The Wall Came Tumbling Down

[revmwc]

If you are going to be a pre-trib-dispensationalist you should learn the doctrine.

The Pastor I grew up under was pre-trib, pre-mill and he taught the wall as the veil rent from top to bottom. As were others teachers and Pastors I have been under. Seems you have some bad information from whatever your source is.

 

[OldRegular]

The Pastor I grew up under was pre-trib, pre-mill and he taught the wall as the veil rent from top to bottom. As were others teachers and Pastors I have been under. Seems you have some bad information from whatever your source is.

Scripture is not bad information! The veil simply separated the Holy Place from the Most Holy Place, as I have told you before, into which only the high priest could enter and then only once each year on the Day of Atonement. You might try reading Hebrews 9:1ff.

The veil may have broken the wall between the high priest and the low priests but it had nothing to do with the wall between Jew and Gentile regardless of what your pastors and teachers said. Again, you might try reading Hebrews 9:1ff.

 

[revmwc]

Scripture is not bad information! The veil simply separated the Holy Place from the Most Holy Place, as I have told you before, into which only the high priest could enter and then only once each year on the Day of Atonement. You might try reading Hebrews 9:1ff.

The veil may have broken the wall between the high priest and the low priests but it had nothing to do with the wall between Jew and Gentile regardless of what your pastors and teachers said. Again, you might try reading Hebrews 9:1ff.

The veil being rent represented all mankind being able to access God at anytime. First for salvation but also to practice 1 John 1:9. The Atonement Sacrifice was for the believers to offer a sacrifice for the atonement of their sins from year to year. When the Atoning Sacrifice Jesus offered Himself for mankinds sin the yerly offering ceased and we now represent ourselves to God and that is what the veil being rent shows us and that is the middle wall of partition that Paul says was torn down. Nothing to do with Jew and Gentile, the Gentile Proselyte offered the same sacrifice to atone for his sin and went through the same priest. They had to remain in the outer court. Now Jew and Gentile alike have the same atoning sacrifice nothing changed except bot now may approach God without a priest representing them. Nothing changes in the Tribulation from today except the Holy Spirit is removed as Paul said. In the Kingdom they can approach Christ in His Resurrection body as He sits upon David's throne in Israel as the O.T. Prophets foretold.

 

[OldRegular]

The veil being rent represented all mankind being able to access God at anytime. First for salvation but also to practice 1 John 1:9. The Atonement Sacrifice was for the believers to offer a sacrifice for the atonement of their sins from year to year. When the Atoning Sacrifice Jesus offered Himself for mankinds sin the yerly offering ceased and we now represent ourselves to God and that is what the veil being rent shows us and that is the middle wall of partition that Paul says was torn down. Nothing to do with Jew and Gentile, the Gentile Proselyte offered the same sacrifice to atone for his sin and went through the same priest. They had to remain in the outer court. Now Jew and Gentile alike have the same atoning sacrifice nothing changed except bot now may approach God without a priest representing them. Nothing changes in the Tribulation from today except the Holy Spirit is removed as Paul said. In the Kingdom they can approach Christ in His Resurrection body as He sits upon David's throne in Israel as the O.T. Prophets foretold.

Believe what you will but it is just one more false belief you have!

 

[revmwc]

Believe what you will but it is just one more false belief you have!

So where do you get your information that it is Jew and Gentile wall? The Bible and especially Paul make it clear it isn't but you insist it is. Where did you develop your view form what source?

 

[OldRegular]

So where do you get your information that it is Jew and Gentile wall? The Bible and especially Paul make it clear it isn't but you insist it is. Where did you develop your view form what source?

I got it from Ephesians 2:11-22 which is presented in the OP. You might try reading it!

Ephesians 2:11-22
11. Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12. That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13. But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14.For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15. Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16. And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
17. And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
18. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
19. Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20. And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
21. In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22. In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Notice in particular Verse 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

It is really very clear if you remove the blinders of dispensationalism.

 

[revmwc]

I got it from Ephesians 2:11-22 which is presented in the OP. You might try reading it!

Ephesians 2:11-22
11. Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12. That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13. But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14.For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15. Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16. And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
17. And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
18. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
19. Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20. And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
21. In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
22. In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Notice in particular Verse 15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

It is really very clear if you remove the blinders of dispensationalism.

Matthew Henry,

"He broke down the middle wall of partition, the ceremonial law, that made the great feud, and was the badge of the Jews' peculiarity, called the partition-wall by way of allusion to the partition in the temple, which separated the court of the Gentiles from that into which the Jews only had liberty to enter. Thus he abolished in his flesh the enmity, Ephesians 2:15. By his sufferings in the flesh, to took away the binding power of the ceremonial law (so removing that cause of enmity and distance between them), which is here called the law of commandments contained in ordinances, because it enjoined a multitude of external rites and ceremonies, and consisted of many institutions and appointments about the outward parts of divine worship. The legal ceremonies were abrogated by Christ, having their accomplishment in him. By taking these out of the way, he formed one church of believers, whether they had been Jews or Gentiles. Thus he made in himself of twain one new man. He framed both these parties into one new society, or body of God's people, uniting them to himself as their common head, they being renewed by the Holy Ghost, and now concurring in a new way of gospel worship, so making peace between these two parties, who were so much at variance before. 2. There is an enmity between God and sinners, whether Jews and Gentiles and Christ came to slay that enmity, and to reconcile them both to God, Ephesians 2:16."

Henry supports this as being the Law that seperated them. Both parties now able to worship Him as individual believers whether Jew or Gentile.

 

[OldRegular]

Matthew Henry,

"He broke down the middle wall of partition, the ceremonial law, that made the great feud, and was the badge of the Jews' peculiarity, called the partition-wall by way of allusion to the partition in the temple, which separated the court of the Gentiles from that into which the Jews only had liberty to enter. Thus he abolished in his flesh the enmity, Ephesians 2:15. By his sufferings in the flesh, to took away the binding power of the ceremonial law (so removing that cause of enmity and distance between them), which is here called the law of commandments contained in ordinances, because it enjoined a multitude of external rites and ceremonies, and consisted of many institutions and appointments about the outward parts of divine worship. The legal ceremonies were abrogated by Christ, having their accomplishment in him. By taking these out of the way, he formed one church of believers, whether they had been Jews or Gentiles. Thus he made in himself of twain one new man. He framed both these parties into one new society, or body of God's people, uniting them to himself as their common head, they being renewed by the Holy Ghost, and now concurring in a new way of gospel worship, so making peace between these two parties, who were so much at variance before. 2. There is an enmity between God and sinners, whether Jews and Gentiles and Christ came to slay that enmity, and to reconcile them both to God, Ephesians 2:16."

Henry supports this as being the Law that seperated them. Both parties now able to worship Him as individual believers whether Jew or Gentile.

Henry says nothing of the veil separating the Holy place from the most Ho;y Place as you claim was the wall broken down. You might read what Spurgeon has to say about the rending of the Veil! {http://spurgeon.org/sermons/2015.htm}

 

[Iconoclast]

Truth is you are too clever for your own good. The OP tells when the wall was broken. revmwc understands when it was broken. You are so impressed with your own ego that you refuse to understand anything that does not stroke your ego.

:laugh::laugh::laugh::thumbsup: Different thread, same nonsense

 

[Iconoclast]

Believe what you will but it is just one more false belief you have!

:wavey::applause::applause::wavey:

 

[OldRegular]

The veil being rent represented all mankind being able to access God at anytime.

The rending of the veil represented the abolition of the sacrificial system given to Moses. There has always been only one mediator between God and men, Jesus Christ. Man has always has direct access to GOD. Understand that before the flood there were believers in GOD and after the flood and prior to Abraham there were believers in GOD. You do know about the King of Salem to whom Abraham paid tithes! Don't you?