While you are praying

To me it matters not who the woman is or isn't.

Just because it was a different time period does not make it right.

 

If you are saying that taking her hands off the piano was a sin, do you have Scripture for that?

 

1 Peter 5:2,5 "Be shepherds of God's flock that is under your care...not lording it over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock."

2 Timothy 2:24-25 "And the Lord's servant must not quarrel; instead he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. Those who oppose him he must gently instruct..."

 

I'm not sure how the first applies, but the 2 Timothy quote is a good one.

 

I posted the first verse because as a leader in the church, even as an evangelist I do not believe that was the proper example to set before the flock. I believe it was a misuse of the authority of his position.

 

Okay, PastorSBC1303, you've made some good points. The action may have been unwise by Dr. Bill (it would be far more unwise in the context of today's society), though I still can't find any Scripture to say it was sinful.

 

John, can I ask what your reaction would be if it were your wife that had her hands physically removed?

 

I can tell you what my reaction would have been. They would have been calling 911 for the preacher.

Joseph Botwinick

 

Well, Pastor, you can't ask me to go too far here, since Dr. Bill was my Mom's uncle!!

Frankly, I was just a little afraid of the man, though I admired him greatly (and still do). I once saw him in the 1950's shoot out a lightbulb with his six gun in the old open air tabernacle at the Bill Rice Ranch!! Everyone listened to that message, let me tell you!

In his defense, he normally treated ladies very well. He called his wife "Princess" and treated her like one. She wrote a wonderful book about marriage. His family turned out wonderfully, with three sons being evangelists. We had Pete over here several years ago, and he did a wonderful job, and is a splendid Christian.

Anyway, to answer your question, the me of today would have gone to him in private and told him I was offended, and tried to talk it out. However, I would also have talked to my wife about it to make sure why she did it, and if her attitude was wrong about the matter, we would have had a serious talk and prayer time about it.

 

Well, Joseph, just for the sake of discussion, you would have had a hard time with this preacher. Dr. Bill was well over six feet, and tough as nails since he was a Texas cowboy!

Not that he would have fought you necessarily--he was certainly not a brawler. But he would have defended himself.

 

Let's consider the worst case scenario. The lady had been playing the piano there for 50 years. She always did things the way she wanted because that is the way she has always done them. Her husband was a deacon who threw his weight around and so no one challenged her. So when this big evangelist came through she decided she would just do things her way and prove her authority through music.

Bro. Bill was aware of this, perhaps it had happened before with the same piano player. Her bad spirit was interfering with the Lord's work and action had to be taken right then, not wait for another night. So, to salvage the situation Bro. Bill just walks over and gently removes her hands from the keys.

Now, he did not shout at her across the platform, run over and using a judo throw get her off the piano. From what I know of the man it would have been graciously done.

Maybe she was a young piano player with little experiance in such situations. Her nerves got the better of her and she kept making the same mistake. So, again, Bro. Bill could have just gone over and gently removed her hands from the keys. Maybe even shared a smile to let her know it was not personal. For all we know this could have become a treasured story in the family!

Can we not just track this lady down, or her family, and find out what really happened?

 

Well, Joseph, just for the sake of discussion, you would have had a hard time with this preacher. Dr. Bill was well over six feet, and tough as nails since he was a Texas cowboy!

Not that he would have fought you necessarily--he was certainly not a brawler. But he would have defended himself. </font>[/QUOTE]I would first have cut him down to size (Perhaps broke his knees or knocked the wind out of him) and then proceeded to pound the living daylights out of him. I don't care how big or tough he is. If he lays a hand on my wife, he better watch out.

Joseph Botwinick

 

I have no doubt you speak the truth here. I am sure he was a fine Christian man. And I realize the question is a little close to home.

I agree.

 

Joseph, while I admire your desire to defend your wife. I think you are going a little over the top here.

I do not believe getting physical with him would solve the problem. It is not like he was trying to attack the lady in question.

If it were my wife, I would be upset, but I would talk to him in private about it following the service.

 

So, are you a black belt in something, a boxer, an MMA fighter or just a brawler? I hope you are not a pastor--this sounds like a brawler's words to me.

"My pastor's tougher than your pastor!! Would you have fought him right there in the church, or said, "Step outside, Mr. Evangelist!"

 

So, are you a black belt</font>[/QUOTE]Yes.

"My pastor's tougher than your pastor!! Would you have fought him right there in the church, or said, "Step outside, Mr. Evangelist!" [/QUOTE]

As long as he kept his hands off my wife, he would remain perfectly safe and unharmed.

Joseph Botwinick

 

Originally quoted by PastorSBC1303:
"I do not believe getting physical with him would solve the problem. It is not like he was trying to attack the lady in question."

Hi Joseph.
Joseph, my daughter is a first degree black belt and my son is a first level (can't think of the
proper term) brown belt, both taught by a Christian,(and a Baptist), man. He teaches his students to "walk it out, talk it out, or find someone to help you out", if at all possible, before using one's karate skills against someone when there is a threatening disagreement (not a blatant attack) I have to agree with Pastor SBC in his above quote and say I hope you would rethink your stand.
Just my very little 2 cents here.

 

AWWWWWWWWWWWW...perhaps your right. But still, the threat would make you think twice, wouldn't it?

Joseph Botwinick

 

Well, a threat should always make one think and be on the alert, but not necessarily act. And, what actually constitutes a threat, or, just an offense?

 

Pam,

I meant me threatening him would make him think twice.

Seriously,

I don't go out looking for a fight...but I am certainly equiped to handle myself if I absolutely had to.

Joseph Botwinick