respector of persons?

Van · Aug 13, 2016

SovereignGrace said:
God is no respector of persons and Van says He is, when Peter proclaimed otherwise...
The bible says no one seeks God and Van says they do...
The bible says the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit, yet Van states they can understand the sincere milk of the gospel...

Van better be the one who reads his bible...

You shall do no injustice in judgment; you shall not be partial to the poor nor defer to the great, but you are to judge your neighbor fairly. Non-germane to the topic.

You shall not distort justice; you shall not be partial, and you shall not take a bribe, for a bribe blinds the eyes of the wise and perverts the words of the righteous. Non-germane to the topic.

For we will surely die and are like water spilled on the ground which cannot be gathered up again. Yet God does not take away life, but plans ways so that the banished one will not be cast out from him. Non-germane to the topic

Now then let the fear of the Lord be upon you; be very careful what you do, for the Lord our God will have no part in unrighteousness or partiality or the taking of a bribe.” Non-germane to the topic.

These also are sayings of the wise. To show partiality in judgment is not good. Non-germane to the topic.

To show partiality is not good, Because for a piece of bread a man will transgress. Non-germane to the topic

If you address as Father the One who impartially judges according to each one’s work, conduct yourselves in fear during the time of your stay on earth; Here we see God does judge people "impartially" according to their works. Thus God would rank a humble servant of the Lord higher than someone devoted to worldly riches. For example see Luke 16:19-31.

Opening his mouth, Peter said: “I most certainly understand now that God is not one to show partiality, Here again we see that God does not show partiality unfairly or in accordance with the world's value system.

Once again it has been shown that some take a biblical truth, God judges fairly and does not show partiality according to the world's value system, and rewrote it to say God does not judge people according to their works.

Lets look at a few more of their myths, their misrepresentations of scripture:

Romans 3:11 does indeed say no one seeks God, but it does not add "at any time." Sometimes fallen people set their minds on godly things, such as the milk of the gospel.

1 Corinthians 2:14 does say the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God. But it does not say "all things" and therefore they do receive spiritual milk, just as Paul teaches in 1 Corinthians 3:1-3.

Just read your bibles folks, the many myths taught by the nameless doctrine will be easily exposed.

Iconoclast · Aug 13, 2016

Van said:
You shall do no injustice in judgment; you shall not be partial to the poor nor defer to the great, but you are to judge your neighbor fairly. Non-germane to the topic.

You shall not distort justice; you shall not be partial, and you shall not take a bribe, for a bribe blinds the eyes of the wise and perverts the words of the righteous. Non-germane to the topic.

For we will surely die and are like water spilled on the ground which cannot be gathered up again. Yet God does not take away life, but plans ways so that the banished one will not be cast out from him. Non-germane to the topic

Now then let the fear of the Lord be upon you; be very careful what you do, for the Lord our God will have no part in unrighteousness or partiality or the taking of a bribe.” Non-germane to the topic.

These also are sayings of the wise. To show partiality in judgment is not good. Non-germane to the topic.

To show partiality is not good, Because for a piece of bread a man will transgress. Non-germane to the topic

If you address as Father the One who impartially judges according to each one’s work, conduct yourselves in fear during the time of your stay on earth; Here we see God does judge people "impartially" according to their works. Thus God would rank a humble servant of the Lord higher than someone devoted to worldly riches. For example see Luke 16:19-31.

Opening his mouth, Peter said: “I most certainly understand now that God is not one to show partiality, Here again we see that God does not show partiality unfairly or in accordance with the world's value system.

Once again it has been shown that some take a biblical truth, God judges fairly and does not show partiality according to the world's value system, and rewrote it to say God does not judge people according to their works.

Lets look at a few more of their myths, their misrepresentations of scripture:

Romans 3:11 does indeed say no one seeks God, but it does not add "at any time." Sometimes fallen people set their minds on godly things, such as the milk of the gospel.

1 Corinthians 2:14 does say the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God. But it does not say "all things" and therefore they do receive spiritual milk, just as Paul teaches in 1 Corinthians 3:1-3.

Just read your bibles folks, the many myths taught by the nameless doctrine will be easily exposed.

Once again....a violation of the command .not to add to the words of scripture

Van · Aug 13, 2016

More smoke and smears from the nameless doctrine advocates. The germane verses actually support the view that God judges impartially according to the individual's works.

Tendor · Aug 13, 2016

Iconoclast said:
"Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honor the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour." (Leviticus 19: 15 KJV)

"Thou shalt not wrest judgment; thou shalt not respect persons, neither take a gift: for a gift doth blind the eyes of the wise, and pervert the words of the righteous." (Deuteronomy 16: 19 KJV)

"For we must needs die, and are as water spilt on the ground, which cannot be gathered up again; neither doth God respect any person: yet doth he devise means,
that his banished be not expelled from him." (II Samuel 14: 14 KJV)

"Wherefore now let the fear of the LORD be upon you; take heed and do it: for there is no iniquity with the LORD our God, nor respect of persons, nor taking of gifts." (II Chronicles 19: 7 KJV)

"These things also belong to the wise. It is not good to have respect of persons in judgment." (Proverbs 24: 23 KJV)

"To have respect of persons is not good: for for a piece of bread that man will transgress." (Proverbs 28: 21 KJV)

"And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man's work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear." (I Peter 1: 17 KJV)

"God is no respecter of persons." (Acts 10: 34)

Well said, I have never considered these verses to be a support for unconditional election but it makes sense. If God does not want human judges to make decisions based on the position of the people needed to be judged then why would He act in a different manner?

Van · Aug 14, 2016

God judging impartially is not people judging with partiality. That is absurd.

2 Thessalonians 2:13 teaches the lost were chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. Deal with it.

Martin Marprelate · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
God judging impartially is not people judging with partiality. That is absurd.

Having skimmed through the thread, I cannot see that anyone has suggested that it is.
[/QUOTE]
2 Thessalonians 2:13 teaches the lost were chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. Deal with it.[/QUOTE]
Of course sinners are chosen by God for salvation through faith in the truth. Whoever has suggested otherwise? The question is, where does this faith come from?

1 Corinthians 4:7. 'For who makes you differ from another?' It is nothing but God's grace that distinguishes the believer from the unbeliever. We 'were by nature children of wrath, just as the rest' (Ephesians 2:3).
'........And what do you have that you did not receive? Nothing. 'Otherwise grace is no longer grace' (Romans 11:6).

Iconoclast · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
God judging impartially is not people judging with partiality. That is absurd.

2 Thessalonians 2:13 teaches the lost were chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. Deal with it.

Biblicist has dealt with it in detail that eludes you.

Tendor · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
What we have here is yet another Trojan horse, this time pushing unconditional election. But as we all know, 2 Thess. 2:13 is crystal, our election for salvation was through faith in the truth.

How is his post a Trojan Horse? There is nothing secretive about it. Iconoclast made his point in a very direct manner. A Trojan Horse is a person or thing intended to undermine or destroy from within. Unless you think Iconoclast is a giant wooden horse then the definition would be different than the one I just posted.
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/trojan--horse

Van · Aug 14, 2016

Posts presenting Calvinist doctrine are supposed to be posted in the Cal/Arm forum. But if you tweak the subject and embed the doctrine within the post, then it is a Trojan Horse. And note the horse was not the person but the post.

Fact, we are chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. Thus our election for salvation is conditional. Even Martin admits this obvious truth.

God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble.

He who believes is not judged, but he who does not believe has been judged already.

God makes choices sometimes based in part of the characteristics of those chosen, i.e. those that are rich in faith and heirs to the kingdom promised to those who love God. He is the one who credits our faith as righteousness or not. God is an impartial judge, but a judge none the less.

Tendor · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
Repeating nonsense does not validate it.

Well said. So, why aren't you following your own statement?

Over and over in scripture God is shown to choose people according to His purpose, such as giving grace to the humble. God is not a respecter of persons according to the world's value system. Such a simple concept, but those inside the Trojan Horse are unable to see the light. Does He choose those rich in faith and heirs to the kingdom promised to those who love God? Yes. Does He choose the foolish to shame the wise? Yes Does He proclaim your faith has healed you? Or your faith has saved you? Of course.

You seem to be ignoring the fact the God is the one who grants people with humility, faith, love for Him, and makes people heirs to the Kingdom of God.

John 15:5 I am the vine; you are the branches. Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing.

Notice the last part of that verse, apart from me you can do nothing. we cannot have humility, faith or a love for God apart from Him. So, God chooses them and then he given his people faith, a love for Him, humility, and makes them heirs of His Kingdom.

Van · Aug 14, 2016

You seem to be ignoring the fact the God is the one who grants people with humility, faith, love for Him, and makes people heirs to the Kingdom of God.

This assertion is fiction. God does not compel some people to be proud so He can then oppose them, and compel others to humble themselves so He can grant them grace. No verse or passage says or suggests that. If you are an exhaustive determinist, then do you believe God is the author of sin?

All the works of righteousness of the fallen as as filthy rags. But God says He can credit our "filthy rag faith" as righteousness. God looked with favor upon Noah, upon Abraham, Jacob, and so forth. They were all fallen yet gained approval through faith.

John 15:5 says if we are born anew (and therefore are indwelt) we not only abide in Christ, but Christ abides in us. We are therefore a new creation created for good works. Otherwise all our works of righteousness are as filthy rags. And the fruit in view is built on the foundation of Christ and earns rewards as we enter heaven "abundantly."

Final observation, since you believe we should avoid nonsense. 2 Thess. 2:13 says we were chosen for salvation through faith in the truth, not chosen and given faith, humility or a love for God. No verse says otherwise, so your assertion is fiction.

Tendor · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
You seem to be ignoring the fact the God is the one who grants people with humility, faith, love for Him, and makes people heirs to the Kingdom of God.

This assertion is fiction. God does not compel some people to be proud so He can then oppose them, and compel others to humble themselves so He can grant them grace. No verse or passage says or suggests that. If you are an exhaustive determinist, then do you believe God is the author of sin?

All the works of righteousness of the fallen as as filthy rags. But God says He can credit our "filthy rag faith" as righteousness. God looked with favor upon Noah, upon Abraham, Jacob, and so forth. They were all fallen yet gained approval through faith.

John 15:5 says if we are born anew (and therefore are indwelt) we not only abide in Christ, but Christ abides in us. We are therefore a new creation created for good works. Otherwise all our works of righteousness are as filthy rags. And the fruit in view is built on the foundation of Christ and earns rewards as we enter heaven "abundantly."

Final observation, since you believe we should avoid nonsense. 2 Thess. 2:13 says we were chosen for salvation through faith in the truth, not chosen and given faith, humility or a love for God. No verse says otherwise, so your assertion is fiction.

I am curious is there a difference between being wrong and writing fiction? You seem to like to say that people who disagree with you post fiction?

Also, do you make it a habit of hinting that people who disagree with you believe obvious heresy like God is the author of sin?

On another note, I never said that God compels people to be proud. I said that he gives people humility. There is a difference between the two. People are naturally proud given that they have a fallen nature prior to salvation. God is the one enables us to live in a manner worthy of the calling He has given us. Colossians 2:13 says And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,
You will have a hard time finding people who are dead in their trespasses and the uncircumcision of their flesh doing anything that will please God.

Internet Theologian · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
More smoke and smears from the nameless doctrine advocates. The germane verses actually support the view that God judges impartially according to the individual's works.

Let's continue your heterodox path and apply it to, say, YOU. So, are you working your way to heaven, and, will God notice, or has He already noticed this in the past? In your view, taken to its logical and absurd end, God is in heaven simply confirming persons. If they already please God, there is no need for salvation.

Martin Marprelate · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
Thus our election for salvation is conditional. Even Martin admits this obvious truth.

No he doesn't. Don't smear me with your errors. Just read my post. And read 2 Thessalonians 2:13, the text you are mangling so horribly.

Van · Aug 14, 2016

Tendor said:
I am curious is there a difference between being wrong and writing fiction? You seem to like to say that people who disagree with you post fiction?

Also, do you make it a habit of hinting that people who disagree with you believe obvious heresy like God is the author of sin?

On another note, I never said that God compels people to be proud. I said that he gives people humility. There is a difference between the two. People are naturally proud given that they have a fallen nature prior to salvation. God is the one enables us to live in a manner worthy of the calling He has given us. Colossians 2:13 says And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,
You will have a hard time finding people who are dead in their trespasses and the uncircumcision of their flesh doing anything that will please God.

Note once again the Van rule, when someone starts a sentence with "you seem to be saying" what follows is never what I said.

If you do not believe God compels people to sin, then you are not an exhaustive determinist. No verse or passage says or suggests God compels people to be humble so He can give them grace. That view is fiction.

It is very easy to find examples of fallen people doing things that God approves. Matthew 23:13 has people entering the kingdom of heaven until blocked by false teachers. God commands us to seek God and they were striving to do it.

When Jesus says, "your faith has saved you" obviously they had faith before they were made alive together with Christ.

Bottom line, scripture after scripture teaches fallen people sometimes seek God, whereas no verse or passage ever says fallen people never seek God at any time.

Van · Aug 14, 2016

Martin said:
Of course sinners are chosen by God for salvation through faith in the truth.

Martin said:
No he doesn't. Don't smear me with your errors. Just read my post.

Quote without comment.

Van · Aug 14, 2016

Here is the latest fiction from IT.

Let's continue your heterodox path and apply it to, say, YOU. So, are you working your way to heaven, and, will God notice, or has He already noticed this in the past? In your view, taken to its logical and absurd end, God is in heaven simply confirming persons. If they already please God, there is no need for salvation.

Did I say or suggest anyone can work their way to heaven? Nope. So a slanderous falsehood directed at me.

Did I say there is no need for salvation? Nope. So a second slanderous falsehood directed at me.

What is the truth? Whoever believes into Him will not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16. God takes notice of our faith, as it provides our access to the grace in which we stand. Romans 5:2. God chooses us for salvation through faith in the truth. We are saved by grace through faith. Ephesians 2:8.

Pay no attention to how IT portrays another person's view, unless supported by a quote.

Internet Theologian · Aug 14, 2016

Van said:
Here is the latest fiction from IT.

Did I say or suggest anyone can work their way to heaven? Nope. So a slanderous falsehood directed at me.

Did I say there is no need for salvation? Nope. So a second slanderous falsehood directed at me.

What is the truth? Whoever believes into Him will not perish but have eternal life. John 3:16. God takes notice of our faith, as it provides our access to the grace in which we stand. Romans 5:2. God chooses us for salvation through faith in the truth. We are saved by grace through faith. Ephesians 2:8.

Pay no attention to how IT portrays another person's view, unless supported by a quote.

You show a vast and remarkable ignorance to your own stated views and stance when it is clearly presented by another, namely me.

I figured as much.

My post represented you in a crystal clear manner, in complete representation of your views, and you've missed it entirely. But, I'm being redundant, and, you? Being consistently inconsistent, you'll miss that as well.

SovereignGrace · Aug 14, 2016

Tendor said:
I am curious is there a difference between being wrong and writing fiction? You seem to like to say that people who disagree with you post fiction?

Also, do you make it a habit of hinting that people who disagree with you believe obvious heresy like God is the author of sin?

On another note, I never said that God compels people to be proud. I said that he gives people humility. There is a difference between the two. People are naturally proud given that they have a fallen nature prior to salvation. God is the one enables us to live in a manner worthy of the calling He has given us. Colossians 2:13 says And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,
You will have a hard time finding people who are dead in their trespasses and the uncircumcision of their flesh doing anything that will please God.

You need to remember this about Van...

He says fallen men can and do seek God when the bible affirms they do not...
He says fallen men can understand the sincere milk of the gospel when the bible affirms they can not even receive it...
He says our election is conditional when the bible avers differently...
He says God is a respector of persons when the bible avows He is not..

You see the pattern here Brother?

Once is a coincidence, twice is a trend and three times a habit...

Iconoclast · Aug 14, 2016

"Van,

Posts presenting Calvinist doctrine are supposed to be posted in the Cal/Arm forum.

The OP is clear on the biblical topic-

34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

That is the topic.....the fact that the link uses other biblical truth is not a problem to those who understand the grace of God.

But if you tweak the subject and embed the doctrine within the post, then it is a Trojan Horse.

The link used offers some side discussion as proof of the verses. No one said you had to post anything if you did not like or understand the discussion. You inserted yourself and your false views into the thread.

Fact, we are chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. Thus our election for salvation is conditional.

Showing once again your lack of understanding of this topic.

respector of persons?

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member