Mental illness and the Baptist Chuch

[Scarlett O.]

I am going to watch the video to see what it says. At this point I do believe that most so called mental illness is because of sin not being dealt with.

Schizophrenia is not a sin!! The woman at my church who suffers from it is a truly Godly woman.

Being bi-polar is not a sin!! My student who was born with this mental issue did not sin by being born.

Depression is not a sin!! The couple at my church who lost their son in Iraq and almost lost their marriage over this due to the husband's severe bout with depression were NOT sinning. He got help and has recovered.

 

[freeatlast]

In the 29 years that I have taught school, I have had two bi-polar middle school students. I currently have one of them now. Bi-polar (manic-depression) is reality whether you choose to acknowedge it or not. So is schizophrenia. I've seen it in one adult. Depression is real. When the hormones change, traumatic events occure, or we experience physical ailments, it can indeed affect the thinking patterns and the mind.

Do you believe in cancer? Heart disease? Diabetes? Our bodies, from our heads to our feet, are in a state of deterioration from the moment that we are born. And ... our DNA and genetic make-up since the fall of Adam and Eve are compounded with mutations and flaws.

People get sick. In the body and in the mind. Sometimes they are born this way - like my current bi-polar student. His mother was a drug addict and alcoholic. Sometimes the environment contributes to our sicknesses.

Just like physical ailments, mental ailments can be treated with or without medications. Therapies help, counseling can help, lifestyle changes can help, spiritual growth can help, and prayer can help.

But to throw the baby out with the bathwater and claim that mental illnesses do not exist is deny what can be seen every day.

Let me ask a question about that. Is the conditions you mentioned impossible for the person to deal with or is it just difficult? By impossible I mean they do not know what they are doing and cannot do anything about it.

 

[freeatlast]

Schizophrenia is not a sin!! The woman at my church who suffers from it is a truly Godly woman.

Being bi-polar is not a sin!! My student who was born with this mental issue did not sin by being born.

Depression is not a sin!! The couple at my church who lost their son in Iraq and almost lost their marriage over this due to the husband's severe bout with depression were NOT sinning. He got help and has recovered.

But they could be caused by sin, correct?

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Psychiatrists who should have their licenses taken away.

The ones that "need their licenses taken away" are the ones who prescribe mind altering drugs for illnesses that don't exist.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Let me ask a question about that. Is the conditions you mentioned impossible for the person to deal with or is it just difficult? By impossible I mean they do not know what they are doing and cannot do anything about it.

My young student who is bi-polar struggles to maintain his composure and temper sometimes. But he definitely knows right from wrong. He feels remorse and confesses that he needs help in controlling his thoughts and mindsets.

The meds help some and he does get counseling. But you can see the how hard some days are for him. My heart hurts for him. Some days he does well. Somedays he has to withdraw to keep from losing control.

 

[annsni]

The ones that "need their licenses taken away" are the ones who prescribe mind altering drugs for illnesses that don't exist.

If they prescribe drugs for something the patient does not have then yes, they should have their licenses taken away. But if they believe that mental illnesses don't exist, then they would be a proctologist - not a psychiatrist.

 

[Scarlett O.]

But they could be caused by sin, correct?

I suppose that depression could be caused by one's personal sin that they are not allowing God to deal with, yes. Christians who allow themselves to get into bondage of sin can definitely endure depression.

But there are so many more other factors that can be involved.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Like greedy psychiatrists who invent more and more "disorders" so as to make more and more money selling unneeded medications that are pushed by alleged "knowledgeable" pharaceutical companies

 

[annsni]

Or like the dear Christian man who was a psychiatrist for over 40 years who clearly saw that some mental illness was a result of sin and yet many were caused by chemical imbalances or brain deformities that were biological in nature just like diabetes or mental retardation.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Like greedy psychiatrists who invent more and more "disorders" so as to make more and more money selling unneeded medications that are pushed by alleged "knowledgeable" pharaceutical companies

Fred, are there overdiagnoses and over prescribing of meds for greed's sake in the realm of mental disorders? Of course, there are.

But there are overdiagnoses and over prescribing of meds for greed's sake in the realm of gastro-intestinal disorders, cardio disorders, and sleep disorders.

Good googly-moogly, just watch all the television commercials advertising the latest "wonder drug" for all KINDS of ailments. Then listen to all the side-effects and watch about six months later and you'll see all kinds of commericals from attorneys who will sue on your behalf if you took those meds.

Part of the medical industry -especially in the realm of medications - is booming business and money-making racket.

HOWEVER, one cannot discount the genuineness of quality and appropriate medications just because part of the industry is corrupt.

And one cannot claim that mental illnesses do not exist because part of the medical field is corrupt.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Tell you what Scarlett,

Go to any psychiatrist's office and ask them for definitive tests that prove chemical imbalances in the brain.

I can guarantee you, they will tell you they have none.

Ask them for proof that people have mental illness because of a chemical imbalance and all they can do is point as some poor soul who they have convinced is suffering from a mental illness and tell you there is your proof.

Yet they cannot produce any medical proof whatsoever... only their own opinions.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

I am going to watch the video to see what it says. At this point I do believe that most so called mental illness is because of sin not being dealt with.

The video is rather lengthy, but very informative. I encourage you to watch it.

It can be seen full length on youtube, if I remember correctly.

 

[seekingthetruth]

I have a theory as to why I was born with a mental illness.

My family is part white and part black. One of my gggrandfathers actually owned my other gggrandfather. Since my ancestors were mixed, they were not accepted in either the white nor the black community. So they hired a teacher, built a one room school house and stayed on the farm. (my father actually went to this school for 1st grade).

As a result of this isolation they married cousins. My grandmother and my grandfather were first coisins, and so were their parents.

When my dad was 14 my grandfather had terrible mood swings and headaches. One day in 1951 he came from the cotton feild at noon, beat up my grandmother, and then put a double shotgun to his forehead and pulled both triggers.....in front of the kids no less.

I have cousins that are mentally retarded, have dwarfism and my father and all of his 4 brothers, and all of his uncles were legally blind.

I am convinced that this was all genetically caused by the inbreeding, which is a sin.....but it was not my sin!

My illness is probably a result of this also. but again, it was not my sin!

Yes, there is a medical reason i am ill, and it has nothing to do with me being oppressed or having undealt with sin in my life.

OK FAL, i know you will jump on this with glee, so i am going to log off for the night.

John

 

[Scarlett O.]

Tell you what Scarlett,

Go to any psychiatrist's office and ask them for definitive tests that prove chemical imbalances in the brain.

I can guarantee you, they will tell you they have none.

Ask them for proof that people have mental illness because of a chemical imbalance and all they can do is point as some poor soul who they have convinced is suffering from a mental illness and tell you there is your proof.

Yet they cannot produce any medical proof whatsoever... only their own opinions.

Brother, you are the only one who has brought up the term "chemical imbalance". I don't think I mentioned that.

I don't know what's going on in the brain of all the people in my circle who have been diagnosed with a mental illness. I personally know less than a dozen. I just know that in most of the cases of people that I know personally, the medications do help somewhat in controlling impulses and reining in improper behavior.

There's so much we don't know. But I just can't dismiss meds altogether when I've seen it work. And I just can't dismiss the concept that something can be wrong with the mind that has nothing to do with sin - because I have been witness to it.

 

[agedman]

You are correct, I have never dealt with "mental illness". And I dare say I never shall... considering many psychiatrists admit there is no such thing as mental illness.

You obviously haven't been around qualified and Godly psychologists nor psychiatrists. I have never met one who was schooled in the medical and counseling arts that would make such a claim.

Some would state that "illness" isn't a correct term and attempt to place qualifiers such as disorder, challenged... but it remains part of the DSM and one who is schooled will have knowledge of the DSM III.

 

[Scarlett O.]

I have a theory as to why I was born with a mental illness......


John

Brother, marrying your cousin in not inbreeding nor is it a sin. The Bible is clear about what constitutes incest. And first cousins do not make the list.

Don't beat yourself up over this.

 

[Steadfast Fred]

Brother, you are the only one who has brought up the term "chemical imbalance". I don't think I mentioned that.

I don't know what's going on in the brain of all the people in my circle who have been diagnosed with a mental illness. I personally know less than a dozen. I just know that in most of the cases of people that I know personally, the medications do help somewhat in controlling impulses and reining in improper behavior.

There's so much we don't know. But I just can't dismiss meds altogether when I've seen it work. And I just can't dismiss the concept that something can be wrong with the mind that has nothing to do with sin - because I have been witness to it.

The reason I brought up "chemical imbalance" is because every quack psychiatrist that tells his or her patient that they suffer from a mental illness will tell them it is because of a chemical imbalance in the brain."

And not one has any proof whatsoever that what they claim is true.

 

[seekingthetruth]

Brother, marrying your cousin in not inbreeding nor is it a sin. The Bible is clear about what constitutes incest. And first cousins do not make the list.

Don't beat yourself up over this.

Well, something has caused some serious genetic deformities in our family over several generations.

John

 

[agedman]

Tell you what Scarlett,

Go to any psychiatrist's office and ask them for definitive tests that prove chemical imbalances in the brain.

I can guarantee you, they will tell you they have none.

Ask them for proof that people have mental illness because of a chemical imbalance and all they can do is point as some poor soul who they have convinced is suffering from a mental illness and tell you there is your proof.

Yet they cannot produce any medical proof whatsoever... only their own opinions.

Go to the doctor.

Ask if there is "definitive test" to show that your leg is broken. What will they do?

They may ex-ray, or MRI or catscan it. They may even examine outward signs and evident outbursts of emotion when the area is prodded.

But is there a blood or urine test for a broken leg?

There are for some mental illness. There are MRI scans that show the brain changes of certain mental disorders. Certain blood and urine tests also show various indicators.

As the medical and scientific community continue to improve testing procedures, the technology will help further diagnosis.

 

[jaigner]

But they could be caused by sin, correct?

No, unless you count the effect of sin on the cosmos.