'Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved'

[Internet Theologian]

Please quote where he did. He can't. He would be bearing false witness, as you are now.

Actually I did the quoting, and no, I'm not lying my friend.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

I'd like to move on now by suggesting that to believe in closely associated with action- doing something and with obedience.

Gen. 12:1. 'The LORD had said to Abram, "Leave your country, your people and you father's household and go to the land that I will show you."' There follow various promises concerning Abraham. In Hebrews 11:8 we read, 'By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive......' How would it have been if Abraham had said to himself, "I really believe that God wants me to leave Ur and go out into the wilderness," and then stayed exactly where he was? What sort of faith would that have been? He believed, he obeyed and he acted. Most of the heroes of faith in Heb. 11 are people who went out and did something.

If I were to announce on this board that all next week, Walmart are selling $10 bills for a dime each, and tell you, "Grab a load of dimes and hurry down to Walmart on Monday morning," what would be the evidence that you believe me? Surely it would be if you turned up at Walmart with a barrow-load of dime coins? Your belief in what I said would have been proved by your obedience in following my advice, and your action in changing your life savings into dimes. Alas, your faith would be sorely misplaced, but I hope you get the point. Hence we read in Rom. 16:26 of 'the obedience of (or 'to the') faith.'

Now we read in Heb. 3:19, concerning the Israelites failure to enter the promised land that 'They could not enter in because of unbelief.' What does this mean? It means surely that these Israelites missed Caanan because of their failure to appropriate the promise of God.(Exod. 3:16-17). But there is more to it than that. In Deut. 1:26, Moses declares, "Nevertheless, you would not go up, but rebelled against the command of the LORD your God." So here we have a failure to believe, closely associated with disobedience and a lack of action.

It is worth noting that the Greek word apeitheia is translated 'unbelief' in Heb. 4:6, and 'disobedience' in Eph. 2:2 & 5:6. Likewise the verb form apeitheo is translated 'did not believe' in Heb. 11:31, and 'do not obey' in 1 Peter 3:1; 4:17.

Therefore it is quite wrong to suggest that one can be a 'believer' without a full-hearted (though not prefect in this life) obedience to God's word. "Why do you call Me, Lord, Lord, and not do what I say?"

 

[Internet Theologian]

I'd like to move on now by suggesting that to believe in closely associated with action- doing something and with obedience.

Gen. 12:1. 'The LORD had said to Abram, "Leave your country, your people and you father's household and go to the land that I will show you."' There follow various promises concerning Abraham. In Hebrews 11:8 we read, 'By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive......' How would it have been if Abraham had said to himself, "I really believe that God wants me to leave Ur and go out into the wilderness," and then stayed exactly where he was? What sort of faith would that have been? He believed, he obeyed and he acted. Most of the heroes of faith in Heb. 11 are people who went out and did something.

If I were to announce on this board that all next week, Walmart are selling $10 bills for a dime each, and tell you, "Grab a load of dimes and hurry down to Walmart on Monday morning," what would be the evidence that you believe me? Surely it would be if you turned up at Walmart with a barrow-load of dime coins? Your belief in what I said would have been proved by your obedience in following my advice, and your action in changing your life savings into dimes. Alas, your faith would be sorely misplaced, but I hope you get the point. Hence we read in Rom. 16:26 of 'the obedience of (or 'to the') faith.'

Now we read in Heb. 3:19, concerning the Israelites failure to enter the promised land that 'They could not enter in because of unbelief.' What does this mean? It means surely that these Israelites missed Caanan because of their failure to appropriate the promise of God.(Exod. 3:16-17). But there is more to it than that. In Deut. 1:26, Moses declares, "Nevertheless, you would not go up, but rebelled against the command of the LORD your God." So here we have a failure to believe, closely associated with disobedience and a lack of action.

It is worth noting that the Greek word apeitheia is translated 'unbelief' in Heb. 4:6, and 'disobedience' in Eph. 2:2 & 5:6. Likewise the verb form apeitheo is translated 'did not believe' in Heb. 11:31, and 'do not obey' in 1 Peter 3:1; 4:17.

Therefore it is quite wrong to suggest that one can be a 'believer' without a full-hearted (though not prefect in this life) obedience to God's word. "Why do you call Me, Lord, Lord, and not do what I say?"

Note post #134 brother on addressing whether one has claimed repentance is not necessary for salvation. I've provided proof there.

Also here it is said by dhk as well:

Hank understood what you fellows did not understand. In the gospels John the Baptist preached repentance. That is not the gospel message of today. Thus I issued a challenge: Without using the Gospels or the Book of Acts, show from the epistles that repentance is part of the gospel. Where in the epistles does it say one must repent to be saved?

https://www.baptistboard.com/threads/salvation-minus-repentance-equals-salvation.66981/

Here is Dr. Bob on repentance:

Had a teen once say, "I want to get saved but I don't want to repent of anything."

I told him he was out of luck. To say "I want to . . . " and then lay conditions out (I'll only repent of this or that) would not even get a plea bargain on Law & Order.

It doesn't show "good faith". And repentance is, after all, the flip side of true faith. Turning FROM sin TO Christ.

He nails it. https://www.baptistboard.com/threads/repentance-do-we-still-preach-it.26312/

 

[percho]

We have already received it, just like we have already received salvation. And yet at the same time salvation won't be complete until glorification is completed. This analogy holds true for adoption as well.

We were adopted as mature sons the day that we were regenerated. But the scripture also says "we have received the "spirit of adoption." Perhaps it is because we haven't been glorified yet. Nevertheless we have been adopted. In Romans 8, it is not just us, but the whole creation that awaits the coming of Christ.

The word "conversation" here means citizenship. We are citizens of heaven with all the rights and privileges thereof. Only one who has been adopted into that nation could avail himself of those rights and privileges.


The adoption has taken place but has not yet been fully completed.

Just two questions.

Have we presently received, the adoption or have presently received, Spirit of adoption?

YLT Rom 8:23 And not only so, but also we ourselves, having the first-fruit of the Spirit (of adoption), we also ourselves in ourselves do groan, adoption expecting -- the redemption of our body;

Is it totally in error by context to insert (of adoption) there?

 

[percho]

My appologies, I didn't know the post had already been responded, too.


1 John 3:

Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is. And everyone who has this hope fixed on Him purifies himself, just as He is pure.​

Romans 8:

"For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God...."
"The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him." ​

Ok, there is enough to show that it is not some future estate of adoption, but the present condition that all believers abide. We are God's own, His children.

We await for the final new in which we yet do not (as Paul states) know the form other than we shall be "like Him."

Why did Jesus use the analogy of human birth for born from above. What is required for a human, being? To be. Begotten and then birth, to be born.

Jesus, pre being brought forth.
τὸ γὰρ ἐν αὐτῇ γεννηθὲν, ἐκ Πνεύματός

the for in her conceived out of spirit - conceived, being generated, born? Was Jesus conceived and then born, brought forth. Again, why the analogy of the process of birth, if it is not a process? Do we receive spirit of adoption and await in hope, adoption, according to the word of God.

When will we be like him?
who is marked out Son of God in power, according to the Spirit of sanctification, by the rising again from the dead, ) Jesus Christ our Lord;

 

[percho]

Sorry for the rabbit trail, disregard my posts.

 

[Iconoclast]

So it is a Catechism. This is a debate forum. You quoting a Catechism to my answer shows your inability to respond to my post or answer to a post. It is not debate but rather the inability to debate. You never answered my post.

Your answers are so fragmented and confused, such a mix of error...it forces me to read real ,godly teachers who know what the scripture really says. They present it in an orderly gifted fashion.

I know They are more knowledgeable than I am , so In the interest of truth it is beneficial to all here for me to post the best teaching possible. The Lord teaches me many things, but I am not so full of myself that I will not learn from these godly men.

You should try that instead of remaining unteachable with a proud arrogant spirit, that you try and project on us.

Your response should have been....thank you for these fine Christ centered links that are loaded with many scripture verses that I have over-looked. I will gladly read and learn of my saviour things I lack.

 

[BrotherJoseph]

Please quote where he did. He can't. He would be bearing false witness, as you are now.

Brother DHK,

This is not really related to the topic, but being a moderator I thought you might know the answer to my questions, is the search forum tool now only enabled to go back to posts up until the time the baptistboard changed? I can't seem to find posts from say even a year ago and when I search my posts on my profile it doesn't seem to go back very far. Any help from you or others on the forum on if and how to search farther back would be appreciated.

 

[DHK]

Your answers are so fragmented and confused, such a mix of error...it forces me to read real ,godly teachers who know what the scripture really says. They present it in an orderly gifted fashion.

A short answer on repentance you could not answer so you had to post an entire Catechism?
So pitiful. It demonstrates a lack of debating skills.
Someone else has asked you the same basic question that I have:
Give one verse of scripture where God commands "repent of all your sins."
Demonstrate that repentance means "to repent of all your sins."
But you have not done that. Instead you assume that your erroneous definition is right than falsely accuse those who don't agree with the error as not believing in repentance. Don't you see that fallacy of your own thinking.

 

[Internet Theologian]

Brother DHK,

This is not really related to the topic, but being a moderator I thought you might know the answer to my questions, is the search forum tool now only enabled to go back to posts up until the time the baptistboard changed? I can't seem to find posts from say even a year ago and when I search my posts on my profile it doesn't seem to go back very far. Any help from you or others on the forum on if and how to search farther back would be appreciated.

Google works better. If you can, search using your user name, a key phrase you may have used, and include 'baptistboard' then click enter. It's a bit tedious but you will be able to find what you are looking for in a few attempts.

 

[Iconoclast]

You guys want me to provide scripture for something that doesn't exist.

Since Icon has failed to do so, why don't you list where the Bible says one must "repent of your sins" in order to be saved?

ITL......we would like you to provide is scripture for anything....anything at all. Your complaint is we are not giving you scripture? Are you lazy like your friend and not reading the links...
HINT; the letters and numbers represent scripture verses,

ITL....seriously...I just glanced through the links I offered to to you,
there were 146+ scripture verses on the subject offered to you
post 96 -20vs
post 104>62vs
post 109>12vs
post 110 6vs
post 112 46 vs
....do you want me to drive to Minnesota and hold your hand and read through them together ???
I can explain what they mean???

I thought i demonstrated this to you already....
In 1 thess 1 we read this; How they turned.... to God... from Idols

Idolatry is sin
they turned to God....from Idols{sin}
to serve the living God....

The word repentance is not used in the passage....the action describes exactly all the elements of Godly repentance......a change of mind to toward God, a change of mind towards sin, a change of mind toward godly service...all enabled by God's grace.

 

[JamesL]

My appologies, I didn't know the post had already been responded, too.


1 John 3:

Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is. And everyone who has this hope fixed on Him purifies himself, just as He is pure.​

Romans 8:

"For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God...."
"The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, heirs also, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him so that we may also be glorified with Him." ​

Ok, there is enough to show that it is not some future estate of adoption, but the present condition that all believers abide. We are God's own, His children.

We await for the final new in which we yet do not (as Paul states) know the form other than we shall be "like Him."

What those scriptures state plainly is that those who believe upon Christ are children, and thereby HAVE the Spirit.

Then, AFTER receiving the Spirit, those who are LED BY the Spirit are sons.

There is nowhere stated any inevitability that the children will mature into sons

 

[BrotherJoseph]

Google works better. If you can, search using your user name, a key phrase you may have used, and include 'baptistboard' then click enter. It's a bit tedious but you will be able to find what you are looking for in a few attempts.

Thanks!

 

[DHK]

Note post #134 brother on addressing whether one has claimed repentance is not necessary for salvation. I've provided proof there.

What proof. Does he say that repentance is not necessary? No.

Also here it is said by dhk as well:

Don't bear false witness. Read carefully what I said.
https://www.baptistboard.com/threads/salvation-minus-repentance-equals-salvation.66981/

Here is Dr. Bob on repentance:

He nails it. https://www.baptistboard.com/threads/repentance-do-we-still-preach-it.26312/[/QUOTE]
You have a hard time with comprehension. No one here has denied repentance, only your understanding of it.

 

[BrotherJoseph]

ITL......we would like you to provide is scripture for anything....anything at all. Your complaint is we are not giving you scripture? Are you lazy like your friend and not reading the links...
HINT; the letters and numbers represent scripture verses,

ITL....seriously...I just glanced through the links I offered to to you,
there were 146+ scripture verses on the subject offered to you
post 96 -20vs
post 104>62vs
post 109>12vs
post 110 6vs
post 112 46 vs
....do you want me to drive to Minnesota and hold your hand and read through them together ???
I can explain what they mean???

I thought i demonstrated this to you already....
In 1 thess 1 we read this; How they turned.... to God... from Idols

Idolatry is sin
they turned to God....from Idols{sin}
to serve the living God....

The word repentance is not used in the passage....the action describes exactly all the elements of Godly repentance......a change of mind to toward God, a change of mind towards sin, a change of mind toward godly service...all enabled by God's grace.

Brother Icon,

Do you believe one repents to become born again or repents because he has become born again?

 

[Iconoclast]

The verse is speaking of the new birth or regeneration, not adoption.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he the right to become children of God, even to them that believe on his name: (ASV)
--The word "tekna" is more accurately translated "children" meaning sons and daughters.
It is speaking about those who become part of the family of God through means of the new birth, not by adoption.

All of the tekna are tekna by election and adoption ....everyone of them

 

[Iconoclast]

Brother Icon,

Do you believe one repents to become born again or repents because he has become born again?

Hello Brother
I believe God grants repentance and faith at regeneration. When God enables a dead sinner to come to life that sinner is granted these graces as the Spirit quickens him to life, enabling saving faith and saving repentance to be then exercised by the believing sinner, who from that point forth, believes and continues to believe, he repents and continues to repent of sin until glorified!!!

 

[Internet Theologian]

What proof. Does he say that repentance is not necessary? No.

What do you mean 'Does 'he' say...?' I quoted YOU, so you are 'he'. It is clear that you stated it is not a part of the Gospel.

Here is only PART of what YOU said:

Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance? (Romans 2:4)
--This does not say that one has to repent in order to be saved.

And more:

Where in the epistles does it say to repent in order to get saved?

Any person can go back and read what you said and see it in context. There is more as well. But we have the playing of games, you want exact wording 'repentance isn't necessary' while any common person can see that is what you said without it being a word for word quote. Just look up at what I quoted.

 

[DHK]

All of the tekna are tekna by election and adoption ....everyone of them

Don't bring election into this. It is not a thread on Calvinism. Election was done in eternity past and thus has no bearing on the present.
Both adoption and regeneration take place simultaneously, at the point of salvation.
Just as salvation has 3 parts to it and will not be completed until glorification takes place so it is with adoption.
We wait for the redemption of our bodies.

Rom 8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
We wait for the adoption and the redemption to be completed. Scripture is quite clear on this.

 

[Internet Theologian]

That is the worst butchering of interpreting how the Bereans treated scripture that I've ever heard of. Breathtaking!

Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men corrupted in mind and disqualified regarding the faith.
2 Timothy 3:8 ESV

So, you're saying I'm unsaved because I don't buy into your Calvinist theology.

Sent from my Motorola Droid Turbo using Tapatalk.

Nope, I never said nor did I imply you are unsaved. But what is seen is your contempt for me and my alleged 'Calvinist theology'.

Nothing I said had one thing to do with Calvinism.

If you think that my treatment of Acts 17:11 (below) is butchering Scripture then that is just sad on your account.

Here is what I stated prior to the post being deleted for being reported as calling your salvation into question, which didn't happen at all.

Here is exactly what I said concerning Acts 17:11:

'In Acts 17:11 rest assured these did not look for word for word passages to match the exact thing word for word of what Paul stated. Instead they were able to deduce from Scripture the things he claimed were true. In other words they graduated from being babes needing proof texts to the matured right handling of the Word, 2 Timothy 2:15.'

My argument above stands and is sound reasoning of Scripture. This to rebut your convenient excuse to find a word for word verse that shows repentance is in fact from ones sin which is an absurd and shallow request.