1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Reproving Loss of Salvation

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Hark, Mar 9, 2021.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Hark

    Hark Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2014
    Messages:
    1,408
    Likes Received:
    63
    Faith:
    Baptist
    A lot of believers that believe there is a loss of salvation are misusing Matthew 5:22-26 to that lie. Jesus is repeating the same thing in Matthew 18:21-35 but in more detail & in the same book that this applies to saved believers that is being cast out to this "hell fire" translated from Gehenna which many believes in error is the lake of fire when it is not.

    BUT Baptists cannot correct them if they continue to ignore that this IS directed to saved believers, BUT it is not the lake of fire they are being cast into, but the fire that is coming on the earth as prophesied in Revelation 8:7 in burning one third of the earth up after the rapture event where the dead bodies shall lie unburied per Revelation 18:1-24. Like Gehenna per the valley of Hinnon.

    So compare Matthew 5:22-26 as it cites the brother with Matthew 18:21-35 as Jesus is obviosuly addressing the brothers of the saved believers.

    Matthew 18:21 Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? 22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven. 23 Therefore is the kingdom of heaven likened unto a certain king, which would take account of his servants. 24 And when he had begun to reckon, one was brought unto him, which owed him ten thousand talents. 25 But forasmuch as he had not to pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, and his wife, and children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. 26 The servant therefore fell down, and worshipped him, saying, Lord, have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 27 Then the lord of that servant was moved with compassion, and loosed him, and forgave him the debt. 28 But the same servant went out, and found one of his fellowservants, which owed him an hundred pence: and he laid hands on him, and took him by the throat, saying, Pay me that thou owest. 29 And his fellowservant fell down at his feet, and besought him, saying, Have patience with me, and I will pay thee all. 30 And he would not: but went and cast him into prison, till he should pay the debt. 31 So when his fellowservants saw what was done, they were very sorry, and came and told unto their lord all that was done. 32 Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me: 33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee? 34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him. 35 So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses. KJV

    Think of it in this way.. at the Marriage Supper in Heaven, no one is allowed to hold a grudge against their brother or sister in Heaven. If the "enemy" is there, then God has delivered him or her from the evil they had been doing on earth on others; we just were not around for them to ask for forgiveness but He forgave them before He came as the Bridegroom.

    That is why this is written.

    James 5:8 Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh. 9 Grudge not one against another, brethren, lest ye be condemned: behold, the judge standeth before the door. 10 Take, my brethren, the prophets, who have spoken in the name of the Lord, for an example of suffering affliction, and of patience. 11 Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy. KJV

    We suffer being defrauded & persecuted in the hopes our enemies will one day repent, either by believing in Him or repent f the evil they are doing to others, even Christians, so they can be received by the Bridegroom.

    1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief. 16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting. KJV

    Paul believed he was the example set for why we are to suffer in the hopes that others may come to believe in Him for life everlasting.

    We all need His help to forgive one another by applying that hope in Him for others that when we see them in Heaven at the Marriage Supper, they have repented & Jesus has forgiven Him for why they are there as we shall rejoice with them in the Lord.

    In any event, we have proof that Strong's Concordance did not discern every usage of each Greek word as applied in the Bible. Look at how sheol was applied below as that hell.

    Deuteronomy 32:21 They have moved me to jealousy with that which is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with those which are not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation. 22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains. 23 I will heap mischiefs upon them; I will spend mine arrows upon them. KJV

    If you look at Strong's concordance again, they did not see sh' owl or sheol as that punishment that comes on the earth.

    Indeed, one can say it related to Gehenna as a valley of Hinnon when His anger shall burn unto the lowest valley and the earth, even reaching the mountains. It cannot be the place of the dead or the grave here because the anger is directed to those who have sinned against Him on the earth to punish them when it will become the place of the literal dead bodies.

    So unless we agree with those who see Matthew 5:22-26 as addressing saved believers, because that is what they plainly read, we can not correct them as to what that casting is which is NOT being denied their salvation, BUT being denied their first inheritance of being the firstfruits and what that hell fire is which is NOT the lake of fire, but the fiery calamity that is coming on the earth as Peter confirmed in 2 Peter 3:3-15.

    I am sure there are other verses that those who err, are using in believing there is a loss of salvation, but that is an assumption on their part without discerning the message for what it is intended in lining up with the rest of the truths in scripture. I know no one is allowed to argue for it in this forum, but if any one sees the truth conveyed here, then God has caused the increase & you guys can share this correction in other Christian forums that you all visit that allows that kind of debate, praying that God will cause the increase there too.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    52,624
    Likes Received:
    2,742
    Faith:
    Baptist
    EVERY saved person is part of the Body of Christ, and jesus will not amputate any of his body members off period!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Aaron

    Aaron Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2000
    Messages:
    20,253
    Likes Received:
    1,381
    Faith:
    Baptist
    1) The SOTM was delivered to the multitude. They were mostly Jews under the law, but it is not a sermon tailored for His disciples.

    2) Saying to one's brother, Thou fool, is a sin of the tongue, and the tongue is an unruly evil set with the fire of hell. So yes, calling one of the faithful elect a fool puts one in danger of the curse...I will curse him that curseth thee. Of course we understand the true fulfillment of that is in Christ. Abraham is the Father of the faithful, those who are his seed by faith. Calling one a fool for being a fool is one thing. But calling one a fool because of his faith, if it was the faith of a Jew under the law, or now a Jew who is one inwardly, whose circumcision is of the heart, well, that's something altogether different.

    3) Trespasses are not sins. Only God can forgive sins, and we sin against God and Him only. Trespasses are the damages caused to one because of sin. One steals 50 dollars. The theft is sin. The trespass is the fifty dollars. When one sin, the law prescribed a sin offering, and a separate trespass offering.

    So the cost of our trespass is paid now, in this life. Not in the life to come.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...