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Featured "The election hath obtained it"; and "the rest are blinded", #Ro 11:7

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Alan Gross, Oct 23, 2022.

  1. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    Rom 11:7

    7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

    Now even though this Truth is in the context of Paul writing about National Israel, nevertheless this is Gods Method and plan of Salvation universally that is beyond the land of Israel. In other words, only the Election throughout the Gentile world shall obtain Salvation by Grace, and the rest of humanity is blinded.

    See the Eternal Salvation that is in and through the Lord Jesus Christ is only for Gods Election, remember Paul writing to Timothy emphasized that 2 Tim 2:10

    10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

    Thats who Eternal Salvation in Christ Jesus is for, the Elects sake, all others are blinded.
     
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  2. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    2 Corinthains 4:3-4, ". . . But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. . . .
     
  3. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    Okay
     
  4. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not", I hope you to believe it is, "Satan", that is, "the God of this world."

    Same as the one who said they would , "be as god's". = Liar.
     
  5. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    In 2 Corinthians 4:4, it is ". . . the god of this age . . . ."
    Now in Genesis 3:4, the Serpent lied, "Ye shall not surely die: . . ." But the Serpent sold his lie with a truth, "For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as God, knowing good and evil. . . ." see the 1917 Jewish Tanakh.
     
  6. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Adam and Eve's eyes were opened to sin and condemnation.
     
  7. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    What is the same or different,
    between "God, knowing good and evil"

    And Adam, knowing good and evil?
     
  8. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Good question. Where it comes to the knowledge of evil.
    God is and always is infinite good. Adam was made very good, but only finite in his goodness that God made him.
     
  9. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Adam was Mutable, while God is Immutable.
     
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  10. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    So, Adam changed from what he was, before The Fall into sin, to something else, afterward.
     
  11. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    No. Only from sinless to sinful, do to the knowledge of good and evil.
     
  12. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Even the fire of hell through eternity will not take away the stain of sin in the souls there.

    That how dreadfully, eternally, deep our sin is, Against a Trice-Holy, Eternal God.


    This pollution spreads, like leaven and leprosy. It is universal, and has defiled all the faculties of the inner man, so that there is "no soundness in it" (Isa. 1:6).


    Refusal to consider fallen man’s condition helps no one.

    Until we are brought to realize this truth
    we shall never despair of self
    and look away to Another.

    Biblical Description of Sin

    No representations of sin are more common in the Scriptures than those taken from its defiling effects.

    Throughout it is portrayed as ugly and revolting, unclean and disgusting.

    Sin is pictured by leprosy, the most loathsome disease which can attack the human frame.

    It is likened to wounds, bruises and putrefying sores.

    It is compared to a cage of unclean birds.

    The inseparable connection of the beautiful and good and the ugly and sinful pervades the moral teaching of both Testaments. That connection is ethical and not aesthetic.

    To reverse the order would be to reduce righteousness to a matter of taste, and to regulate authority according to its appeal to our sentiments.

    As someone has said, the aesthetic sentiment is a reflection from the moral sphere, a transfer to our senses of those perceptions found in their purity only in the realm of the spiritual and divine.

    Sin is really and originally all that is ugly; nothing else is ugly except as a result of its connection with sin.

    The ugliness which it creates is its own blot. It has deranged the whole structure of the soul, and morally ulcerated man from head to foot.

    "We are all as an unclean thing" (Isa. 64:6).

    Thus God’s Word describes us: foul and filthy. That pollution is deep and unmistakable, likened to crimson dye (Isa. 1:18),
    or to the blackness of the Ethiopian (Jer. 13:23),

    which cannot be washed away by the niter of positive thinking or the soap of reformation (Jer. 2:22).

    It is an indelible pollution, for it is
    "written with a pen of iron, and with the point of a diamond: it is graven upon the table of ... [the] heart" (Jer. 17:1).

    The great deluge did not wash it from the earth, nor did the fire that came down upon Sodom burn it out. It is ineradicable.

    Even the fire of hell through eternity will not take away the stain of sin in the souls there.

    This pollution spreads, like leaven and leprosy. It is universal, and has defiled all the faculties of the inner man, so that there is "no soundness in it" (Isa. 1:6).

    Soul and body alike are contaminated,
    for we read of the

    "filthiness of the flesh and spirit" (II Cor. 7:1).

    It extends to the thoughts and imaginations,

    as well as to words and deeds.

    It is malignant and deadly, "the poison of asps"
    (Rom. 3:13).

    "I said unto thee when thou wast in thy blood, Live; yea, I said unto thee when thou wast in thy blood, Live" (Ezek. 16:6).

    The doubling of that expression
    shows the deadly nature of the pollution.

    Sin is as loathsome as it is criminal; it is like a foul stench in the nostrils of the Lord.

    Thus the day man corrupted himself, his Maker could no longer endure him, but drove him out of the garden (Gen. 3:24).

    The Scriptures liken man to foxes for their subtlety,
    to wild bulls for their intractableness,
    to briers and thorns for their hurtfulness,
    to pigs for their greediness and filthiness,
    to bears and lions for their cruelty and bloodthirstiness, to serpents for their hatefulness.

    However unpleasant and forbidding this subject,
    it is an integral part of "the counsel of God"
    which His ministers are not at liberty to withhold.

    They are not free to pick and choose their themes, still less to tone them down. Rather each one is told by his Master, "Speak unto them all that I commanded thee: be not dismayed at their faces" (Jer. 1:17).

    Asylums, prisons and cemeteries are depressing sights, yet they are painful facts of human history.

    Refusal to consider fallen man’s condition helps no one.

    Until we are brought to realize this truth
    we shall never despair of self and look away to Another.

    This solemn side of the picture is indeed dark,
    yet it is the necessary background to redemption.
     
    #72 Alan Gross, Nov 12, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2022
  13. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    [/QUOTE]

    I do notice that you like to twist what someone says. Did I say they did not know or believe the bible no, what I said is that I trust the bible. These are just men and no matter how well versed they are in the bible they still bring a bias into there view. I will stick with the bible and you can go with them.
     
  14. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    I do notice that you like to twist what someone says. Did I say they did not know or believe the bible no, what I said is that I trust the bible. These are just men and no matter how well versed they are in the bible they still bring a bias into there view. I will stick with the bible and you can go with them.[/QUOTE]

    So, why do you change a "dead" sinner, to one that is "alive"?

    And Accuse The Trice-Holy, JUST, Lord God of Double Jeopardy?

    Ephesians 2:2; THIS is supposed to be, "in time past";

    2 "Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world,
    according to the prince of the power of the air,

    the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:"
     
  15. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    So, why do you change a "dead" sinner, to one that is "alive"?

    And Accuse The Trice-Holy, JUST, Lord God of Double Jeopardy?

    Ephesians 2:2; THIS is supposed to be, "in time past";

    2 "Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world,
    according to the prince of the power of the air,
    the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:"

    These are your dead sinners Alan
    Eph 2:1 And you He made alive, who were dead in trespasses and sins,
    Eph 2:2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,
    Eph 2:3 among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others.

    As I said before those are quite lively dead people. You have confused dead spiritually with dead physically. Once you get that confusion cleared up you may begin to understand the bible. If you read it carefully you will see that Paul includes himself in those that were at one time dead spiritually. And now he is alive, why, because he trusted in Christ Jesus. That is just what the bible tells us all of us can do
    Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

    Alan just trust the bible and you will clear up all of your false views.
     
  16. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Again,
    A lost sinner remains dead in sins and trespasses,
    until being Quickened & Renewed by the Holy Spirit,
    Eph 2:1 And you He made alive
    and is thereby Spiritually Enabled to Answer the Effectual Call of God,
    by and through the Instrumentation of The WORD of GOD
    and to Embrace the Grace Offered and Conveyed in it;

    by The SAME Power, that Raised up Christ from the Dead.

    i
    Eph. 1.19,20.

    19 "And what is the Exceeding Greatness of His Power
    to us-ward who believe, according to the Working of His Mighty Power,

    20 Which He Wrought in Christ, when He Raised Him from the Dead,
    and set Him at His Own Right Hand in the Heavenly Places,"
     
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  17. Brightfame52

    Brightfame52 Well-Known Member

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    No election no grace / no salvation

    Rom. 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
    The elect obtain that for which they seek and the rest are blinded.

    Rom. 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

    Thats why its a blessing to be of the election when it comes to salvation, because if not, the rest who are not of the election of grace, are blinded.
     
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  18. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    All because of a God
    like the One He describes in His Word.

    We can Worship a God like that.

    Praise Jesus Christ, God Almighty!
     
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