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The Words Of Jesus

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by Rippon, Dec 15, 2015.

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  1. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    I had mentioned this in another thread. At Thanksgiving I received Jesus, In His Own Words by Robert H. Mounce. The book is "an account of the life and ministry of Jesus that combines all four Gospels into a single narrative and allows Jesus himself to tell us the story."

    So I think it would be good to give some samples. I will start with a few of the parables of Jesus.

    The Parable Of The Seed Growing Secretly

    "Here is another parable to help you understand what the kingdom of God is like.
    "It is like a man who scatters seed in a field. Then during the day while he is busy with his chores as well as at night while he is sleeping, the seeds sprout and begin to grow. The man doesn't understand how it it all happens; but the soil, all on its own, produces the crop --first the tender shoot, then the head, and in time the head full of grain. When the grain is ripe, the man takes his sickle and begins to reap because harvest time has come." (Mark 4:26-29)

    The Parable Of The Mustard Seed

    I asked, "So what is the kingdom of God like? To what can I compare it so that it will be simple enough for you to understand?
    "The kingdom of heaven is like a mustard seed which was planted in a garden. It is like a mustard seed which was planted in a garden. It is the smallest of all the seeds, yet when planted and fully grown, it becomes the largest bush in the garden, a veritable tree with branches so large that the birds of the air come and make their nests in its shade." (Matt. 13:31-32; Mark 4:30-32; Luke 13:18-19)

    The Parable Of The Fermented Dough

    I asked again, "What else is there to which I can compare the kingdom of God? It is like fermented dough which a woman took and worked into a bushel of flour until the whole batch had risen." (Matt. 13:33; Luke 13:20-21)
     
    #1 Rippon, Dec 15, 2015
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  2. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I appreciate many of his commentaries (and I remember watching his son lecture when I was in seminary), but I am not certain that I like the idea of pulling the "words of Jesus" from the narrative itself. One thing that concerns me are those who put more weight on the words in red. But my concerns may very well be misplaced. The parables that you post here spoken in the first person do speak directly at us as the audience and I like the directness that this conveys.

    I'll have to check it out.
     
    #2 JonC, Dec 15, 2015
  3. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    A few hours after I made my OP I thought some would mistakenly think I value the words of Jesus over the rest of Holy Writ. No, I don't. I'm not a red-letter Christian. But I do like the perspective that Mounce takes here.
     
    #3 Rippon, Dec 15, 2015
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  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    We've communicated enough that I knew it didn't apply to you, but it was the first thing that came to my mind concerning the book itself. Considering your recommendation and the author, I will probably add the book to my want list.
     
    #4 JonC, Dec 15, 2015
  5. StFrancis

    StFrancis Member

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    I am concerned about the parables since my definition quotes simplicity. Talk about the eucalyptus tree seed and a fully grown tree. It does not talk about the grownup trees but the seeds. That is how we should simply grow to enter heaven. We come from simple backgrounds but we can go far. I really like the parables.
     
    #5 StFrancis, Jan 10, 2016
  6. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    The Distessaron was an early work that attempted to correlate the gospels. I wonder if Mounce took a similar path.

    Jesus' words were written by the author of the gospels some years after they were spoken. They were recorded with intent, to convey the author's purpose for his gospel. Pulling Jesus' words from their context, particularly the parables, makes interpretation problematic. Mounce wouldn't be unaware of this.

    Rob
     
    #6 Deacon, Jan 10, 2016
  7. Internet Theologian

    Internet Theologian Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking the book would provide an interesting setting. Rippon do you see it as taking the parables out of context and making them more difficult to interpret? (I've always thought of them as having their own context within themselves.)
     
    #7 Internet Theologian, Jan 10, 2016
  8. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    I agree with you. They're kind of stand-alone units.
     
    #8 Rippon, Jan 10, 2016
  9. Internet Theologian

    Internet Theologian Well-Known Member

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    I see. It is 304 pages in length, so it has a decent length to it. Looks like a must read so I will pick it up, Lord willing at some point, sounds enjoyable.
     
    #9 Internet Theologian, Jan 10, 2016
  10. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    My edition is 270 pages (not counting the index).
     
    #10 Rippon, Jan 10, 2016
  11. Internet Theologian

    Internet Theologian Well-Known Member

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    Then I'll buy 'the shorter one', it'll save me 34 pages lol...Geek
     
    #11 Internet Theologian, Jan 10, 2016
  12. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    "He Who Has Ears To Hear, Let Him Hear"
    "No one lights a lamp and then covers it with a basket or puts it under the bed. Lamps are to be put on lamp stands so that those who enter the room may see. Nothing is hidden that will not in time be brought out into the open or covered that will not be be made known and brought to light.
    "Take heen what you hear; the measure you use for others will be the measure God uses for you, and he will give you even more. For to those who have, more will be given; but from those who have nothing, even the little they think they have will be taken away."
    (Mark 4:21-25;Luke 8:16-18).
     
    #12 Rippon, Jan 10, 2016
  13. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Mounce simply puts the words of Jesus in the historical order he feels is accurate while (1) acknowledging synoptic discrepancies, ("All of this is to say that scholars hold different opinions regarding a number of items that surface when the four gospels are compared. I've used my best judgement as a guide…" Introduction) and (2) minimizing its historical context ("Here and there throughout the translation, I have added a phrase or sentence that provides historical or cultural context." Mounce, Introduction).

    Mounce has a good reputation as a scholar but I'd place this alongside Chronological Bibles as a curiosity to be critically examined.

    Rob
     
    #13 Deacon, Jan 10, 2016
  14. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    That is a good point also, Rob. If we simply examine the parables as stand-alone illustrations apart from the context of both the NT narrative and its 1st century setting then we risk the chance of misapplying or misinterpreting the parables all together. Perhaps the author's intent was that this book supplement and contribute to to our studies.
     
    #14 JonC, Jan 10, 2016
  15. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    Here I will compare the NIV rendering with Mounce's free version in snips:

    John 1:6
    NIV : There was a man sent from God
    Mounce : At a crucial point in time, there came a man.

    John 1:12
    N : to those who believed in his name
    M : to those who believe I really am who I claim to be.

    John 1:14
    N : The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us
    M : I became a human being and lived like others

    Luke 1:15
    N : he will be great in the sight of the Lord
    M : he will be great as God counts greatness

    Luke 1:17
    N : he will go on before the Lord, in the spirit and power of Elijah
    M : Prior to the coming of the Lord, he will break onto the scene with the spirit and authority of the prophet Elijah

    Luke 1:17
    N : to make ready a people prepared for the Lord
    M : to prepare for the Lord a nation ready for his coming

    Luke 1:19
    N : I stand in the presence of God
    M : I have direct access to God

    Luke 1:20
    N : And now you will be silent and not able to speak until the day this happens, because you did not believe my words, which will come true at their appointed time.
    M : But now, because you did not accept without question what I said --and my words will come true at the appointed time --you will be unable to speak until the child is born.

    Luke 1:34
    N : How will this be...since I am a virgin?
    M : How could I become pregnant...since I won't be living with Joseph as his wife prior to the marriage ceremony?

    Luke 12:26
    N : Since you cannot do this very little thing, why do you worry about the rest?
    M : If you can't manage a little thing like that, why waste your time worrying about bigger things?


     
    #15 Rippon, Mar 13, 2018
  16. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    "The one who proves trustworthy in little things will also be trustworthy in more important matters. And whoever cheats when
    it doesn't matter will also cheat when it does. So if you haven't been trustworthy in handling worldly wealth, how can you be trusted with the wealth of heaven. And if you haven't been trustworthy in this life with what God has given, how can he trust you with more in the life to come?" (Luke 16:10-12)
     
    #16 Rippon, May 12, 2018
  17. rlvaughn

    rlvaughn Well-Known Member
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    As a tool of difference, this might wake us up to notice and think about some things we miss. But overall I don't like the title/concept of "Jesus, in his own words" since I think the one given is the one actually "in his own words" the way inspiration intended.

    I looked for some reviews, but only came up with this one.
     
    #17 rlvaughn, May 14, 2018
  18. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    Here's how it's rendered in the NLT:

    "If you are faithful in little things, you will be faithful in large ones. But if you are dishonest in little things, you won't be honest with greater responsibilities. And if you are untrustworthy about worldly wealth, who will trust you with the true riches of heaven? And if you are not faithful with other people's things, who should you be trusted with things of your own?
     
    #18 Rippon, May 14, 2018
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