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WHY?

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by tyndale1946, May 25, 2023.

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  1. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    Jon and I in the past have crossed swords so to speak on this scripture, and at the beginning of what is called The Messianic Psalms 22 it is first mentioned that will come to pass, from Jesus lips in the scripture below:

    Psalms 22: 1 My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

    Matthew 27: 46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

    Jon's comment unless he's changed it and I converted him;)... His Father could never forsake his Son, he loved him everlastingly... Question... Then why did his Son say he did?... So the question remains if he didn't why?... If he did why?... Brother Glen:)

     
    #1 tyndale1946, May 25, 2023
  2. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    His cry, "My God", expressed that even in separation Jesus had faith in the Father and willingly fulfilled God's plan.

    So I'm not sure the answer can be fully known.
    Did I just straddle the answer? y/n

    Rob
     
    #2 Deacon, May 25, 2023
  3. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    "When he is said to be "forsaken" of God; the meaning is not, that the hypostatical union was dissolved, which was not even by death itself; the fulness of the Godhead still dwelt bodily in him: nor was he separated from the love of God; he had the same interest in his Father's heart and favour, both as his Son, and as mediator.
    ...
    The whole of it evinces the truth of Christ's human nature, that he was in all things made like unto his brethren; that he had an human soul, and endured sorrows and sufferings in it, of which this of desertion was not the least."

    - excerpt from John Gill's Bible commentary on Matthew 27:46
     
    #3 KenH, May 25, 2023
  4. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    I would venture that John and Mr. Gill are on the right track. The hypostatic union is a mystery to me, yet it is clear from Scripture that God is immutable, and every person in the Godhead must be immutable as well and their relations must be immutable.
     
    #4 rsr, May 25, 2023
  5. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire Well-Known Member
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    Psalm 22: The Psalm of the Cross | Effectual Grace
     
    #5 Earth Wind and Fire, May 25, 2023
  6. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    These are not my thoughts but from A. W. Pink in his book The Seven Saying Of The Savior On The Cross whom I highly agree with:

    Now on the cross the Lord Jesus was receiving the wages which were due his people. He had no sin of his own, for he was the Holy One of God. But he was bearing our sins in his own body on the tree (1 Peter 2:24). He had taken our place and was suffering the Just for the unjust. He was bearing the chastisement of our peace; and the wages of our sins, the suffering and chastisement which were due us, was "death". Not merely physical but penal; and, as we have said, this meant separation from God, and hence it was that the Saviour cried, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"

    Brother Glen:)
     
    #6 tyndale1946, May 27, 2023
  7. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    I suppose 'that the scripture be fulfilled' just won't do.
     
    #7 kyredneck, May 27, 2023
  8. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    WHY ?

    Because !
     
    #8 Salty, May 27, 2023
  9. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    Are you and redneck twins?... Brother Glen:)

    I know WHY because God said so!... Thank you all for your comments!
     
    #9 tyndale1946, May 27, 2023
  10. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    I say that his God / Father did forsake him, Yet, I have a few questions. For how long was the Son forsaken of God His Father?

    In what manner was he forsaken?

    Matt 27:46 KJV And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?

    Hebrews 5:7,8 Darby Who in the days of his flesh, having offered up both supplications and entreaties to him who was able to save him out of death, with strong crying and tears; (and having been heard because of his piety;) though he were Son, he learned obedience from the things which he suffered;

    Acts 2:31 CSB “Seeing what was to come, he spoke concerning the resurrection of the Messiah: He[fn] [Other mss read His soul] was not abandoned in Hades, and his flesh did not experience decay.

    Is the Greek for forsaken in Matt and abandoned/left in Acts from the same word καταλείπω (G2641)

    Was the Son forsaken / abandoned for three days?

    Now relative to this post I am going make a post in the CBMSV2 thread.
     
    #10 percho, May 27, 2023
  11. MrW

    MrW Well-Known Member

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    For the time on the cross that it was dark.
     
    #11 MrW, May 28, 2023
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