s opinion.

 

[matt wade]

I don't know and it isn't important at all, but I tend to believe in an old earth. Surely much older than 6000 years.

It isn't important? It's of the utmost importance! If you can't believe that God created the earth and everything on it exactly as he has told us, what else can't you believe in the Bible? Of course the history of the creation is important. If it's not important, what else should be dismiss? I'm sure I can name a few that you would dismiss. The flood, Jonah, Job, just about everything with Moses. Which of these others do you dismiss as unimportant?

 

[matt wade]

You can state that you believe it as a fact; however, that doesn't make it so.

It's a fact because the Bible tells us so. If that isn't good enough for you, then you are a lost cause.

 

[stilllearning]

You can state that you believe it as a fact; however, that doesn't make it so.

You didn’t give my entire quote.
I said........

“No, I am not assuming that, I am stating it as a fact.
The passage clearly lists fathers and sons.”

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If you lists fathers and sons, and if you list the ages of the fathers when they had the sons and the ages of the sons when they died(as the Old Testament does), you can factually give the earth a young age.

 

[RAdam]

If there were missing gaps, those missing gaps must be in the geneology from Genesis 5, the one that records the line of Jesus from Adam to Noah. However, Jude provides us with some valuable insight, and here we get to see the genius of the bible. Jude 14 says, "And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints..." Now, we go back to Genesis 5 and find that, yes, Enoch is the seventh from Adam.

What's more, we find that we have a complete chronology for both of the big geneologies in Genesis, the ones in Chapters 5 and 11. The only true gap we have (meaning, the only section where we don't have inspired scripture prior to what Matthew and Luke wrote), then, is that between the testaments. However, we know reasonably well how long this period lasted. Thus, from Adam to Christ must be something on the order of 4,000 years or so.

 

[RAdam]

Why are you suprised? Luke was a gentile who used his resources to gather information about Jesus geneology. And record keeping before the babylonian captivity wasn't that great. God did not dictate his words to Luke. He inspired Luke to write what he knew and understood. There is a big difference. The bible was not dictated saved for aspects of the law or Torah. Apart from that we gather inspiration.

Wrong. Paul says they were God-breathed. What is written in the bible came from God.

 

[Winman]

Stilllearning, I think you did a good job here. I believe the account in Luke accurate.

In Genesis 5 it is easy to count the years, from Adam to Shem was 1556 years. From Shem to Jesus was 64 generations according to the Luke account. If you multiply this by 40, which is very reasonable (especially because men continued to live very long lives for several generations after Shem), you get 2560 years. Add this to 1556 and you get 4116 years from Adam to Jesus.

So, I believe the world is around 6000 years old, give or take maybe 200-300 years.

Good job.