1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Critique of The Way of the Master

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by John of Japan, Jan 5, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Top Posters
Page 2 of 8
  1. John of Japan

    John of Japan Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    Messages:
    19,633
    Likes Received:
    1,832
    Faith:
    Baptist
    In Hell's Best Kept Secret he recommends tongues, but not in this book. He only mentions the fullness of the Spirit in this book, but does not teach it at all.
     
    #21 John of Japan, Jan 6, 2017
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    So the Holy Spirit cannot convict apart from the Law?
     
    #22 Yeshua1, Jan 6, 2017
  3. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    He mus have some interesting views on the workings of the Holy Spirit then!
     
    #23 Yeshua1, Jan 6, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2017
  4. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    10,285
    Likes Received:
    163
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Well said
     
    #24 evangelist6589, Jan 6, 2017
  5. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2010
    Messages:
    10,285
    Likes Received:
    163
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Then why criticize the book?
     
    #25 evangelist6589, Jan 6, 2017
  6. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    But not the conviction of it, as that requires the Holy Spirit, and thu the Gospel itself!
     
    #26 Yeshua1, Jan 6, 2017
  7. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    26,977
    Likes Received:
    2,537
    Faith:
    Baptist
    God can do as He pleases but normally speaking Y how would you know if you have sinned?
    How did you personally know that you were a sinner in need of a Savior?
    What is it that brought you to that conclusion?

    It does not have to be an exact verse from the Torah but an infraction of the law which causes guilt.

    If you hit you neighbor in the head with a hammer that is an infraction of the law which works with the conscience.

    Leviticus 19:18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

    HankD
     
    #27 HankD, Jan 6, 2017
  8. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    He i
    The message ofthe Cross is what the Lord used to save me, not the hearing of the Mosaic Law!
     
    #28 Yeshua1, Jan 6, 2017
  9. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    My biggest problem with Ray Comfort and TWOTM is his insistence that the method is the way Jesus evangelized when, clearly, it is not. Comfort has developed a method and it works for him. I say kudos – keep up the good work brother. But then he goes back and fabricates support for the position and in the process denounces the work of others. I wish that Comfort had stopped at “this is how I do it, and God seems to be using it to reach others.” But unfortunately, he didn’t.

    I would never recommend The Way of The Master to a local church or believer, not because I am opposed to the method it teaches but because I am opposed to the false doctrine that accompanies that method. I would worry that by advocating Comfort’s materials I would also be inadvertently supporting and even encouraging bad theology, poor hermeneutics and a carelessness with God's Word. We cannot support bad doctrine simply because it sounds good or encourages others to do a good work because if we do then we have absolutely no ground upon which to stand when someone else advocates false doctrine to support their program.
     
    #29 JonC, Jan 6, 2017
    • Like Like x 2
    • Winner Winner x 1
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    What spects of it are bad thology and bad understanding of the scriptures?
     
    #30 Yeshua1, Jan 6, 2017
  11. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    26,977
    Likes Received:
    2,537
    Faith:
    Baptist
    What exactly is that message Y?

    HankD
     
    #31 HankD, Jan 6, 2017
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Jesus is God in human flesh, died on the Cross in my place, and rose again for me, and I need to accept/receive Him in order to besaved by God!
     
    #32 Yeshua1, Jan 6, 2017
  13. JonShaff

    JonShaff Fellow Servant
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2015
    Messages:
    2,954
    Likes Received:
    425
    Faith:
    Baptist
    John 16

    7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

    8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

    9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;

    There seems to be this intrinsic desire to "have a right standing". We don't want to be guilty of Anything. And as lost people, we would go to great lengths to "Justify our selves" regardless of the situation, and concerning our Position before God, we think WE can make this right with Him. And that is What the Holy Spirit does, convicts us that we are GUILTY because we have not believed on His Son. Had we believed, we wouldn't be found guilty :)
     
    #33 JonShaff, Jan 6, 2017
  14. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    26,977
    Likes Received:
    2,537
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Exactly Jon also:

    1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

    HankD
     
    #34 HankD, Jan 6, 2017
  15. JonShaff

    JonShaff Fellow Servant
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2015
    Messages:
    2,954
    Likes Received:
    425
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I added a comment to the Scripture, sorry :)
     
    #35 JonShaff, Jan 6, 2017
  16. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    26,977
    Likes Received:
    2,537
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I don't know why you are so reluctant to say that Christ died for your sins Y.

    1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

    HankD
     
    #36 HankD, Jan 6, 2017
  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I did, He died in my place!
     
    #37 Yeshua1, Jan 6, 2017
  18. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    26,977
    Likes Received:
    2,537
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Nevermind.

    HankD
     
    #38 HankD, Jan 6, 2017
  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Here are a few:
    On page 47 Comfort examines the account of the “rich young ruler”. He concludes that Jesus used the Law to reveal the man’s hidden sin (idolatry), and asks why Jesus used the Ten Commandments in his dealing with the man. His answer is that “true evangelism must always start by preaching the Law.”

    On page 80, it’s explained that “woman at the well had transgressed the seventh commandment, and without the righteousness of Christ, she would perish. The Law makes us thirst after righteousness that we would otherwise have no desire for.” But in Scripture, Jesus’ words of the woman’s adultery was not a conviction under the Law intended to make her thirst after righteousness. Instead it served as a sign that Jesus was the messiah for which they longed (Samaritans were considered half-breeds, both ethnically and in terms of religion. But they also looked for a messiah, more along the lines of a prophet like Moses). Comfort bends the narrative to suit his method.

    Comfort consistently mistakes God’s Law to be “the Ten Commandments.” Even if we take it to be God’s moral law, we can see it expressed in the Ten Commandments, but the former is much greater than the latter. Comfort confuses the nature and purpose of the Law. This is evident at the start – “If God judges you by the Ten Commandments on the Day of Judgment”. Just as with his evangelism, Comfort confuses the standard to be the Law rather than Christ.

    The reason knowing the Law is necessary for salvation is “no Law, no sin, no wrath, no repentance, no salvation.” The Law must give people a knowledge of sin, or they will perish. Comfort reduces sin down to breaking one of the Ten Commandments. He even states that non-believers are going to be judged in accordance to the Ten Commandments. Instead of understanding that the Law magnified or showed us our sin, Comfort adopts the Law as the standard of righteousness.
     
    #39 JonC, Jan 6, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
  20. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 14, 2001
    Messages:
    26,977
    Likes Received:
    2,537
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The conscience is also used by the Spirit to convict/reprove of sin.
    But there is a basis, an essential that the conscience functions on.

    Do unto others...
    Whether I hear, know and/or believe the 10 commandments I don't want anyone to break into my house and steal stuff so it is reasonable that I shouldn't steal from another either.

    HankD
     
    #40 HankD, Jan 6, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
Page 2 of 8
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...