Speaking in Tongues Volume 4...

Because I haven't. I have answered every objection you have thrown at me with Scripture. You fail to believe God's Word, and his promises. Let's consider some of the facts:

Faith healers? Where are they? Can you point to even one faith healer alive today that has the Biblical gift of healling and can practice along the same lines as the apostles did in Acts 5:16?

Miracles? Can you point to any individual today that has "the gift of miracles," which would include raising the dead. That would be in the same catetgory as Lazarus who had been dead and buried for four days. In other words it was very public; he had been dead for sometime without any help of hospital machinery. In fact it would be good evidence if he had been buried. Can you raise the dead? Can anyone?
What about walking on water as Jesus instructed Peter to do? Any volunteers for that?

Acts 5:15 Insomuch that they brought forth the sick into the streets, and laid them on beds and couches, that at the least the shadow of Peter passing by might overshadow some of them.

How many people do you know today that can heal simply by having their shadow passing over them? These were the miracles of the apostles--the gifts of miracles and healings. Are they present today? The answer is a resounding NO!

So, what about the gift of tongues, otherwise called the gift of languages in most other translations. For that is what they are--real actual languages, foreign languages as described in Acts 2. How common do you see people speak in actual foreign languages that are verified by others in the congregation, that someone in the congregation interprets, so that all in the congreation--whether by interpretation or by the foreign language (tongue) may be edified. That doesn't happen does it? The gift of languages has ceased.

What does the Scripture say?
Hebrews 2:3-4 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him; God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?
--The message of salvation was confirmed unto the apostles (now dead), by signs and wonders, various miracles, and the gifts of the Holy Spirit.
What were the signs of a true apostle. How did people know a true apostle from a false apostle?
Read the Bible--by signs, wonders, miracles and the gifts of the Spirit. Not everyone had these gifts, and not everyone could do miracles. They were given particularly to the Apostles, and especially for the Apostolic Age. It is very evident that they are not for today, in just this verse alone. They were the signs of an apostle.

Next verse:
2 Corinthians 12:12 Truly the signs of an apostle were wrought among you in all patience, in signs, and wonders, and mighty deeds.
--The same corroborating evidence that Paul gives.
What are the signs of an Apostle? One knew a true Apostle because of the signs, wonders, and mighty deeds that he had the ability to do. These signs and wonders; the gift of miracles and healings, were the sign of an apostle. Paul verifies what the author of the Book of Hebrews has just said. The Scripture does not contradict itself. The Apostles all died in the first century, along with the gifts of the Spirit.

Why else did the cease in the first century?
More Scripture:
1 Corinthians 14:21 In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.
--This is a quote from Isa.28:11,12. Jehovah is speaking to the nation of Israel. He is giving the a sign. The sign is speaking in tongues, i.e., foreign languages. That is what happened on the day of Pentecost, and it happened in Acts 10 and in Acts 19, both times when Jews were present. It was a sign to the Jews that the message was from God. If they did not heed the message of the Apostles judgement would surely come upon them, and it did. It came in 70 A.D. Thus there is no longer any need for the sign. It has been removed out of the way. It ceased. The Jews of the first century no longer exist. Tongues no longer exist.

1Cor.13:8 state that tongues shall cease. Scripture points to the fact that they have. Charismatics, contrary to Scripture, demand that tongues are continuing when in fact they have ceased. They fail to believe the Scriptures in this matter.

A careful study of 1Cor.13:8-13 proves that tongues have ceased. There are many arguments within that chapter itself that point to the cessation of tongues.

But your inability to counter these points on a Scriptural basis demonstrates that you value experience above the Word of God. As most Charismatics do; they base their theology on their experience, and not the Bible.
DHK

 

D28guy,

That was a powerful and insightful post.

I have always walked and talked carefully especially as to the things of the Spirit of God. We are cautioned not to 'grieve the Holy Spirit' as Christians. If I recall the verse is in Ephesians 4:30.

The Pharisees spoke against God and where did they end up at?

You would think that true Christians would be more careful than a Pharisee during the time of Christ's mission here on earth.

 

The same tactics as Satan? You mean like lying wonders?

No one here is condemning anyone, but we do have a concern for our brethren that they are being decieved, and we are concerned that they are decieving others through experiential things that appeal to the flesh, but have no basis in Scripture.

 

I Cor. 12:28 does not say that tongues are the least of gifts as you claim.
There are other gifts listed in I Corinthians.
Show me a scrripture that says that tongues are the least of the gifts.
Your seminary teacher or sunday School teacher may have told you tha but the Bible does not say that.
THis scripture does not say that

 

YOur line of thinking would suggest that these mentioned in I Cor 12:28 are the most important gifts among these would be tongues.
there are others such as prophecy, word of wisdom ,word of knowledge, faith .
the fact is that no gift of god is least nor is any gift the greatest. There is a fruit of the Spirit called love that is more important than gifts but this does not mean that gifts are unimportant or that anything is the least.
If you want to list them in order of mention then you would have to admit that tongues would be more important thatn interpretations of tongues since it is mentioned last but i don't think that lines up with scripture.
BTW There abide three things Faith, Hope ,And Love and the greatest of these would have to be Faith if you list them in order of a sentence.

 

I am thankful to the Lord for the truth that you affirm as the 'Alabama Roll Tide!!!' passes before us.

Even the 'gift of helps' does not mean that we can cast that gift off, ignore it, or the people who oil the workings of the local church. Every Christian is need in doing his or her part in the life of the church. Just as the Giver does not go away neither do His gifts nor those who have experienced Him and them.

 

.

 

You are comparing apples with oranges. You are deliberatle changing the promise of God in Mark 16 to read something that it doesn't mean simply to justify your own foolish doctrine. It means what it says. There is no accidentally in the verse. There is no "tempting God" in the verse. It is a direct promise of God that the Charismatics will not take God up on. If you want a similar parallel, was Abraham "tempting" God when he took Isaak, his only son and "offered" him on the altar as a sacrifice to God? That is what God commanded him to do. Was he tempting God? No, he was following a promise of faith. The same would be true in Mark 16 IF you believed that these promises were for today. But they are not for today. They were for the Apostolic age. They were part of the signs and wonders given to the Apostles to verify that the Apostles and their message were indeed from God.
DHK

 

And you said...

Thats not what I am talking about!

We have answered all of your objections thrown at us with scripture. Reams of it. Over and over again. </font>[/QUOTE]But you haven't answered my last post where I concisely listed the objections to your position which I believe you cannot adequately and Scripturally answer.
DHK

 

Amen, DHK.

A good example of showing it was for the apostle's day is the story

Acts 28:3 And when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks, and laid [them] on the fire, there came a viper out of the heat, and fastened on his hand.
Acts 28:4 And when the barbarians saw the [venomous] beast hang on his hand, they said among themselves, No doubt this man is a murderer, whom, though he hath escaped the sea, yet vengeance suffereth not to live.
Acts 28:5 And he shook off the beast into the fire, and felt no harm.
Acts 28:6 Howbeit they looked when he should have swollen, or fallen down dead suddenly: but after they had looked a great while, and saw no harm come to him, they changed their minds, and said that he was a god.

Now there was a miracle! And it was not a thing of tempting God as many snake-handling and poison drinking churches do today.

Oh yes, there are churches with members who indeed drink poison, small amounts over the years have immunized their bodies to larger amounts; and they claim it is of God. But we are not to tempt the Lord our God. Our Father's house is to be a house of prayer, not a snake pit, nor a side-show.

 

StandingfirminChrist said:
Oh yes, there are churches with members who indeed drink poison, small amounts over the years have immunized their bodies to larger amounts; and they claim it is of God. But we are not to tempt the Lord our God. Our Father's house is to be a house of prayer, not a snake pit, nor a side-show.

that is exactly OUR point. When God does something, He does it. But to FORCE something into happening is tempting God!!

That is what the snake handlers and poisen drinkers do and it ought not to be done.

Leave all that hocus-pocus in God's hands amd let the Holy Spirit do His work!
Sheesh!!

Selah,

Tam

 

Why would God not give the gift of tongues to missionerys today if they were legitimate? I know of not a single missionery in the world that doesn't have to know/learn the language of the people he'll serve. Not one, and no one else on this board does either.

Tongues left with all the other sign gifts early in 1st century. These gifts were signs to Israel.

 

Bottom line is there is not a church in the world practicing biblical tonugues. NOT ONE! If I am wrong please tell me the church. It is all fakery and deceitfulness.

 

tim,
I would have to say we are in complete agreement.

I know of not one church in the entire world that is practicing biblical tonugues (pronounced two-noogies, I think.) I think there are some pagan groups that like to give people two noogies (tonugues), but I do not know of any Christian church in the entire world that practice this.

Now, God the Holy Spirit still gives the gift of tongues, which is practiced validly in many churches around the world.