Can God originate a thought?

[Skandelon]

If God foreknows all his own thoughts before thinking them how can He ever originate a new thought? Was God ever unknowing of a thought or intent prior to its being originated? If not, how did that thought ever originate?

Could it be that our finite linear thinking and speculations fall short when speaking of God's foreknowledge and its necessity of being predeterminate in nature?

 

[Van]

The same people who say God chose or elected individuals in eternity, say God's knowledge of who would believe was not used or was used, so according to these false doctrines, God does not utilize His knowledge except when it supports Calvinist or Arminian doctrine. And those who disagree based on scripture - where God chooses for a purpose living individuals - why we all know they have "incoherent beliefs" and need to study more.

 

[Tom Butler]

I quote R. Charles Blair, once an active member of this board:

"Did it ever occur to you that nothing ever occurs to God?"

 

[Jim1999]

Foreknowledge is not a predetermining factor, it is a natural attribute of God.

No, you cannot surprise God because He does foreknow events.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Van]

No, that never occurred to me. Maybe it would if I believed false doctrine.

 

[Skandelon]

I quote R. Charles Blair, once an active member of this board:

"Did it ever occur to you that nothing ever occurs to God?"

That really doesn't address the question of the OP, does it?

 

[Winman]

Why do the scriptures repeatedly say God searches our heart?

Psa 139:23 Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts:

Jer 17:10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

Psa 44:21 Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart.

1 Chr 28:9 And thou, Solomon my son, know thou the God of thy father, and serve him with a perfect heart and with a willing mind: for the LORD searcheth all hearts, and understandeth all the imaginations of the thoughts: if thou seek him, he will be found of thee; but if thou forsake him, he will cast thee off for ever.

Rom 8:29 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

Why would God need to search for something he already knows?

 

[Skandelon]

Why do the scriptures repeatedly say God searches our heart?

Psa 139:23 Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts:

Jer 17:10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

Psa 44:21 Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart.

1 Chr 28:9 And thou, Solomon my son, know thou the God of thy father, and serve him with a perfect heart and with a willing mind: for the LORD searcheth all hearts, and understandeth all the imaginations of the thoughts: if thou seek him, he will be found of thee; but if thou forsake him, he will cast thee off for ever.

Rom 8:29 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

Why would God need to search for something he already knows?

Knows? What about what he has predetermined, as most Calvinists affirm?

 

[ReformedBaptist]

If God foreknows all his own thoughts before thinking them how can He ever originate a new thought? Was God ever unknowing of a thought or intent prior to its being originated? If not, how did that thought ever originate?

Could it be that our finite linear thinking and speculations fall short when speaking of God's foreknowledge and its necessity of being predeterminate in nature?

Weird question to me, but here goes. I hardly think either the Calvinist or Non-Calvinist disagree that God the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are eternal. If we are thinking in terms of God's thoughts/intelligence, then we could think in terms of the Logos/Word.

Any thought the Lord would have He would have had from all eternity. There is no origination with God in any respect, as best I can tell.

 

[Robert Snow]

I am not sure that our understanding of time and knowledge apply at all to God. He is so far above or beyond these human constraints that it is impossible for us to understand at all the workings of God and His abilities.

I am a machinist, and I was talking to a Metallurgist friend one time. I asked him why stainless steel was not magnetic. After a couple of minutes of listening to him talk, I told him to stop. It was beyond my comprehension at the time to even get a slight grasp of what he was talking about.

Now, considering that God is infinitely more complex, it is way beyond our ability to even get a small understanding of God and His attributes. We must take by faith what He revels in His Word!

 

[Winman]

I am not sure that our understanding of time and knowledge apply at all to God. He is so far above or beyond these human constraints that it is impossible for us to understand at all the workings of God and His abilities.

I am a machinist, and I was talking to a Metallurgist friend one time. I asked him why stainless steel was not magnetic. After a couple of minutes of listening to him talk, I told him to stop. It was beyond my comprehension at the time to even get a slight grasp of what he was talking about.

Now, considering that God is infinitely more complex, it is way beyond our ability to even get a small understanding of God and His attributes. We must take by faith what He revels in His Word!

The answer is permeability.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permeability_(electromagnetism)

I don't know why that opens to the wrong page, you have to click on it again when you get there.

This is what I do for a living. Looks complex doesn't it? It's not.

 

[Arbo]

I am not sure that our understanding of time and knowledge apply at all to God. He is so far above or beyond these human constraints that it is impossible for us to understand at all the workings of God and His abilities.

I am a machinist, and I was talking to a Metallurgist friend one time. I asked him why stainless steel was not magnetic. After a couple of minutes of listening to him talk, I told him to stop. It was beyond my comprehension at the time to even get a slight grasp of what he was talking about.

Now, considering that God is infinitely more complex, it is way beyond our ability to even get a small understanding of God and His attributes. We must take by faith what He revels in His Word!

Spot on, RS.

Off topic, but have you ever sent a newbie looking for the brass magnet at work? That was a classic at the shop I once worked at. :smilewinkgrin:

 

[Winman]

Spot on, RS.

Off topic, but have you ever sent a newbie looking for the brass magnet at work? That was a classic at the shop I once worked at. :smilewinkgrin:

We do worse, we have sent newbies after glass and ceramic magnets! :laugh:

 

[Robert Snow]

Spot on, RS.

Off topic, but have you ever sent a newbie looking for the brass magnet at work? That was a classic at the shop I once worked at. :smilewinkgrin:

No, we don't have any newbies anymore, but I do remember a welder sending a helper for a wooden welding rod one time. :laugh:

 

[Luke2427]

If God foreknows all his own thoughts before thinking them how can He ever originate a new thought? Was God ever unknowing of a thought or intent prior to its being originated? If not, how did that thought ever originate?

Could it be that our finite linear thinking and speculations fall short when speaking of God's foreknowledge and its necessity of being predeterminate in nature?

God has no new thoughts. He never has to consider anything. Any language to the contrary is CLEARLY anthropomorphic.

God has no new thoughts. He has always known all there is to ever know.

 

[Skandelon]

God has no new thoughts.

Says who? Scripture? See how you speculate beyond the words of the text to appease your finite mind?

Any language to the contrary is CLEARLY anthropomorphic.

Yet, such qualifications are not offered by the authors of scripture, but they originate in the minds of men whose pride of intellect supersedes their submission to what God has clearly chosen to reveal.

 

[righteousdude2]

I Would Think So . . .

. . . Not to believe that God can originate a thought is to place Him in a box. All the miracles that He performed in the Bible and the words that the authors penned on each page of each book in the Bible demonstrates to me His ability to "originate thoughts, within us." :thumbs:

Even if we were to believe that nothing is left to chance in the mind of God, we must remember, that man does not know anything until the Father, through His Spirit, speaks those thoughts into our heart and mind and essentially existence itself. If He knows what tomorrow holds, He still has to let us know what His plan is for us individually and collectively!

I guess the answer will have to wait until we gather in Heaven to rejoice, worship, and praise Him around the Throne itself!

Pastor Paul

 

[Skandelon]

God has no new thoughts.

Going back to a previous conversation regarding the origin of the thought of the child rapists/murderer. In your view nothing is "revealed" to God through the concept of foreknowing it...or being informed before hand. Nothing informs God in your view, not even his foreknowledge. So in your view the heinous rape and murdering of children originated (or it eternally existed) within the mind of God, which is clearly unbiblical in every respect. But, no doubt you will continue to hold on to it for the sake of finite human logic.

 

[Luke2427]

Says who? Scripture? See how you speculate beyond the words of the text to appease your finite mind?

I'll support it with Scripture as soon as you answer this question:

Do you deny the doctrine of God's omniscience???

In other words, do you believe there was ever a time that God did not know everything there ever was to know??

 

[Skandelon]

I'll support it with Scripture as soon as you answer this question:

Do you deny the doctrine of God's omniscience???

In other words, do you believe there was ever a time that God did not know everything there ever was to know??

See, the question itself reveals the root of your problem brother. Let me reword it to reveal your folly: "Was there ever a time that a timeless being did not ... "

Such a question presumes a finite answer is required and if proffered would somehow suffice. Such speculation is absurd at its best and heretical at its worse. Why not allow scripture to speak for itself...even the "anthropomorphic" parts?