Translation Encryption

[Van]

In cryptography, encryption is the process of encoding information. This process converts the original representation of the information, known as plaintext, into an alternative form known as ciphertext. Ideally, only authorized parties can decipher a ciphertext back to plaintext and access the original information. Encryption does not itself prevent interference but denies the intelligible content to a would-be interceptor. (Wikipedia)

If we consider the Greek New Testament as the "plaintext" and our English translation as the "ciphertext" would we find examples of encryption? In WWII the Allies changed the names of Greenland and Iceland to confuse the enemy. In the NT we have two different places (Gehenna and Hades) changed to one name (Hell) in some translations. We get different Greek words translated into the same English word and the same Greek word meaning translated into several different English words or phrases.

And while some of these encryptions might be necessary, they could be reduced using modern digital technology.

The question is: What is the hold-up? In our current "supply change problem" some blame the powerful unions who prevent improved efficiency to protect jobs. Or some software creators leave bugs so as to ensure future work. 2.0 anyone?

 

[Van]

Rom 8:16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
Rom 8:17 and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.

Col 1:21 And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds,
Col 1:22 he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him,
Col 1:23 IF indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister

This snippet was lifted from a post presenting the view that salvation is conditional, that a person once saved can lose their salvation.

Does "provided we suffer with Him" meaning we must sustain our salvation through or by means of works? That was the claim.
Do we need to "continue in the faith" by our works of faith to sustain our salvation? That was the claim.

Or are these verses encrypted so as to deny understanding to at least some of those attempt to "decipher" the passages.

Let's consider Romans 8:17:

Are we heirs in line to receive at some future point the blessings of God, or have we in the present received the blessings of God? If we are born anew children of God, then we have received salvation in the present.

If we are indeed born anew children of God, then we are sharing in the suffering of Christ, as we were baptized into His death.

Thus Romans 8:17, if deciphered, provides no support for the false claim that salvation can be lost.



Are we really fellow heirs with Christ? Or fellow enjoyers of the blessings provided by Christ?

 

[Van]

Now let's look at Colossians 1:23:

IF indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Here the translations start off with a conditional "if indeed" (eige/G1489)

However the Greek word has within its range of meaning "since." Thus the verse could be translated as "Since you are persisting in the faith..." This view asks the question, "Since what" and the answer is "being reconciled to God."

Thus the proof of being reconciled is persisting in the faith and not shifting from the hope of the gospel! Our eternal security is provided by God protecting our credited faith, so we are unable to not persist if we are born anew.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

Now let's look at Colossians 1:23:

IF indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Here the translations start off with a conditional "if indeed" (eige/G1489)

However the Greek word has within its range of meaning "since." Thus the verse could be translated as "Since you are persisting in the faith..." This view asks the question, "Since what" and the answer is "being reconciled to God."

Of the 62 Bible translations on BibleGateway, not a single one starts the verse with since. Also, the word persisting is not found in any of the translations. Most of the translations have continue in the faith." The NABRE and the NCB has persevere in the faith. That has a better connotation that 'persisting.' And why the 'ing' form of the word?

 

[Van]

Of the 62 Bible translations on BibleGateway, not a single one starts the verse with since. Also, the word persisting is not found in any of the translations. Most of the translations have continue in the faith." The NABRE and the NCB has persevere in the faith. That has a better connotation that 'persisting.' And why the 'ing' form of the word?

Why spew the same idiotic stuff over and over.
Does the Greek word mean since and is it elsewhere translated as since? Yes
Does the Greek word mean persisting? Yes
Do multiple wrongs make right? Nope.

Colossians 1:23 (interpretive translation)
Since you are persisting in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Thus the proof of being reconciled is persisting in the faith and not shifting from the hope of the gospel! Our eternal security is provided by God protecting our credited faith, so we are unable to not persist if we are born anew.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

What makes you think that you, and you alone, have arrived at the correct translation despite being outnumbered by 62 translations? That takes some gall Van.

 

[37818]

There are words and grammar in the Greek not translated into English. That English might not translate back into the same Greek the English was translated from. The encryption notion does not work to well.

 

[Van]

More multiple wrongs make right claims. Taking something clear in Greek and making it obscure in English is ENCRYPTION.

Without a "Key" (Reverse Interlinear) how would a non-Greek reading bible reader know the difference between Gehenna and Hades?

 

[Van]

Commentary on Colossians 1:23:

Paul introduces this verse with a conditional statement: "if." Some translations prefer to use the word "since." Either is appropriate, so long as the intent of the verse is understood. Paul's previous comments about being holy through Christ are true only for genuine believers. He then gives four marks of such legitimate believers, which are continuing in the faith, being stable, being steadfast, and not shifting from the hope of the gospel.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

Commentary on Colossians 1:23:

Identify the commentary.

 

[Van]

Identify the commentary.

I think you falsely claimed that I alone arrived at "since." Obviously your claim was false. But there is no system where you can be held accountable for your non-stop false claims.

All I can do is to keep posting truth.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

I think you falsely claimed that I alone arrived at "since." Obviously your claim was false. But there is no system where you can be held accountable for your non-stop false claims.

All I can do is to keep posting truth.

I said that of the 62 Bible translations listed on BibleGateway, none had your word choice. That is factual. To maintain otherwise is false Van.

Now, again, name the commentary that you quoted from.

 

[Van]

I said that of the 62 Bible translations listed on BibleGateway, none had your word choice. That is factual. To maintain otherwise is false Van.

Now, again, name the commentary that you quoted from.

Here is what this above poster wrote: "What makes you think that you, and you alone, have arrived at the correct translation..."
Your statement clearly shows I alone arrived at the correct translation, and the commentary says others came to the same conclusion. Your statement remains false, slanderous, and wrong...

 

[RipponRedeaux]

Here is what this above poster wrote: "What makes you think that you, and you alone, have arrived at the correct translation despite being outnumbered by 62 translations."

That is correct.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

the commentary says others came to the same conclusion.

For the third time, name the commentary or the author you had quoted.

 

[Van]

For the third time, name the commentary or the author you had quoted.

Did you make a false statement about me being alone in coming to the conclusion "since" reflects the intended meaning? Yes,
Was that statement false as demonstrated by the posted commentary and the lexicons which include that meaning. Yes

Would you like me to post yet another supporting document for "since" as a meaning? Or will you simply find imaginary fault with every one that demonstrates your error?

 

[RipponRedeaux]

Would you like me to post yet another supporting document for "since" as a meaning?

What is your problem Van? This is my 4th time asking you to identify the quote you made from a "commentary." What are you scared of? Why the evasive maneuvers? Man-up Bud.

 

[Van]

For the third time, name the commentary or the author you had quoted.

Commentary on Colossians 1:23:
Paul introduces this verse with a conditional statement: "if." Some translations prefer to use the word "since." Either is appropriate, so long as the intent of the verse is understood. Paul's previous comments about being holy through Christ are true only for genuine believers. He then gives four marks of such legitimate believers, which are continuing in the faith, being stable, being steadfast, and not shifting from the hope of the gospel.

 

[RipponRedeaux]

Commentary on Colossians 1:23:

For the 5th time, identify the commentary or author. You are acting disgracefully.

 

[Van]

What is your problem Van? This is my 4th time asking you to identify the quote you made from a "commentary." What are you scared of? Why the evasive maneuvers? Man-up Bud.

You are not answering my questions, and then as me to "man up?" You are the dim bulb that made false and slanderous statements, yet you did not "man up" and admit your malfeasance.

Will the forum leadership allow you once again to employ the endless question to derail all discussion of the forum topic? Wait and see...