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Part 2 Spiritual Death

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by percho, Feb 17, 2020.

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  1. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    ↑Percho said
    So, this light, "Let there be light: and there was light. And God saw the light, that good: G 1:3,4 - was this light, "And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also." G 1:16?

    What is the light of Acts 26:18? What is the darkness of Acts 26:18?

    Your best guess, who was and where was, the great dragon, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, when God said. "Let there be light,"?


    Jon answered
    In that context, I believe the Light was already there (He did not need to be spoken into existence).
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    He wasn't speaking himself into existence, He was speaking himself into, his presence, contrasted to the darkness that was upon the face of the deep, on the earth.

    Again, who was and where was, the great dragon, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, when God said. "Let there be light,"?

    Considering:
    He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 1 John 3:8
    Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; Heb 2:14

    Where was the devil when God said, "let there be light'? That said, "Out of darkness the light to shine".

    Was the sinful devil with the power of death, present on the earth, before God created man in his own image yet made man a little lower than the angels, because of said death?

    Why had it already been foreordained that, Christ as of a lamb without blemish and without spot, was going to shed his precious blood?

    I believe everything took place in the garden of Eden just as God intended for it to take place.

    Read John 1:4-9 and remember
    In the fulness of time
    God sent his Son
    born of woman
    born under law
     
    #1 percho, Feb 17, 2020
  2. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    There is too much speculation required me me to comment on much of this.

    But darkness is simply the absence of light. If you are outside a house when a light is switched on, you see the light flooding out. But when the light is switched off, you don't see the darkness flooding back in. There is simply an absence of light.
    When God said, "Let there be light," the Triune God lit up the world. In the same way, when the Lord Jesus came into the world, He dispelled the darkness of ignorance and sin, and the darkness has still not overcome it. The 'Gentiles' of Acts of the Apostles 26:18, were in darkness; the knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ dispels it.

    The other thing I know is that the earth was a better place for Adam being in it. Before, it was 'good;' afterwards, until he fell into sin, it was 'very good.' All speculations have to take this fact into account. Either Satan had not yet come to earth at this time, or he had not yet fallen.

    But did God not know that Adam would fall under the temptation of Satan? Of course He did, and had in eternity arranged His plan. '....Eternal life, which God, who cannot lie, promised before time began' (Titus 1:2).
     
    #2 Martin Marprelate, Feb 17, 2020
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  3. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    When God declared, "Let there be Light," He was declaring his good presence here on the earth with the darkness of Satan.
    He divided the two into equal parts of twelve hours day and night and the evening which was present and the morning which had been declared were the first day. The same concept of good and evil is seen in John 11 relative to hours and many other places in the word of God relative to good and evil.

    For the creation (That which was called by God as very good) was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it in hope; Rom 8:20


    God subjected the very good creation to futility before Adam sinned, in hope. ------ Why?

    V 21 because the creation itself also will be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.

    Where did this bondage truly come from? Adam?

    Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, (The creation of Adam) he also himself likewise took part of the same; (Flesh and blood) that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage. The bondage of corruption in Rom 8.

    Why is the Son of God manifested like Adam who was created in the image of his creator? Because before Adam was created, before God said Let there be Light the devil had sinned and had been doing works.

    He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil. 1 John 3:8

    Man had to be created flesh and blood and subjected to the power of the devil in order the Son of God could be manifested an flesh and blood to destroy the devil and his works.

    The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 1 Cor 15:45,46

    To date one Man born of woman has experienced that.

    And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly. V49

    We will be a higher creation than the very good Adam.
     
    #3 percho, Feb 18, 2020
  4. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    I do not agree that creation was subject to futility before Adam sinned. The curse on the ground, with the thorns and thistles and the sweated labour came after Adam's fall.
    It came from Adam, but only after he sinned. To say otherwise is pure speculation.
    Satan had no power of death before Adam sinned. It was that sin which introduced death into the world (Genesis 2:17). Now look at Romans 5:12. Therefore just as by one man sin entered the world, and death through sin.....' The world was without sin before Adam introduced it. Admittedly, it was through the temptation of Satan, but Adam was responsible to obey God, and it was his failure to do so that gave Satan the power of death as the accuser of the brethren.
    He may have been, but not on earth. The earth was 'very good.'
    The 'beginning' from which the devil sinned (at least, insofar as it affected mankind) was his temptation of Adam and Eve. There appears to be his seduction of some of the angels (Jude 6 etc.), but details are lacking.
    that is an inversion of what Hebrews 2:14 says. It is because Man was created flesh and blood that the Son of God had to come in the likeness of sinful flesh in order to destroy the works of the devil. And what were those works? His temptation of the first couple. Flesh and blood was not sinful until Adam fell (Genesis 5:1-3).
    Your last line is correct. Adam was created sinless but defectable. In the new heavens and new earth, we shall be finished with sin forever (Isaiah 65:25; Revelation 22:3-5).
     
    #4 Martin Marprelate, Feb 18, 2020
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I think light and dark were literally describing first day, when God used Sun and Moon to split day in half!
     
    #5 Yeshua1, Feb 18, 2020
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