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Featured Where did Lordship Salvation come from?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Humble Disciple, Jul 1, 2021.

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  1. Humble Disciple

    Humble Disciple Active Member

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    Did any of the Protestant Reformers teach Lordship salvation?

    Martin Luther taught that no sin can cause someone to lose their salvation except for unbelief alone:

    Neither was Lordship salvation taught by John Calvin:

    I'm sorry if I've misrepresented the teachings of Luther and Calvin. Did any of the Protestant Reformers teach Lordship salvation and, if so, can you please provide some evidence? It would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member
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    I never heard of it until MacArthur's The Gospel According to Jesus.
     
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  3. Humble Disciple

    Humble Disciple Active Member

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    The term "Lordship salvation" was popularized by John MacArthur, but was its basic ideas taught by the Reformers?

    Also, can one disagree with John MacArthur about Lordship salvation while appreciating other things that he might teach?
     
  4. Reformed

    Reformed Well-Known Member
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    Much depends on how you define Lordship Salvation. The term describes the inseparable role of Christ as both Savior and Lord. Can a person accept Christ as Savior today but not acknowledge His Lordship until some indefinite time in the future? The answer is an unequivocal "no". Jesus is both Lord and Savior. As such each Christian is duty-bound to submit to Him in all areas of our life. As we mature in our faith our level of obedience should increase (Ephesians 4:13).
     
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  5. Humble Disciple

    Humble Disciple Active Member

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    Could you please point to where Martin Luther, John Calvin and other Protestant Reformers taught this? Also, is that all John MacArthur means when he promotes Lordship salvation?
     
  6. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    You mention "not acknowledge His Lordship" or is it more - Not understanding "His Lordship" and/or applying "His Lordship"

    Please allow me to use t his very loose analogy. You pass your drivers road test today - but are you aware of every single driving law on the books?

    and here is one excellent example -
    Everyone knows you can turn right on Red (after stopping)
    but did you know (in some States/Commonwealths) you can turn left on red?

    But for a full understanding - you must be turning from a one-way to a one way.


    and it is the same with salvation - yes, we are not saved - but there is a lot more to learn, understand and be aware of.
    I'm sure that even Dr Stanley - leans new things - even at his current age!
     
  7. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    I do not believe in Lord ship salvation because in my opinion this makes Salvation dependent on works for Salvation. Many Pastors teach it is necessary to maintain our Salvation. This makes it part of the Salvation process. Paul wrote;
    .
    Rom 4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
    Rom 4:5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
    Rom 4:6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

    The apostle Paul didn't preach it but preached the opposite. We are created for Good works. Don't misunderstand me it's just that good works do not bring Salvation. They bring rewards and the rewards can be great
    MB
     
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  8. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    They both would agree with the belief that Jesus should be the Lord over all areas of our lives, but they would severely disagree with notion happens at salvation, and also that the assurance should never be based upon how well we are behaving, but upon Lord Jesus!
     
  9. OnlyaSinner

    OnlyaSinner Well-Known Member
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    Nicely put. One who receives Christ as personal Savior cannot lose salvation. However, obeying Him is, in a sense, recognizing His Lordship, and without doing so the believer is unlikely to be greatly used by God.
     
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  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Yes, as none save Bible writers have infallible theology! And he seems to have more of the Puritam mindset on this issue then Reformed of the reformation era!
     
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The problem though is that all Christians have Jesus as Lord, as when saved, God the father installed him as such over us, so its not really as Dr MacArthur views this!
     
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    They did not really teach it as Dr MacArthur and others have it being, as they do come close to almost basing salvation upon grace and our works!
     
  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    When we got saved, Jesus was Lord over each one of us,so we did not need to make Him that!
     
  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Those into LDS do tend to mix Justification and sanctification too much!
     
  15. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    Came from The Bible, but ole Johnny Mac coined the phrase.
     
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  16. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    The point is that if He is the Lord of our life, we will show evidence of submission to His Lordship.
     
  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Yes, but will not be all at same time, as none have that when first saved, and none mature at same pace!
     
  18. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    If you look closely at how he presents it and particularly into when he first presented it, you will see what he did. He was and is Calvinist. He used this teaching to gain Calvinist inroads into non Calvinist Baptist circles.
     
  19. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    I would say that it was a part of the gospel to explain that Jesus is God and King. His Lordship was understood.
    What is not understood in the Bible is the entire invitation to say a sinners prayer and thus be saved by the magic power of an invoking prayer as though God were a personal genie.
     
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  20. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    I can remember when Lordship Salvation first came on my scene. It seemed like a reaction to then-popular Easy Believeism
     
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