Death penalty

Salty · Thursday at 5:47 PM

On another page - it was stated:
"The right option would be my epically awesome Guvna' Ron Desantis.
Desantis just signed into law the Death penalty for child molesters and other rapists."

One might be against the death penalty in this case because if a person were to molest the child -
what would stop him from killing the child - if both (murder & molesting) penalties were the death penalty

What crimes other than First Degree murder should include the death penalty?

canadyjd · Thursday at 10:16 PM

Salty said:
On another page - it was stated:
"The right option would be my epically awesome Guvna' Ron Desantis.
Desantis just signed into law the Death penalty for child molesters and other rapists."

One might be against the death penalty in this case because if a person were to molest the child -
what would stop him from killing the child - if both (murder & molesting) penalties were the death penalty

What crimes other than First Degree murder should include the death penalty?

Since I am opposed to the death penalty, as a Christian following the command of scripture in 1 Timothy, I do not support adding to the list of crimes punishable by the death penalty.

Peace to you

canadyjd · Thursday at 11:02 PM

I remember in the late 80’s and into the 90’s, in Florida and else where, wild accusations of child abuse that turned out to be over zealous adults manipulating young children into making the accusations.

People make false accusations. The death penalty is a permanent punishment that cannot be undone.

Peace to you

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T13:01:02-0600

canadyjd said:
The death penalty is a permanent punishment that cannot be undone.

Peace to you

35 years in prison is a permanent punishment that cannot be undone.
That is a non-argument

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T13:06:03-0600

canadyjd said:
Since I am opposed to the death penalty, as a Christian following the command of scripture in 1 Timothy.

Adam Smith was correct:

Mercy to the guilty can be cruel to the innocent

No where in I Timothy are Christians commanded to not utilize the death penalty. that is nowhere stated (or even meaningfully implied).

The Death Penalty was ascribed and established (at minimum) for man in the case of murder in the first book of the Bible:
Gen. 9:6
Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.

Contra those who pretend to care about man's dignity as God's image-bearer, those who seek to preserve the life of the murderer DO NOT protect the sanctity of human life, they DENIGRATE it.
The reason the Death Penalty exists is to make a statement about the importance of human life, it is affirmation of it.

Paul: the author of the text in question has no problem with the concept that the government has the God-given weapon of "the sword" to combat evil-doers.

Rom. 13:14
For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T13:22:46-0600

Salty said:
What crimes other than First Degree murder should include the death penalty?

1.) All forms of rape. (<-I'd require it by law not make it optional)
2.) Grand Larceny
3.) Treason (already actually the case)
4.) Selling schedule 1 narcotics i.e. cocaine, chrystal-meth, crack
5.) Certain forms of involuntary manslaughter such as Drunken vehicular homicide....
6.) Certain forms of 2nd degree murder such as see above, or negligent manslaugher.

Scarlett O. · 2025-12-28T13:54:43-0600

Salty said:
On another page - it was stated:
"The right option would be my epically awesome Guvna' Ron Desantis.
Desantis just signed into law the Death penalty for child molesters and other rapists."

One might be against the death penalty in this case because if a person were to molest the child -
what would stop him from killing the child - if both (murder & molesting) penalties were the death penalty

What crimes other than First Degree murder should include the death penalty?

I believe in the death penalty for certain rapes and murders. Sometime life without parole can be enough. And God views rape as murder. See Deuteronomy 22:25-27. Yes, I know it's the Law.

“If out in the country a man happens to meet a young woman pledged to be married and rapes her, only the man who has done this shall die. Do nothing to the woman; she has committed no sin deserving death. This case is like that of someone who attacks and murders a neighbor, for the man found the young woman out in the country, and though the betrothed woman screamed, there was no one to rescue her.”

Salty · 2025-12-28T14:07:40-0600

Some Rando said:
35 years in prison is a permanent punishment that cannot be undone.
That is a non-argument

I might sound as though I am opposing myself
But
Life in prison does not mean "cannot be undone"
1) Escape
2) Pardon by Governor or POTUS
3) Sentence reduced (from life to say 50 ears)
4) Attempt a retrial

Reynolds · 2025-12-28T15:36:22-0600

Salty said:
On another page - it was stated:
"The right option would be my epically awesome Guvna' Ron Desantis.
Desantis just signed into law the Death penalty for child molesters and other rapists."

One might be against the death penalty in this case because if a person were to molest the child -
what would stop him from killing the child - if both (murder & molesting) penalties were the death penalty

What crimes other than First Degree murder should include the death penalty?

I hate a child molester. Having said that, there are a lot of people falsely convicted of child molestation.

canadyjd · 2025-12-28T17:47:46-0600

Some Rando said:
35 years in prison is a permanent punishment that cannot be undone.
That is a non-argument

35 years in prison gives 35 years for repentance and salvation.

Death gives no more chance for repentance or salvation. All Christians should appreciate that argument

Peace to you

rockytopva · 2025-12-28T17:47:54-0600

I used to work with the youth in ministry. I was always told never find yourself alone with children. If I couldn't find responsible adult help I wouldn't do it.

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T18:01:40-0600

canadyjd said:
35 years in prison gives 35 years for repentance and salvation.

Death gives no more chance for repentance or salvation. All Christians should appreciate that argument

Peace to you

35 years hardens men against knowing the futility of their situation.
35 years hardens them agains the gospel because they think they can beat the system.

Death.....puts them in a situation where they are face to face with their maker, and they have a sure and definite fate they fear.

You are sending men to hell with your liberal philosophy.

Those men you think you are showing mercy to aren't repenting.
They are HARDENING themselves against the gospel.

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.
They will NEVER fear God in your liberal scheme.
They will ALWAYS think they can beat it.

That's what happens.
If you want these men to genuinely repent........
They MUST, MUST, MUST, genuinely fear God and their fate, and then and ONLY THEN, will they cry out to their maker for mercy.

I know these men, I've worked with them for over 16 years.

You are sending them to Hell, with that Philosophy. And I hate it so much.
You THINK you are saving lives.
You are not.
You are Damning men to hell.

I hate that thinking so much.

canadyjd · 2025-12-28T18:02:57-0600

Some Rando said:
Adam Smith was correct:
View attachment 13190
No where in I Timothy are Christians commanded to not utilize the death penalty. that is nowhere stated (or even meaningfully implied).

I don’t follow the teachings of Adam Smith, thanks you. I follow scripture.

The Apostle Paul states he was the worst of sinners. He persecuted Christians to the death. He was a murderer.

He stated in 1 Timothy that God demonstrated mercy toward him as an example future Christians should follow.

You cannot support killing someone and show mercy to them at the same time.

Some Rando said:
The Death Penalty was ascribed and established (at minimum) for man in the case of murder in the first book of the Bible:
Gen. 9:6
Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.

Genesis 9 is a reference to the Old Testament practice of the “blood avenger”. There were no courts, lawyers, trials.

The statement is not an absolute statement that all murderers must be put to death.

Before Genesis 9, Cain was the first murderer and God did not require his life.

Before the OT Law, Moses was a murderer. God did not require his life.

After the OT Law, David was a murderer. God did not require his life.

After Christ came, the Apostle Paul was a murderer, God did not require his life.

Some Rando said:
….
Paul: the author of the text in question has no problem with the concept that the government has the God-given weapon of "the sword" to combat evil-doers.

Rom. 13:14
For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

There is no question about what 1Timothy teaches.

You are correct about Romans 13. Paul clearly states the government has the power of the sword. That is the death penalty.

But that does not mean Christians should support anyone being put to death.

Throughout history, God has used the ungodly to execute judgment upon people.

Christians are commanded to be different than the world.

Peace to you

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T18:04:20-0600

Reynolds said:
I hate a child molester. Having said that, there are a lot of people falsely convicted of child molestation.

Not any more.
This isn't the 80's

canadyjd · 2025-12-28T18:10:04-0600

Some Rando said:
35 years hardens men against knowing the futility of their situation.
35 years hardens them agains the gospel because they think they can beat the system.

Nonsense

Some Rando said:
Death.....puts them in a situation where they are face to face with their maker, and they have a sure and definite fate they fear.

The fear of death never brought anyone to God. Only God Holy Spirit can bring people to God

Some Rando said:
You are sending men to hell with your liberal philosophy.

Outrageous cowpie

Some Rando said:
Those men you think you are showing mercy to aren't repenting.
They are HARDENING themselves against the gospel.

You don’t know that. I have heard many stories of folks coming to salvation while in prison.

Some Rando said:
….

You are sending them to Hell, with that Philosophy. And I hate it so much.
You THINK you are saving lives.
You are not.
You are Damning men to hell.

I hate that thinking so much.

Then you hate the teaching of the Apostle Paul.

You seem to be a very angry man, full of hate.

Mercy, not death. Love not hate.

Peace to you

Reynolds · 2025-12-28T18:15:54-0600

Some Rando said:
Not any more.
This isn't the 80's

Yes. More now than ever. I am a retired police investigator. There are many false accusations. Investigators all too often turn the false accusation into a false conviction. In one of the sex crimes investigations classes I took, we had an expert interrogator demonstrate how easily it is for a family member to program a child into a false accusation. A child can easily be convinced things happened that did not happen? Custody disputes is where this often happens. I would be hesitant to sit on a jury and convict someone of child molestation.

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T18:23:42-0600

canadyjd said:
I don’t follow the teachings of Adam Smith, thanks you. I follow scripture.

I disagree.
You follow a modernist liberal philosophy which denies Original Sin and teaches a Tabula Rosa doctrine where men are a mere "blank-slate" no different from another, and their situation will dictate whether or not they are felons.
It is a dangerous philosophy which effects your Theology.

The Apostle Paul states he was the worst of sinners. He persecuted Christians to the death. He was a murderer.

I know.
That's elementary.
It's an elementary point.
and it's irrelevant to this discussion.

He stated in 1 Timothy that God demonstrated mercy toward him as an example future Christians should follow.

God is authorized to show mercy.
You aren't.

I didn't know you thought you were God.
He stated in 1 Timothy that God demonstrated mercy toward him as an example future Christians should follow.

You cannot support killing someone and show mercy to them at the same time.

Duh. It's not the Government's job to "show mercy".
It's God's. The Government's job is to punish evil-doers in order to protect the innocent.

The Apostle Paul states he was the worst of sinners. He persecuted Christians to the death. He was a murderer.

Yes, now say something interesting.

There is no question about what 1Timothy teaches.

There isn't and nowhere does it teach that Canady should spend his life "showing mercy" to baby-rapists.
Even though that appears to be what he is doing.

You are correct about Romans 13. Paul clearly states the government has the power of the sword. That is the death penalty.

Indeed it is, and it is for our good, and the good of society in general. They are "ministers" to us.

But that does not mean Christians should support anyone being put to death.

It does not mean they shouldn't. And I support it 100%

Throughout history, God has used the ungodly to execute judgment upon people.

And he has used the godly Samuel to grab a sword and hack the ungodly into pieces in front of the Nation of Israel.
What, then, is your point?

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T18:34:47-0600

Reynolds said:
Yes. More now than ever. I am a retired police investigator. There are many false accusations.

I know that false accusations are real. I'm not talking about the angry divorcee' woman who falsely alleges something about an ex-husband she's angry with.

Investigators all too often turn the false accusation into a false conviction.

So, You, then, as a self-proclaimed "police investigator" are the enemy who falsely accuses and locks up the innocent?

In one of the sex crimes investigations classes I took, we had an expert interrogator demonstrate how easily it is for a family member to program a child into a false accusation.

Only an idiot needs a "class" to see how obviously easy it would be for a talented investigator to coach a child or a family member into making a false confession.

A child can easily be convinced things happened that did not happen?

Yes, you shouldn't hire talented police investigators to coach children into making false confessions.
Similarly, judges should not allow coached confessions from easily-impressed children into a capital case.

Custody disputes is where this often happens.

Yes.
Because it is non-criminal and doesn't ever reach the status of a capital felony investigation.
Those are VASTLY more rigorous.
My own brother suffered from this.

I would be hesitant to sit on a jury and convict someone of child molestation.

As you should be.
There's a difference between the rigours of family court vs. a court of Capital crimes.
My argument is that when an obvious and avowed raper of babies is concerned, I want the perpetrator executed.

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T18:49:07-0600

canadyjd said:
The fear of death never brought anyone to God. Only God Holy Spirit can bring people to God

It absolutely does, all the time. The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.
It brings many people to God.

I have heard many stories of folks coming to salvation while in prison.

I've worked in the prison system for 16 years (you haven't).
Stories are stupid.
Everyone with a life sentence thinks of ONLY one thing:
Beating either the conviction or the sentence itself:
They just want out. That's all.

Of course, I do know a "lifer" that has repented and come to Christ in prison. (they are the rarest exception actually).
Such beings exist.
But, that is no form of evidence for or against the doctrine.
No stories, yours or mine, are the point or even particularly relevant.

What I WOULD say, is this:
The most hardened of criminals: (murderes, rapists, etc...)
Do not respond to mercy...they respond to fear.
Let me say that again, they respon to FEAR.

IF they genuinely FEAR meeting Their maker, you may indeed be infinitely more likely to fall on your face and repent and beg for mercy.
Neither you nor I have the requisite "stories" to support that observation, because people like you refuse to allow such a discussion to occur.

Then you hate the teaching of the Apostle Paul.

That's just a mean and stupid thing to say.

You seem to be a very angry man, full of hate.

That's just a mean and angry and hateful thing to say.

Mercy, not death. Love not hate.

Well, that's just a gay thing to say.

Some Rando · 2025-12-28T18:55:39-0600

canadyjd said:
You seem to be a very angry man, full of hate.

You seem to be a man who is passionate about protecting baby-rapists.
How does that suit you?

Death penalty

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