Spiritual Truth and Doctrine

[JonC]

I know men who believe that spiritual truth is the understanding or acceptance of doctrine. Scripture, however, seems to indicate otherwise - that the truth of Scripture and the work of the Spirit leads us to spiritual knowledge which is something other than, deeper than, and even more important than simple biblical doctrine.

I have seen Christians with poor theology possess more spiritual truth than seminary professors.

Spiritual truth is how brethern can be united in Christ, refrain from judging the servant of Another.

We see spiritual truth in the godly interactions of mature Christians conversing and debating the different views they hold without resorting to insults...even when they strongly disagree over doctrine.

Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error. Spiritual thoughts must be combined with Spiritual words.

We also speak these things, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words. 1 Cor 2:13.

So what is "spiritual truth"?

 

[Marooncat79]

Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error.

I am sorry, but I truly have no idea what you are trying to say here?

especially the first sentence.

can you please explain?

how do you mean different?
TIA

 

[JonC]

Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error.

I am sorry, but I truly have no idea what you are trying to say here?

especially the first sentence.

can you please explain?

how do you mean different?
TIA

Spiritual truth is not merely knowing about Scripture or doctrine. It is how that knowledge works in our lives.

I have known men who have worked out their theology very well, their view is biblical, they profess to be Christian, yet by their lives they have not obtained the spiritual truth the doctrine they affirm teaches.

I have also known Christians who hold to poor theology and error. But that doctrine (not the error but the gospel) has led them to spiritual truth.

Spiritual truth is not learned merely by study. It is Scripture applied, it is our being confirmed into the image of Christ.

Demons understand Scripture perhaps more than any of us could. They believe. But their belief is void of Spiritual truth. Satan knows if Calvinism is correct, or Arminianism. Yet he does not possess spiritual truth.

Spiritual thoughts must be combined with Spiritual words.

We also speak these things, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words. 1 Cor 2:13.

 

[AustinC]

What passage of scripture supports the OPs contention that:

"the truth of Scripture and the work of the Spirit leads us to spiritual knowledge which is something other than, deeper than, and even more important than simple biblical doctrine"

"Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error."

"Spiritual truth is not merely knowing about Scripture or doctrine. It is how that knowledge works in our lives."

"Spiritual truth is not learned merely by study. It is Scripture applied, it is our being confirmed into the image of Christ."

Since the OP is purely relying on observation, I will try translate the observation.

There are many believers who hear about what God did in the Bible and they exhibit a deep, deep faith in God, even though they cannot articulate even one theological concept as an argument for their faith.

For them, God said it and they believe it. Their faith works out their belief in everyday, practical ways. These brothers and sisters have an uncommon gift of faith that blesses the body of Christ.

 

[37818]

So what is "spiritual truth"?

Well, for one thing it involves actually knowing God. [John 17:3, John 17:17, Matthew 4:4 ]

 

[JonC]

What passage of scripture supports the OPs contention that:

"the truth of Scripture and the work of the Spirit leads us to spiritual knowledge which is something other than, deeper than, and even more important than simple biblical doctrine"

"Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error."

"Spiritual truth is not merely knowing about Scripture or doctrine. It is how that knowledge works in our lives."

"Spiritual truth is not learned merely by study. It is Scripture applied, it is our being confirmed into the image of Christ."

Since the OP is purely relying on observation, I will try translate the observation.

There are many believers who hear about what God did in the Bible and they exhibit a deep, deep faith in God, even though they cannot articulate even one theological concept as an argument for their faith.

For them, God said it and they believe it. Their faith works out their belief in everyday, practical ways. These brothers and sisters have an uncommon gift of faith that blesses the body of Christ.

Spiritual truth is the combination of spiritual words with spiritual thoughts. But yes, this is the working out of our faith in our lives.

Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God, which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.

 

[Van]

Truth has fidelity to the original. If what we believe about God is true, then our beliefs are spiritual truth. However, if we believe what is not true about God, then our beliefs are not spiritual truth. Jesus is said to be "Truth" because He is the exact image of God. If what we believe about Jesus is true, then we believe in spiritual truth.

Obviously we hold very different views of "Biblical Doctrine." Thus while some of what we believe is true, our understanding is flawed, such that we should not proclaim our view is "Spiritual Truth." We should present our view, and say this is what we believe this or that verse or passage means.

However, even here we run afoul of error, because some believe the lost cannot understand scripture such that it can lead them to Christ.

Thus on this Board, it is safe to say "Spiritual Truth" has been effectively buried by the inventions of people.

 

[JesusFan]

I know men who believe that spiritual truth is the understanding or acceptance of doctrine. Scripture, however, seems to indicate otherwise - that the truth of Scripture and the work of the Spirit leads us to spiritual knowledge which is something other than, deeper than, and even more important than simple biblical doctrine.

I have seen Christians with poor theology possess more spiritual truth than seminary professors.

Spiritual truth is how brethern can be united in Christ, refrain from judging the servant of Another.

We see spiritual truth in the godly interactions of mature Christians conversing and debating the different views they hold without resorting to insults...even when they strongly disagree over doctrine.

Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error. Spiritual thoughts must be combined with Spiritual words.

We also speak these things, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words. 1 Cor 2:13.

So what is "spiritual truth"?

Unless one holds to correct doctrines, there can be no spiritual truth!

 

[JonC]

Unless one holds to correct doctrines, there can be no spiritual truth!

So either (or neither) the Calvinists or Arminians have spiritual truth?

Why does Scripture tell us not to judge the servant of Another as Christ will make them stand if those who do not hold to correct doctrines can have no spiritual truth?

John Owen and R.C. Sproul held incorrect doctrines. Is it impossible that they had spiritual truth?

Obviously correct doctrine and spiritual truth are not the same thing (demons believe correct doctrine, but as Scripture states, it is spiritual words and spiritual thoughts).

Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God, which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.

 

[Reformed1689]

I know men who believe that spiritual truth is the understanding or acceptance of doctrine. Scripture, however, seems to indicate otherwise - that the truth of Scripture and the work of the Spirit leads us to spiritual knowledge which is something other than, deeper than, and even more important than simple biblical doctrine.

I have seen Christians with poor theology possess more spiritual truth than seminary professors.

Spiritual truth is how brethern can be united in Christ, refrain from judging the servant of Another.

We see spiritual truth in the godly interactions of mature Christians conversing and debating the different views they hold without resorting to insults...even when they strongly disagree over doctrine.

Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error. Spiritual thoughts must be combined with Spiritual words.

We also speak these things, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words. 1 Cor 2:13.

So what is "spiritual truth"?

Correct Doctrine and Spiritual Truth would be the same thing. So I really have no idea what you are getting at.

 

[Reformed1689]

We see spiritual truth in the godly interactions of mature Christians conversing and debating the different views they hold without resorting to insults...even when they strongly disagree over doctrine.

This is also false as if there is never a place for an insult or direct comment. You really should read your Bible more as there are even examples of this in Scripture.

 

[Reynolds]

I know men who believe that spiritual truth is the understanding or acceptance of doctrine. Scripture, however, seems to indicate otherwise - that the truth of Scripture and the work of the Spirit leads us to spiritual knowledge which is something other than, deeper than, and even more important than simple biblical doctrine.

I have seen Christians with poor theology possess more spiritual truth than seminary professors.

Spiritual truth is how brethern can be united in Christ, refrain from judging the servant of Another.

We see spiritual truth in the godly interactions of mature Christians conversing and debating the different views they hold without resorting to insults...even when they strongly disagree over doctrine.

Spiritual truth transcends doctrine. Spiritual truth transcends doctrinal error. Spiritual thoughts must be combined with Spiritual words.

We also speak these things, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words. 1 Cor 2:13.

So what is "spiritual truth"?

But we don't unite on heresy. Claiming The Spirit contradicts The Word is heresy. You don't tolerate nor do you associate with heresy.

 

[Reynolds]

This is also false as if there is never a place for an insult or direct comment. You really should read your Bible more as there are even examples of this in Scripture.

Indeed. Quite a bit of disagreement among even The Apostles.

 

[JonC]

But we don't unite on heresy. Claiming The Spirit contradicts The Word is heresy. You don't tolerate nor do you associate with heresy.

I agree. But that goes back there what we call "Christian's. A Presbyterian holds doctrine I believe to be false. I would not unite as a church with them, BUT those of them who are saved are united to us by Christ.

 

[Reformed1689]

I agree. But that goes back there what we call "Christian's. A Presbyterian holds doctrine I believe to be false. I would not unite as a church with them, BUT those of them who are saved are united to us by Christ.

And the point is either their doctrine, your doctrine or both, are not spiritual truth.

 

[JesusFan]

So either (or neither) the Calvinists or Arminians have spiritual truth?

Why does Scripture tell us not to judge the servant of Another as Christ will make them stand if those who do not hold to correct doctrines can have no spiritual truth?

John Owen and R.C. Sproul held incorrect doctrines. Is it impossible that they had spiritual truth?

Obviously correct doctrine and spiritual truth are not the same thing (demons believe correct doctrine, but as Scripture states, it is spiritual words and spiritual thoughts).

Unless one holds to what the church has historical held to be the core and essential doctrines of the Christian faith, cannot be real spiritual truth!

 

[JesusFan]

And the point is either their doctrine, your doctrine or both, are not spiritual truth.

But where they differ from us are not in the core doctrines of the faith, are they?

 

[JesusFan]

I agree. But that goes back there what we call "Christian's. A Presbyterian holds doctrine I believe to be false. I would not unite as a church with them, BUT those of them who are saved are united to us by Christ.

What do they hold to that is against core doctrines, ones that must be held?

 

[JesusFan]

Correct Doctrine and Spiritual Truth would be the same thing. So I really have no idea what you are getting at.

How can we have unity without essential doctrines?

 

[JonC]

Unless one holds to what the church has historical held to be the core and essential doctrines of the Christian faith, cannot be real spiritual truth!

But that is the gospel (it is what makes us Christian). Without that one is not Christian.

Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may know the things freely given to us by God, which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.