Featured Temporal Justification

Yes. First, we start with Paul. His teachings are first-century declaration directly from God of the Mystery of the Rapture.

Everyone knew about the general Resurrection (Daniel 12:1-2).

The learned knew:

Matthew 22:23
The same day came to him the Sadducees, which say that there is no resurrection, and asked him,

But so did the common folk:


John 11:24 King James Version

24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.


So the idea it is a new doctrine is just one of the absurd arguments presented by those who also reject what Scripture states in Revelation 20. They fail to see the difference between the two resurrections presented there, and this is because they are loyal to a Theological System, not God, not His Word.


While I usually don't go beyond the teachings of Scripture as a defense of the Pre-Tribulation Rapture, because anyone that is sincere in their studies will see the obvious problems that Mid, Post, and Amillennial teachings create (as well as the fact that those who usually reject Scripture are immersed into Theology Systems and Hermeneutics that deny sound doctrine), here are a few quotes:

LINK
(Note: this link is for the following, and will be changed as necessary (I would also point out the author's note "...translated at mt my request is not a reference to Darrel C)


"For all the saints and Elect of God are gathered, prior to the Tribulation that is to come, and are taken to the Lord lest they see the confusion that is to overwhelm the world because of our sins" (On the Last Times, the Antichrist, and the End of the World, by Ephraem the Syrian, A.D. 373).


The following section includes key passages from Ephraem's important text, written about A.D. 373, and translated by Professor Cameron Rhoades, of Tyndale Theological Seminary, at my request.

On the Last Times, the Antichrist, and the End of the World

"1. Most dearly beloved brothers, believe the Holy Spirit who speaks in us. Now we have spoken before, because the end of the world is very near, and the consummation remains. Has not the first faith withered away in men? ...

"2. We ought to understand thoroughly therefore, my brothers what is imminent or overhanging. Already there have been hunger and plagues, violent movements of nations and signs, which have been predicted by the Lord, they have already been fulfilled, and there is not other which remains, except the advent of the wicked one in the completion of the Roman kingdom. Why therefore are we occupied with worldly business, and why is our mind held fixed on the lusts of the world or the anxieties of the ages? Why therefore do we not reject every care of earthly actions and prepare ourselves for the meeting of the Lord Christ, so that He may draw us from the confusion, which overwhelms the world? Believe you me, dearest brothers, because the coming of the Lord is nigh, believe you me, because it is the very last time . . . . Because all saints and Elect of the Lord are gathered together before the tribulation which is about to come and are taken to the Lord, in order that they may not see at any time the confusion which overwhelms the world because of our sins (Italics added). And so, brothers, most dear to me, it is the eleventh hour, and the end of this world comes to the harvest, and angels, armed and prepared, hold sickles in their hands, awaiting the empire of the Lord . . .

"3. When therefore the end of the world comes, there arise diverse wars, commotions on all sides, horrible earthquakes, perturbations of nations, tempests throughout the lands, plagues, famine, drought throughout the thoroughfares, great danger throughout the sea and dry land, constant persecutions, slaughters and massacres everywhere . . .

"6. When therefore the end of the world comes, that abominable, lying and murderous one is born from the tribe of Dan. He is conceived from the seed of a man and from a most vile virgin, mixed with an evil or worthless spirit . . .

"7. But when the time of the abomination of his desolation begins to approach, having been made legal, he takes the empire . . . . Therefore, when he receives the kingdom, he orders the temple of God to be rebuilt for himself, which is in Jerusalem; who, after coming into it, he shall sit as God and order that he be adored by all nations . . . . then all people from everywhere shall flock together to him at the city of Jerusalem, and the holy city shall be trampled on by the nations for forty-two months just as the holy apostle says in the Apocalypse, which becomes three and a half years, 1260 days.

"8. In these three years and a half the heaven shall suspend its dew; because there will be no rain upon the earth . . . . and there will be a Great Tribulation, as there has not been, since people began to be upon the earth . . . . and no one is able to sell or to buy of the grain of the fall harvest, unless he is one who has the serpentine sign on the forehead or the hand . . . .

"10. And when the three and a half years have been completed, the time of the Antichrist, through which he will have seduced the world, after the resurrection of the two prophets, in the hour which the world does not know, and on the day which the enemy or son of perdition does not know, will come the sign of the Son of Man, and coming forward the Lord shall appear with great power and much majesty, with the sign of the word of salvation going before him, and also even with all the powers of the heavens with the whole chorus of the saints . . . . Then Christ shall come and the enemy shall be thrown into confusion, and the Lord shall destroy him by the Spirit of his mouth. And he shall be bound and shall be plunged into the abyss of everlasting fire alive with his father Satan; and all people, who do his wishes, shall perish with him forever; but the righteous ones shall inherit everlasting life with the Lord for ever and ever."


I don't agree with everything this man is teaching, and suggest that understanding of revelation has always been progressive, and the understanding of man has also been progressive.

An example would be John the Baptist: it was divinely revealed to him that Jesus was the Christ (as it was to the disciples, Matthew 16:12-18), yet while John was in prison he sent two disciples to inquire of the Lord if He was in fact the Christ, or did they seek another (Matthew 11:1-3).

But it is clear this ancient witness believed the Church would be raptured prior to the Tribulation.

Well Before Darby.


Continued...

 

Thomas Ice presented this:

LINK

(Note: this link is for both quotes)

Posttribulationists like J. Barton Payne also admit that the early fathers held to an
imminency viewpoint. He surmises:

It must therefore be concluded that the denial of the imminence of the
Lord’s coming on the part of post-tribulationists who have reacted against
dispensationalism is not legitimate. . . .
Belief in the imminency of the return of Jesus was the uniform hope of the
early church; and it was only with the rise of a detailed application of Bible
prophecy, at the close of the second century, to yet future history that its truth
was questioned.13


THOMAS COLLIER
Frank Marotta, a brethren researcher, believes that Thomas Collier (d. 1691) in 1674
makes reference to a pretribulational rapture, but rejects the view,26 thus showing his
23 Gumerlock, “A Rapture Citation,” 356–9. 24 Gumerlock, “A Rapture Citation,” 361. 25 Reeves, “Influence of Prophecy,” 246. 26 Frank Marotta, Morgan Edwards: An Eighteenth Century Pretribulationist (Morganville, NJ: Present Truth
Publishers, 1995), 10–2. 10
awareness that such a view was being taught in the late seventeenth century. Collier in
The Body of Divinity27 says the following:

7. Quest. At what time may we suppose the Saints shall be raised? at his
first appearing in the Clouds of Heaven? or at the entrance of the thousand
years? or after the thousand years are finished?

Ans. Very probably at the entrance of the 1000 years, and that for these
reasons.

1. Because it is not likely that they should be raised before the Nations are
subdued and the new Heavens and new Earth prepared.

2. The Scripture saith, that it shall be at the sound of the last Trump, . . .
We may groundedly suppose that after Christ’s appearing in the work, he
may ascend and descend often.28

“Collier certainly considered the idea of a pretribulation rapture. If the saints were
raised when Christ appears and this is prior the fulfillment of the bulk of Revelation, it
is pretribulational” explains Marotta. “Whether anyone actually held to the
pretribulational view contemporary to Collier, or this was just an exercise of the mind,
we cannot say.”29
If this is a pre-trib rapture statement, it was hardly recognized as such at the time. It
is true that Collier had a futurist view of Revelation, which was rare to non-existent in
his day. As Marotta says, “Collier was clearly posttribulational.” Even if this were a
pre-trib statement, it had no known impact at the time.


This fellow did not embrace the Pre-Tribulational Rapture, but it shows that the Pre-Tribulational Rapture was not "first heard through the teachings of Darby."

JOHN ASGILL
There is the interesting case of John Asgill (1659–1738), who wrote a book in 1700
about the possibility of translation (i.e. rapture) without seeing death.30 As a result of
writing this book, Asgill was removed from the Irish parliament in 1703 and then from
the English parliament in 1707. “His book had been examined and pronounced
blasphemous, and had been burnt by order of the House without his having been heard
in its defense.”31 Asgill spent the last thirty years of his life in prison because of his
book on the rapture. This would tend to throw cold water on anyone desiring to make
known their thoughts on the rapture.

Asgill did not relate the possible any-moment translation to the tribulation or any
other prophetic event. Thus, his view could hardly be call any form of
pretribulationism. William Bramley-Moore said, “But he did not hold the truth in its
relation to other truths. He was looking for an individual translation, on which he
expressed himself somewhat strongly, and to which he did not attain; for he failed to
understand that the promised change or translation of the saints is not to be that of
solitary individuals, but of a corporate body.”32


As is typical, the "establishment" had a stranglehold on the Word of God.

Here comes the new boss, same as the old boss...


Continued...

 

From the same site:

LINK

MORGAN EDWARDS
One of the clearest references to a pretribulation rapture before the time of Darby
came from a Welsh Baptist named Morgan Edwards (1722–95). Edwards was born in
Trevethin parish, Pontypool, Wales,33 and likely heard George Whitfield preach as a
young student at Trosnant Academy in Trevethin parish, Wales.34 He was a founder of
the Ivy League school, Brown University and graduated from Bristol Baptist College or
Bristol Academy in Bristol, England in 1744.35 He served several small Baptist
congregations in England for seven years, before moving to Cork, Ireland, where he
pastored for nine years. Edwards emigrated to America and in May 1761 became
pastor of the Baptist Church in Philadelphia in the American colonies,36 upon the
recommendation of the famous hyper-Calvinist John Gill (1697–1771).37 After the
Revolutionary War (he was the only known Baptist clergy of Tory persuasion),
Edwards became an educator and the premier Baptist historian of his day. He was
awarded an honorary Master of Arts degree in 1762 by the College of Philadelphia.38
His major work Materials Toward A History of the Baptists is an important seminal work
outlining American Baptist history of the era.39 Edwards co-founded the first Baptist
college in the Colonies, Rhode Island College, which we know today as Brown
University of the Ivy League.40
As was typical of early American Colonists, Edwards experienced significant
tragedy in his life. He outlived two wives and most of his children. During a “dark
period” in his life, he ceased attending church, took to drink and was excommunicated
from his church. “After making repeated efforts to be restored, he was received into the
church on October 6, 1788, and thereafter lived an exemplary life.”41 Baptist historian
Robert Torbet described Edwards as “a man of versatility, being both a capable leader
for many years and a historian of some importance. In temperament he was eccentric
and choleric. . . . With all of his varied gifts, he was always evangelistic in spirit.”42
Another historian similarly says of Edwards:

Scholarly, laborious, warm-hearted, eccentric, choleric Morgan Edwards, one of
the most interesting of the early Baptist ministers of our country and one of those
most deserving of honor. His very faults had a leaning toward virtues side, and
in good works he was exceeded by none of his day, if indeed by any of any day. .
. . He was an able preacher and a good man, but not always an easy man to get
on with.4

Edwards saw a distinct rapture three-and-a-half years before the start of the
millennium. He taught the following about the rapture:

II. The distance between the first and second resurrection will be somewhat more
than a thousand years.

I say, somewhat more—, because the dead saints will be raised, and the living
changed at Christ’s “appearing in the air” (I Thes. iv. 17); and this will be
about three years and a half before the millennium, as we shall see hereafter:
but will he and they abide in the air all that time? No: they will ascend to
paradise, or to some one of those many “mansions in the father’s house”
(John xiv. 2), and disappear during the foresaid period of time. The design
of this retreat and disappearing will be to judge the risen and changed saints;
for “now the time is come that judgment must begin,” and that will be “at the
house of God” (I Pet. iv. 17).48

Edwards makes three key points that are consistent with modern pretribulationism.
First, he clearly separates the rapture from the second coming by an interval of three-
and-a-half years. Second, he uses modern pre-trib rapture verses (1 Thessalonians 4:17
and John 14:2) to describe the rapture and support his view. Third, he believed the
judgment seat of Christ (rewarding) for believers will occur in heaven while the
tribulation is raging on earth, as is common in contemporary pretribulationism.


Again, I do not agree entirely with their teachings, but again, this shows the argument "Darby invented the Pre-Tribulational Rapture is bogus.

I look to the first-century teachings of Paul and Christ, though, to draw conclusions concerning the Pre-Tribulational Rapture.

It is simply impossible to have a Post-Tribulational Rapture or "no rapture" based on the Prophecy given us.

Those who spiritualize Scripture to their Theology Systems decry an adherence to what is in Scripture. No man can give an answer as to why Scripture does not mean what it states when it states God will restore Israel and that there is a thousand-year reign of Christ in Revelation 20.

There are more quotes to be found concerning early Pre-Tribulational views of ancient witnesses, but will those who deny the Pre-Tribulational Rapture look for them and test their Eschatology?

Nope.

Since I had to split this post I will throw this one in for free:

Edward’s book on the rapture was essentially lost as far as any popular, public
knowledge of it. It came to light in the 1990s in order to satisfy a challenge made by
Pre-trib opponent John Bray who promised to pay $500.00 to anyone “who will furnish
me with a documented statement by anybody (in a sermon, article or commentary) in
any country, published BEFORE LACUNZA’S TIME,” which would be 1812.57 Bray
acknowledged that the Edwards material satisfied his challenge and on March 21, 1995
he mailed a $500.00 check to an individual who showed him Edward’s book.58

While I view the commentary here to be of little value and only recognize Scripture's teachings, it does put to rest the idea that the Pre-TRibulational Rapture is a new idea.

As I said, the Pre-Tribulational Rapture is a first-century teaching of Scripture, a Mystery revealed by Paul, and quite separate from the other three resurrections we see in Revelation.



God bless.

 

I would invite you to address the OP of "The Pre-Tribulational Rapture," as well as the arguments presented there, which include an address of the weak and faulty arguments you have, for some odd reason, chosen to post here instead of a relevant thread.

I too, thought it was funny.

However, before you pat yourselves on the back, let's take a look at the Doctrine and Arguments presented by the Rapture denier.


First argument: Christ's Return at the Rapture will not be secret.

The problem here, as with every single one of the arguments given is this—the conclusion is drawn upon a false argument.

1) it is based on the idea that the Rapture is "secret," 2) it overlooks the fact that this involves the Church only, hence there is nothing to support the idea that only the Church will be privy to the trumpet and the shout, and 3) it overlooks the fact that when the Tribulation comes God will send strong delusion on the unbelievers who sit under Antichrist.


2 Thessalonians 2:10-12 King James Version

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


Secondly, added to the false argument is this: that Jesus is returning in the Rapture. This is a false argument because anyone that has studied the Rapture understands that this is not an event of Christ's Return, but an event of the Church being caught up and out of this world.

See now why your first argument is false, and not really worthy of serious discussion?

The Return of Christ is a separate event.


Argument Two: The wicked are taken, not the righteous, at the Return of Christ.


That is correct. Your argument as well as your derision, condescension, and ridicule of the Rapture believer in the video is based on an erroneous and dishonest application of a passage of Scripture that refers to Christ's Return.

Again, what you fail to recognize is the distinction between teachings about the Return and the Rapture. When one is taken in judgment and one is left, it's quite obvious that the ones left aren't—caught up.

See how easy that distinction is?

But because of your desperate attempt to remain under the influence of the doctrines of men you cannot be honest about the passages.

So I will ask both of you right now, on this point—how can men be raptured as Paul taught, caught up, and still be left? How can you deny Paul's teaching that men will be caught up? How can you deny that there are two resurrections in Revelation that are distinct the one from the other?

Answer: you can't.


Argument Three: Jesus fled the Jews and this denies the Millennial Kingdom.

Lol, this is a good one.

Again it fails to include all relevant Scripture. You guys really redefine what an "argument from silence" means.


Revelation 20 King James Version

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.


I know, you don't believe Scripture means what it says. He isn't going to reign for a thousand years as it says.


Matthew 2:2
Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.


Jesus is the Prophesied King that should come. And while we can understand the Eternal Nature of our King, that doesn't deny the rest of Prophecy that will also be fulfilled as it was given (as prophecy always is):


Zechariah 14 King James Version

1 Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.


Will this happen when He returns or not?

If so, then so will this:


9 And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one.


10 All the land shall be turned as a plain from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem: and it shall be lifted up, and inhabited in her place, from Benjamin's gate unto the place of the first gate, unto the corner gate, and from the tower of Hananeel unto the king's winepresses.


11 And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited.


I agree, since prophecy can be fulfilled in multiple fulfillment (such as Christ's Coming happening twice as opposed to the one time men thought it would be in Old Testament Eras; Antichrist arising at least twice (Antiochus Epiphanes, as well as one to follow as Christ taught)), and we can certainly give an Eternal State context here, it is applicable.

But this is not:


16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.


17 And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.


18 And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the Lord will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.


19 This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.


20 In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, Holiness Unto The Lord; and the pots in the Lord's house shall be like the bowls before the altar.


21 Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the Lord of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the Lord of hosts.


Clearly a physical Kingdom and this has not yet been fulfilled.

Do you want to give this context regarding the Eternal State?

How about these:


Isaiah 11:6
The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

Isaiah 65:25
The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the Lord.

Isaiah 65:20 King James Version

20 There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.


Clearly a physical kingdom with physical characteristics that has taken place yet.

Your system requires a spiritualization of prophecy to such an extent that is boggles the mind that you ridicule those who see to be hyper literal.

So, Walter, the ridicule is unworthy and itself ridiculous. I invite you, if you are so sure there is no rapture, to join the thread that is actually dealing with that topic.

In this thread, I would ask you to address the points made in the OP and in following posts.


God bless.

 

It's funny that those teaching first-century doctrines are called by those who adhere to the whims of men (Oral Tradition) that we are privately interpreting.

I have given the Scripture for my views, and you will not address them.

So are there two resurrections in Revelation 20 or just one, Cathode?


God bless.

 

It's a false argument.

Just because I believe in an event described in Revelation called by most The Tribulation doesn't mean I am somehow unaware that while we are in the world we will suffer tribulation.

Christians are martyred today on a regular basis. They do not have the freedoms we enjoy and suffer at the hands of other religions.

Can't you guys come up with an argument that is worth discussing?


God bless.

 

You say this as though there is only one kind of justification.

Let me ask you this:


Luke 18:10-14 King James Version

10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.

11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.


Is Christ in error? Was this man not justified before God? Both in the story as well as in the statement of Christ?

Secondly, was this man eternally redeemed? Forgiven his sins in completion? Would he never again have to offer up sacrifice for his sins, seeing he was under Law?


God bless.

 

Hmm, since Walter doesn't believe in the Rapture it can't possibly be true.

So why haven't you joined in the discussion that is actually based on the Pre-Tribulational Rapture? Could it be that you have read the arguments for it and have no answer, and have not yet been able to get another man to answer for you?

Can you enter into a discussion about the topic with just a Bible and the Spirit that leads and guides us into all truth?


God bless.

 

Again, no appeal to Scripture, but an appeal to men.

So tell me, Campion, just how have you suffered?


God bless.

 

Well, you would have to look at it from my perspective to be fair: I see Oral Tradition as the poster child for private interpretation.

You have to admit that the Catholic Church has added doctrine that is in no way supported by Scripture. For example, Indulgences.

Equally guilty is the Protestant practice of tithing: it's not a practice commanded of the Church, but is taught by most Protestant and Evangelical churches that it is.

So I agree in part to a rejection of private interpretation, and view the test to be Scripture itself.

Selling remission of sins is how I interpret those two practices. They are certainly not biblical by any means, yet all three groups justify their practice.


Continued...

 

So explain indulgences.

The Catholic Church is as guilty of error as the Protestant and Evangelical churches that depart from the teachings of Scripture itself.

It was a Catholic Priest that started the Reformation, remember? Why is his view as a catholic rejected over the views enforced at his time? Their rejection of Luther was decided based on—their understanding of Scripture.

They said, no a man is justified by faith and works, not by faith alone.

Believe it or not, I agree with that, men are justified by faith and works, but in a temporal context, not in an eternal context.

That is why the man that went away to his house was justified but was still in need of Eternal Redemption:


Luke 18:10-14 King James Version

10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.

11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.


Now look at the text, Cathode: the Pharisee did works—and was not justified. We could say, "Well, the man had no faith, thus he was not justified." Could be, but it is apparent he had enough faith to do the works.

Here are some more people temporally justified but still in need of a Savior and the redemption that had been promised in Him:


Luke 1:5-6 King James Version

5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.

6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.


So I ask you, did they need the Atonement? Or no?


Continued...

 

But it's okay for the Catholic Church to do it?

We have to be honest about error no matter where it is found. If it doesn't adhere to Scripture it should be tossed out.

Give an example and we can put it to the test of Scripture. That's the only Authority I recognize.


Continued...

 

Sadly, I have to agree.

But if we employ a sound hermeneutic approach we can weed out the garbage.

An example of how that is done is by comparing the Lord's direct statements in regards to the First Principles of the DOctrine of Christ. Or in other words, hoe He viewed the doctrine of the Old Testament.

As a matter of fact that is precisely how the Early Church was founded.

What do you think Paul was doing in his missionary journeys?

He was expounding the Word of God:


Acts 19:8-10 King James Version

8 And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God.

9 But when divers were hardened, and believed not, but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he departed from them, and separated the disciples, disputing daily in the school of one Tyrannus.

10 And this continued by the space of two years; so that all they which dwelt in Asia heard the word of the Lord Jesus, both Jews and Greeks.


I have given a link to the word "disputing."


Acts 17:2
And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,


That's what we do here, and we follow the example of the only Church fathers that are reliable beyond question.


Continued...