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What about Divine Chastisement?

Z

Zaatar71

Active Member
7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

1] How do we recognize Divine Chastisement?

2] How do we profit from it?

3] Do we consider it a mercy or just punishment?

4] Do we resist this chastisement ?
 
P

Paleouss

Active Member
Zaatar71 said:
1] How do we recognize Divine Chastisement?
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Greetings Zaatar. I hope you are having a blessing Tuesday.

We know that God tests the hearts of men through experience (Prov 17:3) and through experience he tries them as silver is tried (Psa 66:10). Not that He might know the will of a man’s heart, for the Spirit already “searches all things'' (1Cor 2:10), cuts sharper than any double-edged sword (Heb 4:12) and judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart (Heb 4:12), exposing motives (1Cor 4:5); for “no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of him to whom we must give account” (Heb 4:13). No...man is tested by God, who sustains every experience of the day (Psa 139:16), so that we may be nurtured through what has been created toward this world’s intended end, which is God the Son.

That being said, God's chastisement comes to us through our experiences. These experiences, if properly received, produce fruits. These fruits of love, joy, peace, patience, etc... move us toward our final glory (our proper growth).
Zaatar71 said:
1] How do we recognize Divine Chastisement?
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Inner conviction through devoted study and prayer...within our circumstances.
Zaatar71 said:
2] How do we profit from it?
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As with all forms of maturation through the Spirit working in our experiences...fruits toward our final glory.
Zaatar71 said:
3] Do we consider it a mercy or just punishment?
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Its growth. Maybe growing pains. I wouldn't say mercy, but I might say love.

A sick child, before he can properly grow, must get better. If the sick child doesn't get better, he won't grow properly. If he doesn't grow properly, he just gets worse. So the child must get better so that he can grow properly.

We, in our journey from glory to glory, must stay healthy. If we are not healthy, God gives us medicine (code word for tough love). The medicine is intended to make us better. If we become better, then we continue to grow. If we don't get better, then we will get worse....maybe it's considered medicine.
Zaatar71 said:
4] Do we resist this chastisement ?
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Certainly not. But we do learn form our resistance. At least if we finally learn the lesson and begin to grow again.


Keep seeking God's truth (Prov 2)
 
Z

Zaatar71

Active Member
atpollard said:
Do you have any easier questions?
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HELLO ATPOLLARD, lol, These questions were in part generated by a recent sermon by a Pastor who places more emphasis on experiential doctrinal living in our actual lives. He has a way of taking familiar texts like this, and normally we would study a bit and say, the writer is quoting from proverbs and making a simple point that God will discipline us, end of story.
That being said he seeks to ask and consider if the text is meant to cause us to pause and work through the text with both understanding what is does and does not say, and then to meditate on how we can make use of this instruction to grow in grace and knowledge. He asked questions such as how do we know if we ourselves are being chastised? Do we see this work of the Spirit of God as a means of grace, or do we resist it?
He asked if we react against the second causes, ie, the people that God might providentially place in our path to be used as part of this correction.
Can a whole family, or church, or even nation be the object of such correction? In Amos 4 5x the nation was being chastized, and God said through the Prophet, yet you have not returned to me!
I am not sure if there is so much an easy question as there might be once we had a chance to think back to how God might have corrected us to get us back to where we strayed from our calling. I thought this could be a useful thread, if some have benefitted by this process spoken of in Hebrews12. Any follow up questions ,or thoughts would be welcome on this topic.
 
Z

Zaatar71

Active Member
Paleouss said:
Greetings Zaatar. I hope you are having a blessing Tuesday.

We know that God tests the hearts of men through experience (Prov 17:3) and through experience he tries them as silver is tried (Psa 66:10). Not that He might know the will of a man’s heart, for the Spirit already “searches all things'' (1Cor 2:10), cuts sharper than any double-edged sword (Heb 4:12) and judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart (Heb 4:12), exposing motives (1Cor 4:5); for “no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of him to whom we must give account” (Heb 4:13). No...man is tested by God, who sustains every experience of the day (Psa 139:16), so that we may be nurtured through what has been created toward this world’s intended end, which is God the Son.

That being said, God's chastisement comes to us through our experiences. These experiences, if properly received, produce fruits. These fruits of love, joy, peace, patience, etc... move us toward our final glory (our proper growth).

Inner conviction through devoted study and prayer...within our circumstances.

As with all forms of maturation through the Spirit working in our experiences...fruits toward our final glory.

Its growth. Maybe growing pains. I wouldn't say mercy, but I might say love.

A sick child, before he can properly grow, must get better. If the sick child doesn't get better, he won't grow properly. If he doesn't grow properly, he just gets worse. So the child must get better so that he can grow properly.

We, in our journey from glory to glory, must stay healthy. If we are not healthy, God gives us medicine (code word for tough love). The medicine is intended to make us better. If we become better, then we continue to grow. If we don't get better, then we will get worse....maybe it's considered medicine.

Certainly not. But we do learn form our resistance. At least if we finally learn the lesson and begin to grow again.
Keep seeking God's truth (Prov 2)
Click to expand...
Thank you for this scripturally solid post and well thought out response! The imagery of the refiners fire has been inscripturated for our learning upon whom the ends of the age have come.
[From bible study tools;Proverbs 17:3
The fining pot [is] for silver, and the furnace for gold
Refiners of silver have their fining pots, in which they purify the silver from the dross; and goldsmiths have their crucibles to melt and purify their gold, by which assays of the worth and value of it may be made; but the Lord trieth the hearts;
there is no vessel, as Gersom observes, in which they can be put and tried by creatures; a man does not know, nor can he thoroughly search and try his own heart, and much less the hearts of others; God only knows and tries them, ( Jeremiah 17:9 Jeremiah 17:10 ) ; The Septuagint, Vulgate Latin, and Arabic versions, render it by way of similitude, "as the fining pot is for silver" as silver is refined in the pot, and gold in the furnace, so are the hearts of God's people, and their graces tried and purified by him in the furnace of affliction; the variety of troubles they are exercised with are made useful for the purging away of the dross of sin and corruption, and for the brightening of their graces, ( 1 Peter 1:7 ) .]

This refiners fire could be, or, come in many forms. It could be people, church friends, people on the job, family members, enemies. This triggers many verses on the topic. here are a couple;

1pet.3:7 Likewise, ye husbands, dwell with them according to knowledge, giving honor unto the wife, as unto the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life; that your prayers be not hindered.

prov16:7 When a man's ways please the Lord, he maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him.

Failing to obey God in these situations causes disruption.
 
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