Featured Does God Ordain Our Sins?

He uses sin to increase your punishment. He glories in the suffering of the wicked. It's not about you. It's about his glory.

 

You are confusing OT Law that could not save. And killed for disobedience. With Grace which results in salvation.

 

And it's a growing movement.

 

Your grammatical aspirations do not work in Greek.

There is no good reason for weakening the predestinarian note here, as (e.g.) H. Alford does by rendering “as many as were disposed to eternal life.” The Greek participle is τεταγμένος from τάσσω, and there is papyrus evidence for the use of this verb in the sense of “inscribe” or “enroll” (cf. ὁρισμὸν ἔταξας, “thou hast signed a decree,” in Theodotion’s version of Dan. 6:12). The idea of being enrolled in the book of life or the like is found in several biblical contexts (e.g., Ex. 32:32–33; Ps. 69 [LXX 68]:28; Isa. 4:3; Dan. 12:1; Luke 10:20; Phil. 4:3; Rev. 13:8; 17:8; 20:12–15; 21:27), in the pseudepigrapha (e.g., Jub. 30:20; 1 Enoch 47:3; 104:1; 108:3), and in rabbinical literature (e.g., TJ Rosh ha-Shanah 1.9.57a; TB Rosh ha-Shanah 16b). The Targum of Jonathan on Isa. 4:3 (“written among the living”) explains this as being “written for the life of the age to come” (i.e., eternal life).

F. F. Bruce, The Book of the Acts, The New International Commentary on the New Testament (Grand Rapids, MI: Wm. B. Eerdmans Publishing Co., 1988).
​

What is more, the grammar cannot be construed to suggest that the gentiles enrolled themselves.

They were those who were “appointed for eternal life.” In this phrase we encounter the same balance between human volition and divine providence that is found throughout Acts. On their part these Gentiles took an active role in believing, in committing themselves to Christ; but it was in response to God’s Spirit moving in them, convicting them, appointing them for life. All salvation is ultimately only by the grace of God.

John B. Polhill, Acts, vol. 26, The New American Commentary (Nashville: Broadman & Holman Publishers, 1992), 308.​

The Archangel

 

I get my Greek from Scrivener's Received Text, and I use Strong's concordance through Blue Letter Bible.

But the truth is, is that I have always known what "ordained to eternal life" means when I look at Acts of the Apostles 13:48.
It means exactly what it says.

As I see it, it can correctly be determined by believing it as it stands, and as some here like to point out...
Literally.
In addition, it's the same word in other parts of the New Testament where the word "ordained" or "appointed" is used.
Some examples are Matthew 28:16, Acts of the Apostles 22:10, Acts of the Apostles 28:23 and Romans 13:1.

"...the powers that be are ordained of God."

Amen.
To the Jews first, and also to the "Greek" ( Romans 1:16 ).

Salvation is "of" ( originating with ) the Jews, see John 4:22.

I disagree.
The Lord Jesus told them that it would start with the Jews in Luke 24:47.

"And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem."

The Lord also sent them various places though His own guidance, through visions and the leading of the Holy Ghost.
He even told Paul to speak in Corinth and to not be afraid, because He had "much people" in that city.

People "enroll" themselves ( read, cooperate with God in order to gain His favor by performing an act which He will then release His grace to them based on the successful performance of that act ) into the kingdom of Heaven?

Am I reading that right?

If so, I have to ask...
That doesn't seem strange to you, that the way you're reading it is that a person has to first satisfy God's "requirement", before He will save them?
It does to me.
In fact, that is exactly what Roman Catholic "Molinism" teaches, my friend.

Are you sure you're seeing it correctly?

The reason I ask, is that according to God's word, if we as men mix any of our own efforts in to God's work of grace, it becomes works ( Romans 11:5-6 ).
In effect, God becomes a debtor in the sense of Romans 4:4, and the gift is turned into a reward.

 

Yet, you just stated above in posts 106 and 108, that a person has to enroll themselves into the kingdom...

So to me, you not only suggested it, you outright stated that that is how a person is saved...
By enrolling themselves into the kingdom of Heaven.

Here is your quote from post# 106:

Therefore and according to what you've stated ( at least to me ) is that one can indeed save themselves by enrolling ( or believing ) their way into the kingdom.
I also see that on the one hand you're stating that it was not their own doing, but then on the other you state that they first needed to comply with the Gospel.

Is this correct?

If not, then please clarify how enrolling ones' self into the kingdom of Heaven ( and needing to first comply with the Gospel ) is not a person saving themselves by their act of enrollment and their compliance.

 

If you read the context, God is not willing that any of USWARD perish. He most certainly wills the perishing of all non-elect or they would be saved too.

 

Wow... You really don't know Greek, do you? First, τεταγμένοι is not a verb; it is a participle. Second, the "οι" ending is not at all what makes the word a middle or passive participle; the form of the word does. The "οι" is what deals with gender and number. Third, while it is possible τεταγμένοι can be middle or passive, the middle usage is quite rare in the New Testament, especially in Luke.

Daniel Wallace explains:

The problem with taking the verb in Acts 13:48 as a middle is that it would have to be a direct middle (the idea would be 'they appointed themselves'), which is nonsense in this context and is extremely rare of a usage overall. I know of no linguistic ground for overturning the traditional translation here. (source)​

The Archangel

 

And that is TRUE... But its not the FEW... Who YOU... Attribute it too... If it was, Heaven would be EMPTY... Brother Glen

Revelation 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

7:10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.

 

To me, they did so because they were ordained to eternal life by the Lord Himself.
Again, "passive voice".

People "receive Christ" ( John 1:11-13 ) because God the Father gave a people to His Son...
Not because we "reached out" and took it of our own volition or because we somehow "met God halfway" by our belief of His words and by "enrolling ourselves" into His kingdom...
He is the one who enrolled those that would someday believe on His Son:
Known unto Him are all His works ( Acts of the Apostles 15:18 ) which were finished from the foundation of the world ( Hebrews 4:3 ).

Again, Acts of the Apostles 13:48, and we can then add Romans 8:28-30, Ephesians 1:3-11, 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14 and several others;
Including John 6:37-68.

We find this proof that it is God alone that saves according to His grace sprinkled throughout God's word...
That He does the choosing, and causing a person to approach unto Him ( Psalms 65:4 ).
That cause is the inward call of the Holy Spirit to one of God's precious children ( 1 Corinthians 1:9 ).

They come when they are called because it is given to them to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God ( Matthew 13:10-12 ), because they have ears to hear ( Matthew 11:15, John 8:43-47, Revelation 3:13, Revelation 3:22 ), because they are His sheep and have been given eternal life ( John 3:36, John 5:24, John 10:26-27 ) and because they were given to Him by His Father ( John 6:37, John 6:44, John 6:65, John 17:2 ).
He did all this for His great love wherewith He loved them, even when they were dead in trespasses and sins ( Ephesians 2:1-6 ).

They are vessels of mercy which He has afore prepared unto glory ( Romans 9:23-24 ) and His workmanship, created "in Christ Jesus" ( Ephesians 2:10 ) for one specific purpose...

To the praise of the glory of His grace ( Ephesians 1:6 ).



Respectfully,
I don't need to fully understand Koine Greek, as the Lord has preserved His word for me to examine for myself in my own language.
I understand English grammar, and I take my "theology" out of God's word.

To clarify and in case there is any doubt as to why I hold to what I do:

I do not read the writings of men who have come before me, and then take their conclusions and commentaries and read those understandings back into the Bible.
Some may do that, but I do not.
I see "unconditional election" and many other truths by carefully reading and believing the words on the page...and in cases where I do not, I continue my studies and leave it to the Lord to show me the correct understanding of something;
Not by reading along, finding something I don't understand, and then searching for an explanation for it outside of the Bible like many seem to have done in the past and are doing these days.

I also clearly see that God does not ordain men to sin, because His word tells me point-blank that He does not condone it.
In the end, God is sovereign when it comes to salvation and men are responsible to repent and believe on His Son...
Though they will not ever do it apart from the work of the Holy Ghost in them.



I wish you well and much profit in your studies of His word...
This is my final reply in this thread.

May He someday reveal to you, in every detail, what he has done through the Gospel and through His Son for the sake of His precious children...
For it is these details that develop the how and why any of us are saved from His coming wrath and judgment.

These details make Him worthy of every bit of the fruit of our lips...
For we will praise Him for His grace and our salvation for all eternity.

 

To discount Wallace is to discount one of the most recognized scholars of today. To prefer the older scholars is to deny the research that has been done since they've died. Both courses of action are asinine. But, let's not pretend you discount Wallace because you can come up with a different argument; you just don't like his because it proves you wrong.

Wallace refers to τεταγμένοι as a verb, but it is a participle. If you knew Greek, you'd know that participles are not verbs and verbs are not participles. While participles have similarities to verbs, they are not verbs.

It is quite funny that you disparage Wallace and then refer to him in the same post... Decide whether he's worthy of your reference or not, but you can't have it both ways.

It is not lost on me (or anyone with Greek acumen--which you do not have) that you have no ability to prove Robertson right.

Now, while I disagree with Robertson for reasons that will be seen in a subsequent post, you really should read the entire entry for Robertson's Word Pictures In The New Testament, because your quote is only convenient for your argument if you don't quote it in full. Here's the full citation:

As the Gentiles heard this they were glad (ἀκουοντα τα ἐθνη ἐχαιρον [akouonta ta ethnē echairon]). Present active participle of ἀκουω [akouō] and imperfect active of χαιρω [chairō], linear action descriptive of the joy of the Gentiles. Glorified the word of God (ἐδοξαζον τον λογον του θεου [edoxazon ton logon tou theou]). Imperfect active again. The joy of the Gentiles increased the fury of the Jews. “The synagogue became a scene of excitement which must have been something like the original speaking with tongues” (Rackham). The joy of the Gentiles was to see how they could receive the higher blessing of Judaism without circumcision and other repellent features of Jewish ceremonialism. It was the gospel of grace and liberty from legalism that Paul had proclaimed. Whether Gal. 4:13 describes this incident or not (the South Galatian theory), it illustrates it when Gentiles received Paul as if he were Christ Jesus himself. It was triumph with the Gentiles, but defeat with the Jews. As many as were ordained to eternal life (ὁσοι ἠσαν τεταγμενοι εἰς ζωην αἰωνιον [hosoi ēsan tetagmenoi eis zōēn aiōnion]). Periphrastic past perfect passive indicative of τασσω [tassō], a military term to place in orderly arrangement. The word “ordain” is not the best translation here. “Appointed,” as Hackett shows, is better. The Jews here had voluntarily rejected the word of God. On the other side were those Gentiles who gladly accepted what the Jews had rejected, not all the Gentiles. Why these Gentiles here ranged themselves on God’s side as opposed to the Jews Luke does not tell us. This verse does not solve the vexed problem of divine sovereignty and human free agency. There is no evidence that Luke had in mind an absolutum decretum of personal salvation. Paul had shown that God’s plan extended to and included Gentiles. Certainly the Spirit of God does move upon the human heart to which some respond, as here, while others push him away. Believed (ἐπιστευσαν [episteusan]). Summary or constative first aorist active indicative of πιστευω [pisteuō]. The subject of this verb is the relative clause. By no manner of legerdemain can it be made to mean “those who believe were appointed.” It was saving faith that was exercised only by those who were appointed unto eternal life, who were ranged on the side of eternal life, who were thus revealed as the subjects of God’s grace by the stand that they took on this day for the Lord. It was a great day for the kingdom of God.

A.T. Robertson, Word Pictures in the New Testament (Nashville, TN: Broadman Press, 1933), Ac 13:48.
​

Notice this part that you left out:

Believed (ἐπιστευσαν [episteusan]). Summary or constative first aorist active indicative of πιστευω [pisteuō]. The subject of this verb is the relative clause. By no manner of legerdemain can it be made to mean “those who believe were appointed.” It was saving faith that was exercised only by those who were appointed unto eternal life, who were ranged on the side of eternal life, who were thus revealed as the subjects of God’s grace by the stand that they took on this day for the Lord. It was a great day for the kingdom of God. (emphasis mine)​

So, in your desire to prove me wrong (which you haven't done because you can neither prove nor disprove anything in Greek due to your demonstrated non-facility with it) you have also proven yourself wrong. Robertson clearly states "By no manner... can it be made to mean "Those who believe were appointed"." This is to say, the belief cannot be the basis of the appointment. Saving faith, according to Robertson, was exercised by those who were (past tense) appointed.

So, Robertson proves you wrong.

The Archangel

 

You do realize that I have a Master's Degree in this stuff, right? I've actually studied Greek (and Hebrew) at the Master's level. In other words, I'm not looking up what other people say about this passage or that and finding one that I like. I'm able to evaluate whether or not their arguments are correct--something that you simply cannot do.

Now, you should also know--since you've demonstrated that you don't--"ancient Greek" (or Attic Greek) is not the same as Koine. While there is much that is similar, Koine reflects the changes that happened to the language once is spread past Greece. The influx of Greek into many different cultures (through the conquest of Alexander the Great and other factors) changed the language and it became much more simplified. So Koine is to Attic as today's English is to Elizabethan English.

In the Koine period, the passive is very well developed (though it was not in Attic) and the middle, which came first, has waned in usage.

Again, a participle is not a verb. Technically, a participle is a "verbal adjective" and can have properties of both verbs and adjectives... and adverbs. Like Seth Brundle (who became "The Fly"), once he was joined with a common housefly and their DNA mixed, he was no longer human and the fly was no longer an insect. They together were something different.

τάσσω is the root of τεταγμένοι but it is not a verb at its root... because it's a participle. It isn't middle because of the rarity of the middle; it isn't middle because of the context of the passage. Here's what I mean by "context:"

Here's the verse in Greek (with the verbs in bold print): ἀκούοντα δὲ τὰ ἔθνη ἔχαιρον καὶ ἐδόξαζον τὸν λόγον τοῦ κυρίου καὶ ἐπίστευσαν ὅσοι ἦσαν τεταγμένοι εἰς ζωὴν αἰώνιον.

Here is the clause we are discussing; it comes at the end of the verse: ὅσοι ἦσαν τεταγμένοι εἰς ζωὴν αἰώνιον.

This passage (and the participle in it) are governed by the verb ἐπίστευσαν--a fairly normal Aorist Active Indicative, meaning "believed." If you look at the verb ἦσαν, it is the Imperfect Active Indicative of εἰμί (the "being" verb in Greek), meaning, essentially, "were." Now, here's where we get more technical... In Greek, the participle often enhances the meaning of the verb it modifies. It can specify meaning as to time, manner, means, purpose, etc., which it does here. The question is implied: Why did certain Gentiles believe? The answer? They were appointed by God. How do we know this is the answer? More technical information... In Greek, the use of an imperfect verb (ἦσαν) with a perfect participle (τεταγμένοι) indicates the so-called "Pluperfect."

The Pluperfect takes the passive of the participle (as opposed to the middle) in this case because of the perfect tense of the participle in conjunction with the governing verb. The ones who were saved could not have "appointed themselves" at sometime in the past; someone else had to do the appointing--which the perfect tense would demand. Furthermore, the use of the Pluperfect turns "believed" into one verbal idea with the phrase "ὅσοι ἦσαν τεταγμένοι εἰς ζωὴν αἰώνιον" which shows that Luke is intending to tell us why those believing Gentiles believed.

Since the perfect tense indicates antecedent time, the middle cannot be considered to be correct. Those who believed at this event could not have appointed themselves at that time (the perfect tense tells us this). Had Luke wanted to communicate that the people hearing appointed themselves at the present time, he would have used a present tense participle.

So it does not mean what you want it to mean.

The Archangel