Take This Christian Music Test

Here's been the general direction of the thread.

The first link in the OP was supposedly to a "Christian" site. It was deemed offensive enough to be removed from the thread. The site was full of outright lies, a little bit of truth, absolutely stupid logic ("Marilyn Manson is evil. Thus, Toby Mac is evil"), plagiarism, discredited (or non-existent) science ("cook an egg at a concert, anyone?"), and horrific perjoratives hurled at Christians--calling them "Godless," "gay-loving perverts," and the like.

The end does not justify the means. Just because you can't stand something doesn't give you the right as a Christian to engage in that kind of behavior.

And so, from the get-go, we started this thread with an attack documented from a baseless site. Now, several of you have weighed in and have been above board and Christian in your responses. I appreciate that, even if we disagree.

But a larger share of the angrier and more venomous posts HAVE come from folks who think that modern Christian music is inherently evil. A few of you have insulted people's churches, belittled their testimonies, and even questioned their salvations. If you're trying to convince folks you're right, that's a poor way to do it. A couple of you owe apologies to other posters.

Here's the MO I've tried to carry through:

(1) I do not EVER recall making fun of a church for being traditional or "hymns-only," nor will I do so. We use hymns, ancient songs, and new stuff in our worship. God bless you if your conviction is otherwise.

(2) My opinion on this matter is borne out by my studies of the Scriptures (to the best of my ablility, doing so in context), my personal testimony, my ministry gifts and passions, my study of church history, music history, and music theory, and evidence of God's blessing. It hasn't been pulled out of the air. It doesn't use slanderous websites to do so. I do my best to be intellectually honest, and would ask that others do so.

(3) A common mistake is to equate "CCM" (that one might listen to out and about) with music used in corporate worship . I'm willing to concede that there's plenty of CCM I wouldn't use to lead worship. It's "fluff," or not God-centered, or has poor theology, or is inane musically, or the artist doesn't meet my standards, etc. BUT, there is modern music out there that meets EVERY part of my criteria (informed by point #2 above), thus I believe God puts His blessings on our using it for worship. "Is CCM inherently evil," and "Is any modern music appropriate for worship" are two entirely different questions.

 

Great summary. I think that about covers it!

 

Wow... you actually watched a DISNEY MOVIE!!!!

Don't you know that all Disney movies are from the pits of Hell!

(sarcastic of course)
BTW is there a sarcastic graemlin?

 

Graemlins! AAAHHHHHHH! They are Internet manifestations of demons!!! Just because they are on a Christian board doesn't mean they are not from the pits of hell, want to lead you into drugs and sexual perversions. Repent!

 

The Bible says by the foolishness of preaching. Preaching is a 'foolish' way of presenting God's truth. And by the way, I was refering to there being a difference between Church music and MTV's music...and you questioned that? Odd...I would think that would be a no-brainer!!

My hymns don't put a stumblingblock in front of another Bleiever but the CCM crowd does...if you take a sampling (Statististics...or however you spell that most boring class I took in college) which I did through my local cd music section today that there is not much difference in what the CCM bands and the secular bands look like and the same with their cd covers. Though I think the Bible clearly tells us to look different not strive to look more like the world...and no I'm not talking about wearing clothes but style of the clothes.

And why does someone always bring up the "well we need to stop eating fast food or driving cars or shopping at walmart" this is a ridiculous and insulting statement...seperation in the Bible is specific in our desire to want to fit in with the world not stop using facilities or items that "some unsaved sinner may be using"...so let's make this a discussion of practical opinions not idiotic statements.

 

You're right. They're not fit for a church youth group but that doesn't mean that they're bad.

They do songs from a very rough point of view and very aggressive lyrical angle. That doesn't make them bad.

Now Plyaing: Gamble Rogers – “Signs of a Misspent Youth” </font>[/QUOTE]If it is not fit for a youth group how is it acceptable somewhere else? I try to not have seperate rules for Me and then some for my youth group...or some for mommy and daddy and different for the kids...because this opens the door for resentment, rebellion, and hypocrisy. Just because I'm the leader or the parent and as an adult have different freedoms I should be aware that this freedom also comes with more responsibilty and sometimes (many times) requires me to forgo these freedoms for the sake of the subordinate member.

 

There are always different rules for parents & kids. It is just the way it is. That said, I do agree that one must at times defer exercising freedom. Appropriate behavior at appropriate times.

 

Well, it WAS in a public school. Hmmm....

 

How so?

How would a song like, say, Randy Stonehill's "Breath of God" be a stumbling block to a believer?

What do they wear that's so outrageous? I'm pretty confident that if you were to stand in a lineup with twenty non-Christian men about your age, that your dress wouldn't be distinguishable from theirs.

It may be cliched, but it's not ridiculous or idiotic.

You really can make the comparison about any one of a number of the things we do in our daily life.

now Playing: Grateful Dead – “Skull and Roses”

 

Because they're two different things, done in two different contexts.

I don't mean morally unfit, but contextually and stylistically inappropriate.

Of course you have different rules.

You and your wife have sex, but I doubt you'd allow your kids to have sex.

You can drive a car, but it's pretty unlikely that you'd allow your twelve year old to borrow the family sedan.

You can come and go as you please. Are your kids free to wander in at midnight?

Now Playing: Spanky and Our Gang – “Spanky and Our Gang”

 

rbell...

Keep posting what you're doing... I LIKE it!

 

In efforts to get this thread closer to page 20, I thought I'd post what we did Sunday night with the Youth Praise Team leading the service:

You're Worthy of My Praise (Ruis, 1991)
You Are Welcome Here (Foote, 2001)
Worthy, You Are Worthy (Moen, 1986)

When We All Get to Heaven (Hewitt, Wilson, PD)
There's a Land That is Fairer Than Day (Webster, Bennett, PD)
The Glory-Land Way (Torbett, 1943)

Lord, I Lift Your Name on High (Founds, 1989)
Lord, Reign in Me (Brown, 1998)
Word of God, Speak (Millard, Kipley, 2002)

Invitation: I Have Decided to Follow Jesus (Traditional, PD)

Our church had a great time with new and old songs, and the kids loved leading out in worship. They'll probably start doing it once a month on Sunday nights.

[ May 02, 2006, 02:33 PM: Message edited by: Joshua Rhodes ]

 

Again, JR, you're flirting with the enemy

 

It's ok, Gib... I know very well where his pew sits in my church.

 

No ma'am. No witches here.

 

So, let me get this straight: when you make baseless claims, untrue accusations, use faulty logic and erronious information in order to demonize someone, that's perfectly acceptable, but when someone calls you on the outrageous things you say, that's a witch hunt?

By the way, still waiting for you to back up your claims that REZ sings songs about killing babies, "glorifying evil", that I have stated that Kathy Triccoli is not a Christian, that I have said that the artists I've played with are not Christians.

Do you plan to back these things up, or can we just continue to assume that you were being less than honest in order to make it appear that you had a valid point?

Now Playing: Jackson Browne – “Late for the Sky”

 

We're not talking about lust. We're talking about enjoying a different style of music.

What do any of these things have to do with enjoying a particular style of music?

Now Playing: Roy Orbison – “Sings Lonely and Blue”