Jacob Sheep

[Benjamin]

I've been checking into getting some sheep, mostly for novelty and weed eating on 5 acres, and came across these which are available about 2 hours drive away. I'm not sure if they are really the same breed as in Genesis but they are growing on me and this add to the novelty.

Others are really playing this breed up as extremely rare and pedigreed back to Jacob biblical flock but all I know is they are available for $200-$400 nearby.

My wife shouldn't be too upset with just a couple showing up.

 

[Benjamin]

This guy speaks of “Jacob’s lost flock” and refers to his “biblical code expert” to sort the mystery out.

He makes an interesting point that these sheep have 2, 4, and 6 horns that can get pretty long and this would explain how the sheep got caught up in the bushes. He makes several other proof claims that I couldn’t even spell…

They ask for contributions to maintain “the Lost Flock of Israel”. They don’t raise them for milk or meat but only raise them just to “fulfill biblical prophesies” and you can name their baby lambs for $180 or for a lessor fee you can nickname the adults if you'd like to help out.

BTW, I don’t expect to be eating or milking mine either and if anyone is interested in naming my sheep I’m sure we can make a deal!

 

[Benjamin]

Well, contacted the breeder and they are going to have a good selection of Jacob Sheep babies to choose from in 2 months.

In the meantime, I'm a bit concerned about keeping coyotes off my sheep, they are like super defenseless. I understand an Alpaca will herd with them and protect them and I found a guy that is desperately trying to clear out his sick brother's herd and is making some real good deals. I would just take one but understand they get very upset if they are all alone so might have to get 2. I figure the wife should understand why this is necessary once she sees how cute and defenseless the sheep are.

 

[kyredneck]

Sheep babies

,,,the perfect time to get them acquainted with a sibling pair of Anatolian Shepherd babies. Then no worries about coyotes or dogs or wolves or bears or cheetahs.... we've two sisters that keep our free range chickens from harm, and they're most affectionate dogs if socialized from the beginning.

 

[kyredneck]

Piebold sheep, learned something today. You'd think with all those horns they could defend themselves at least a little.

 

[Benjamin]

,,,the perfect time to get them acquainted with a sibling pair of Anatolian Shepherd babies. Then no worries about coyotes or dogs or wolves or bears or cheetahs.... we've two sisters that keep our free range chickens from harm, and they're most affectionate dogs if socialized from the beginning.

The Anatolian Shepard sounds great for the job of protecting all the livestock on the property. I see there is 1/2 of a 12 weeks old litter nearby for $950 each but not sure I'd like the independence and I have 3 little dogs and one Dogo Argentino, which I used to be a rather well know breeder of Dogos, and this breed is able to deal with a coyote but this one needs to be kept in a fenced area within the property that has concrete under the fence to keep her from digging out and generally they are extremely high prey drive, killed all my chickens and any cat, bob cat, skunk, porcupine, javelina, wild dog pack, etc. that ever dared to come on the property so that is an issue. Although, the one I have left is a complete passive dork and I'm still mad at her for letting the coyotes take my Chihuahua without so much as a peep or chase. I've had other Dogos that wanted to hunt coyotes and were protective over whatever they considered part of the pack though and been planning a breeding with my line bred female to my neighbors Dogue de Bordeaux to get a big powerful trained coyote hating killer. Some of her line:

+ What the neighbor's looks like

= could create some interesting possibilities. I figure I can train the right pup for the job. But in the meantime...

Maybe 1 adult Alpaca for $150 (50 to choose from) could be happy enough to wait 2 months for his sheep herd friends.

 

[Benjamin]

Piebold sheep, learned something today. You'd think with all those horns they could defend themselves at least a little.

I said the same thing but understand they mostly just faint when attacked and don't even scream. A horned goat would probably be different story but they are nothing but trouble!

 

[kyredneck]

$950 each

Pricey. We lucked out 2 yrs ago and haggled for 2 eight wk old sisters from an 'unplanned' litter for $550 total. Kangals stands out in them.

3 little dogs and one Dogo Argentino, which I used to be a rather well know breeder of

...you sound like me, I've had [all kinds of] dogs all my life, and we've bred and sold Border Collies and Lhasa Apsos in the past. Rescued an Anatolian from the pound 15 yrs ago and fell in love with the breed. They're hardy, low maintenance, low supervision, (low energy until 'enegized' ), and very lovable family dogs.

concrete under the fence

A single strand of [solar] electrified wire along the bottom of the fence 12" off the ground is the way I went. VERY effective. Haven't needed to energize it for over a year. Once they learn their boundaries roaming is not a problem. And besides, that's why two dogs is preferred over a lone dog, they bond and keep one another company. We also have 2 ten yr old Papillion brothers. (grouchy old men)

goat would probably be different story but they are nothing but trouble!

I briefly considered getting into a combo of milk sheep and goats (had good connections to both) many years ago to keep my place 'mowed' but other priorities prevailed and I just let the hillsides go back to nature instead. No regrets. Low maintenance, low supervision, free ranging chickens love it .



​

 

[Benjamin]

...you sound like me, I've had [all kinds of] dogs all my life, and we've bred and sold Border Collies and Lhasa Apsos in the past. Rescued an Anatolian from the pound 15 yrs ago and fell in love with the breed. They're hardy, low maintenance, low supervision, (low energy until 'enegized' ), and very lovable family dogs.



A single strand of [solar] electrified wire along the bottom of the fence 12" off the ground is the way I went. VERY effective. Haven't needed to energize it for over a year. Once they learn their boundaries roaming is not a problem. And besides, that's why two dogs is preferred over a lone dog, they bond and keep one another company. We also have 2 ten yr old Papillion brothers. (grouchy old men)​

I've actually used electric wire for many years but have quite a few issues keeping it working although, there was a time that for the most part it contained a pack of 5 rowdy Dogo Argentinos for a few years. Had a lot of shorts from the wire coming into contact with my chain-link fence, I started with the wire high at about 12" and the dogs figured out to go low, I put the wire low and weeds got around it and shorted it. If super excited my crazy Dogos would just push the wire into the fence and short it out then dig under and bend the chain-link up (like the time they killed my neighbor's escaped 350lb hog ) and maintaining the gates connections was another issue, people were scared of them, didn't see the wire or hit it with the gate. My solar units just didn't have enough bite especially because of the how dry the ground gets in the summer, I had it hooked to 3 x 8' copper grounding rods and still getting a poor ground. I did have a big 10 mile capable electric unit that worked and lasted me pretty good for a few years.

Anyway, after my sweet little dog became a snack for the coyotes (She ran out the exercise room doogy-door one night and I followed within a minute but she was already gone, then I heard the coyotes celebrating out at my gate. My one Dogo was just standing there looking dumb.) I sealed off all the doggy-doors around the house except the laundry where I built a 50' x 80' pen up against the house that nothing was getting in or out of that wasn't supposed to and next time my electrical wire failed the pen also became the escape artist's big dog's main home, but current the coyotes have no deterrent for the rest of the property.

Actually, the switch from a high prey dog breed to a protection breed does make a lot of sense for my circumstances and the Anatolion Shepard or Kangal does sound to fit the bill. I also miss having chickens. Found another liter only 4 weeks old where I could probably reserve the pick of liter and thinking to give a call tomorrow to see how much.

 

[kyredneck]

shorts from the wire coming into contact with my chain-link fence

I used 6" standoff hangers, i.e., the wire is 12" from the ground and stands 6" in from the fence. I also got the fence electrified by the time they were 6 mos old so they learned young to stay away from the fence and they learned before they ever had a taste of roaming. Anatolians are notorious roamers if their boundaries aren't set. It's funny, I've no doubt they could jump the fence if they ever really tried, but they've basically a 6 acre dog kennel to run and romp in and they seem very content with that. The only time they ever leave here is for trips to the vet, so, unlike the Papillions, they don't beg to go.

I'd so love to take them with us on some of our outings but I don't want to spoil a good thing and their contentment with what they have. They're doing a fine job just the way it is.

Correction: 5" standoffs

 

[Benjamin]

My new Jacob Sheep picks!

My lamb Ram about 12 hours old, 4 black boots and 4 horns.

My Lamb Ewe1, 1 day old, lots of spots.

My Lamb Ewe2, 2 days old.

 

[kyredneck]

Cool.

Breeder stock. The genesis of a flock.

 

[Benjamin]

Cool.

Breeder stock. The genesis of a flock.

Just don't let the wife hear you say that, I have yet to spring...err... discuss this matter and I need to break this information to her s-l-o-w-l-y...

Actually all 3 of my lambs were born in a set of twins so I could very well have 4 more by this time next year.

 

[kyredneck]

I could very well have 4 more by this time next year

Wow, that's fast. Didn't know they matured that quickly.

 

[Benjamin]

Wow, that's fast. Didn't know they matured that quickly.

I would hold off a dog until around 18 months or so before breeding but it seems with sheep the standard is to let nature takes its course.

Also I hear "lambing" has several challenges with babies turned all kinds of odd ways, one leg of each in twins coming out at the same time, babies twisted together at the cord and so on. I'm usually pretty good at that kind of thing but this sounds like an art where it would good to witness a veteran at work beforehand.

 

[kyredneck]

I would hold off a dog until around 18 months or so before breeding but it seems with sheep the standard is to let nature takes its course.

Also I hear "lambing" has several challenges with babies turned all kinds of odd ways, one leg of each in twins coming out at the same time, babies twisted together at the cord and so on. I'm usually pretty good at that kind of thing but this sounds like an art where it would good to witness a veteran at work beforehand.

My wife is a natural at that kind of stuff, she's helped deliver more than one litter of puppies and kittens and guinea pigs but no lambs that I know of. I've helped my neighbors pull a couple of calves (both dead) but know zilch about lambing. I think the bull's heredity comes into play in determining ease of calving, wonder if it's the same with sheep? IMO, I think you'll make a good shepherd, it sounds like you'll cover all the bases and will know how to prepare for it. Keep me updated. I'm very interested.

About the dog, are Anatolians common in your parts? Around here they're still rare, we had to travel below Cave City to get the ones we have. Of course they're not the only guardian dogs out there.

[add]

Great Pyrenees are fairly common here, but man do they roam. I've see them traveling often. My youngest daughter's in-laws a couple counties over have them and they stay gone most of the time. Maybe the owners didn't make the effort to set their boundaries or to train them correctly.

 

[Benjamin]

About the dog, are Anatolians common in your parts? Around here they're still rare, we had to travel below Cave City to get the ones we have. Of course they're not the only guardian dogs out there.

They are pretty rare, although I found another liter a couples hours away and talked to the breeder. He would offer pick male (of 3) and his male is huge, 155lbs and over 6' on his hind legs. He is for making the selection as soon as possible, however I want to see the movement and will grade on confirmation and disposition which needs to be more like 6 weeks.

I didn't realize they were so big! I once raised English mastiffs so I'm not shocked about it but switched to Dogo Argentinos 20 years ago for their more super dog athletic performance and being less susceptible to joint damage.

The natural coyote killing instincts really appeals to me but I'm pretty sure a 5th dog is not going to go over to well the wife, especially when she finds out the puppy will turn out to be the size of small horse! I'm still thinking about this one...

My plan has evolved several time already, such as from 2 sheep to 3. I also found out from the owner of a petting zoo (the breeder of my sheep) that the Alpacas are basically defenseless and too passive for real protection and he totally talked me into that a Lama would be a much better pet and defender, so that is still under consideration too.

 

[Benjamin]

Another thought is that I have these awesome chain-link pens I built for the dogs (rarely ever used though) that are about 150' from our home. They are in 3 sections but can be opened up into a 20' x 80' pen. It has a large walk-in Gambrel barn shaped "dog house" with a low porch roof on each side and I've pretty much decided to make this my sheep shelter. So if the sheep run the property only during the day I think I could train to return to the shelter at night where I could lock them in and might not even need the extra protection.

 

[kyredneck]

He would offer pick male (of 3) and his male is huge, 155lbs and over 6' on his hind legs

Why would you want a male? Females are so much easier to deal with, IME. Yea, that's a Kangal dog being that big. Our females are 106 and 96 lbs last vet visit.

OK, I held off telling this, but three Saturdays ago the brother (115 lbs last vet visit) to our 2 sisters (our daughter got him the same time we got ours) bit two neighbor kids and my wife (severely) when she attempted to stop the attack. The neighbor kids were strangers and got in between Samson and our grandkids (his flock) and he reacted, methodically. I finally reached them and broke it up, he actually cowed with me. I very nearly shot him with the 9mm I was packing but glad now I didn't. He's been in quarantine and sounds like he's passed all their obedience/mental tests and will be found a home on a farm somewhere. I'm glad, he's a magnificent animal and he's always bonded with me.

My Romanian SIL once told me that it was very dangerous to be a stranger and in a position between a sheep dog and it's flock.

[add]

Our daughter and husband sold their isolated place in the country last November and moved to a very nice place in town with about an acre yard. She had under ground electronic fencing installed to keep Samson and the Blue Heeler contained. It was 'iffy' from the gitgo whether Samson was going to fit into that environment. He didn't.

[add]

They were fortunate in that the neighbors whose kids were bitten (everybody had to go to the ER) were very understanding Christian people who own a very large lovable Mastiff and once had to put down a dog that had bitten an uncle.

 

[kyredneck]

return to the shelter at night where I could lock them in

Solar powered Predator Eye. Both my daughters had success protecting their chickens at night with these. Before I got the Anatolians I had success keeping deer from eating my bean plants at night. Hang them on the perimeter fence at the target animal's eye level. They work.