Featured Universalism a strawman argument.

I don't see anyone denying that God is the reason we are saved. So, let me see.."God HAD to break in?" Yes, God had to be the provider, but, in Calvinism the double speak....God caused (forced) them to come running to himself (irresistable grace...really? Then why do so many reject Christ?) while others aren't given that light in spite of the Gospel being presented. Guess that John 3:16...for God so loved the WORLD that he gave his only begotten son...Guess he didn't love the whole world, right? Just the elect...Also I Timothy 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. Guess the Bible is a lie, right? God would be a liar then, right? Calvinism is full of contradictions.

 

And yet, EVERYTHING you've highlited, and the Scripture you post are the same verses those who hold to FREE WILL use as well. Guess that your emphasis here is sort of fruitless in proving your point....AGAIN! We all agree that we need to be made alive....I guess it boils down to just WHEN this being made alive occurs. I don't believe any of us is going to lose our salvation if we don't agree with YOUR TAKE on these Scriptures. Right?

 

Well...Satan quotes verses as well so the responsibility for us is to discern what God is saying.
Can a person, dead in sins and not born again by God, believe?

My answer is a definitive NO.

 

We couldn't come running to God. We were shackled to sin, in slavery. God doesn't force us to run to Him, because we couldn't move. God had to break into our dungeon and unshackle us and set us free before we could run anywhere.
It seems to me that you don't actually perceive the wretched predicament you were in before God saved you.

 

It depends on when you believe a person is "born again." Calvinists believe that people are born again before a person receives Christ. Most don't believe that way, and Calvinists have to do a lot of gymnastics with Scripture to come to that conclusion. Dead in sin doesn't mean unable to receive..dead in sin doesn't mean unable to decide...Calvinists have to do a lot of gymnastics to come to the conclusions they do..

 

Man's ideology added to God's word...go figure. It seems to me that you assume a lot about people though you don't know them. Arrogance is definitely in your DNA...

 

What ideology did I add to us being slaves to sin?
Do you imagine you ran to God while you were shackled in sin?

 

Ephesians 2:4-5 tells us when.
But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—

 

You leave out some critical verses Austin
Eph 2:1 And you were dead in your trespasses and sins,
Eph 2:2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience.
Eph 2:3 Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest.

Note Paul is including himself in the ones that were dead in trespasses and sins and these dead people could actually walk and think or do you not believe that Paul was able to do those things.

Austin as you keep saying look at the context not just what you think will support your view.
Why do you think that a bible believer would have problems with the verses that you posted. Note the last few words of your post "by grace you have been saved". If you look just a few verse down you will see why " For by grace you have been saved through faith"

Looks like those dead in sin people weren't so dead after all.

 

Your example is ludicrous. Not all slaves are "shackled." The imagery you're using is YOUR opinion. Not all slaves are "shackled." And you seem to continuously ignore the fact that God gave people a CHOICE in the Bible...Calvinists don't like that, nor are they ones to admit it. Your reasoning is circular at best.

 

You were a slave to sin. Think of yourself as being on a slave ship. You had no hope of escape. You could not choose anything regarding your freedom.
It seems you don't want to admit how desperately wretched your condition was when God broke in and pulled you out. You still want to imagine you were dancing in the periwinkle when you chose Jesus as you saw him at a distance. But that's not how the Bible describes your condition. You were a slave to sin. You were dead in trespasses and sins. You were wretched.

Here is the poem of one who understood.
Amazing grace! how sweet the sound,
That saved a wretch; like me!
I once was lost, but now am found,
Was blind, but now I see

 

I am very well aware that I was onboard that same slave ship, bound in chains, and unable to choose anything. I was in need of a Savior who could ransom me and loose my chains. I know how wretched I am and how my salvation is entirely and only by God's grace alone.

It seems you refuse to admit how desperate your situation is and how desperately you needed Jesus to intercede on your behalf. I am very well aware of my vile position and I openly admit that I did nothing to secure my freedom.
You accuse me of being proud when I honestly tell you that you were in the same condition and you still (like me) are entirely dependent upon Jesus interceding for you as your High Priest. Without Jesus intercession, you would still be in shackles on that slave boat. If you deny that, then you make God a liar.

 

Again with the false accusations of what I do or do not believe? You're not worth wasting my time with any longer. The only people making God a liar is you. Thanks for continuing to prove people assertions of Calvinists and their arrogance. You may continue to reply to me, and I KNOW you will because you can't help yourself, but unlike others here, I have had enough of your false accusations, assumptions, and the like. Talk to the wind.

 

I note that you have deflected to an imaginary "Calvin" that no one but you know about.
Look in the Bible and see the wretchedness and helplessness of your condition so that you could do nothing to save yourself.
If you will not acknowledge you were shackled in sin, with no means of escape, then you indeed make God a liar, because God tells you that you were bound in sin.

Do you acknowledge this or do you contend against it?

 

To all INTERESTED parties...I made mention that the bloviator, AKA Austin, would continue to post to me after I made mention of his arrogance and how I would no longer respond directly to him in this thread. If one will notice, including the moderators/administrators, he has once again proven my point about Calvinists and their continued steamrolling techniques. His insinuations are bordering on slanderous, and I've put Austin on "ignore" once again. It's just not worth the aggravation of talking to a person who can only use circular reasoning. Y'all can take over from here, but I'm not wasting my time with this "brother" again.

 

Please note that you are the one calling me names, claiming I have slandered when I have not, and blame a man 500 years removed.
I know that my pointing you to God's word, regarding our position before salvation bothers you greatly. You will not tolerate the idea that you and I were bound in the chains of sin before God chose to break through and save us out of our despair. This is entirely on you to consider scripture and admit you never came running to God since you were bound in sin. If this truth bothers you and you will not look at scripture, it is indeed best for you to ignore all who understand that God alone saves us out of our bondage.