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Where Did Our Faith Come From?

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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
Yeah but where does spiritual hearing with understanding come from ?
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In Acts 2 Peter preached a message to the people that Jesus Christ is both Lord and Christ (the Messiah).

Peter charged them, "God has made that same Jesus whom you have crucified both Lord and Christ."

When they heard this "they were pricked to the heart" and asked "what shall we do?"

How were they pricked to the heart?

Heb. 4:12

"For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart."

They heard the Gospel (the Word of God) from Peter and by the power of the Holy Spirit they were convicted (pricked to the heart), but they didn't know what to do (the depravity of man).

Peter told them what to do, repent and be baptized, and the Scripture says, "then they that gladly received his word were baptized."

They heard the Word, the Holy Spirit convicted of sin, and they chose to believe (receiving his word).
 
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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
Where does spiritual hearing with spiritual understanding come from ?
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It's in the message that comes from the Word of God. Remember that "faith comes from hearing the Word of God," right?

Another example.

When Paul and Silas were locked fast in the stocks in a Philippian jail, they were praying and singing hymns praising the Lord.

The jailer no doubt had heard Paul and Silas preaching in the meeting places around town or had heard of this Jesus that they preached.

When the earthquake came and all the locks fell off the prisoners, Paul told him there was nothing to worry about, we are all here.

The jailer would have been put to death if any prisoners had escaped.

He came and fell at the feet of Paul and Silas asking the same thing those at Pentecost asked Peter, having heard the word and seen the power of God, he asked, "what must I do to be saved?"

The convicting power of the Holy Spirit was on him, and again, he didn't know what to do.

This time it was Paul and Silas that told depraved man what to do.

In both cases God knew who would believe and He provided the message and the messenger to seal salvation.

The faith to believe something that man cannot initially understand comes from the Word of God.
 
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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
It's in the message that comes from the Word of God. Remember that "faith comes from hearing the Word of God," right?
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Faith comes by hearing but where does the ability to spiritually hear come from ? When Jesus says men cannot hear His word like in Jn 8:43 He doesnt mean they cant physically hear it, He means Spiritually. So dont get them confused
 
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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
MrW said:
It comes from receiving the Word of God when it’s read or heard.
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Spiritual hearing doesn't come from physical hearing; else Jesus would not have told these jews they couldn't hear His word Jn 8:43

43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. Now of course they heard Him naturally with the physical ear, so what does Jesus mean they cant hear His word ?
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
Faith comes by hearing but where does the ability to spiritually hear come from ? When Jesus says men cannot hear His word like in Jn 8:43 He doesnt mean they cant physically hear it, He means Spiritually. So dont get them confused
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BF they could hear they just would not accept what was being said.

Joh 8:43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you are unable to accept My message. BSB
 
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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
Faith comes by hearing but where does the ability to spiritually hear come from ? When Jesus says men cannot hear His word like in Jn 8:43 He doesnt mean they cant physically hear it, He means Spiritually. So dont get them confused
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Hearing has a two-fold meaning, BF.

We can hear through the ears and through the heart.

The Scripture says that the heart of man is desperately wicked, who can know it?

The Holy Spirit can know it and He goes through the ears of man to his heart.

He reveals to man his true heart and man must make a choice to be what God desires of him or what man desires of himself.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
Jesus said they cannot hear Jn 8:43 read it carefully
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I did BF. The fact you cannot understand clear scripture is your problem not mine.

(BSB 1.2) Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you are unable to accept My message.

(ESV) Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word.

KJV) Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

(NASB 95) "Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you cannot hear My word.

(NET+) Why don't you understand what I am saying? It is because you cannot accept my teaching.

(NIV 02) Why is my language not clear to you? Because you are unable to hear what I say.

(NKJV-rs/) "Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word.

(NLTs/) Why can't you understand what I am saying? It's because you can't even hear Me!

(NRSV/) Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot accept my word.

(UASV+) Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you are not able to hear my word.

Were those to whom Christ was speaking deaf, NO. They could hear but did not understand it or accept it. That is why they reject Him.
 
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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
Jesus is speaking of a spiritual hearing with spiritual understanding, Now Jesus said to some men, they cannot hear, He isnt talking about physical hearing, do you understand that ?
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This is why they or anyone for that matter cannot hear Him, BF.

They chose not t believe Him, the loved their way, the Devil's way, not God's way.

John 8:43-45

"Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not."
 
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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
Jesus says they cannot chose to believe His word. How can someone choose to do something they dont have the ability to do. Can a blind person choose to see ?
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That's the Calvinist Handbook you're falling back on, BF.

They could not hear because they were of their father Satan.

They had already chosen what they would believe in their own lusts, and Christ was not what they wanted.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
So what does cannot mean ? Jesus said they cannot hear
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BF you have seen the clear text but you still refuse to accept it as it does not fit your warped theory of salvation.

Your view makes a mockery of the gospel message and even the death and resurrection of Christ Jesus.

You may make yourself feel good by twisting the word of God but you are only fooling yourself. It is really sad that someone that claims to preach the word of God would have such little regard for the word of God.
 
atpollard

atpollard

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
It's in the message that comes from the Word of God. Remember that "faith comes from hearing the Word of God," right?
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No, I don’t think that “hearing” the word of God is enough. There are lots of atheists and heretics that can quote scripture better than most Christians. Clearly, they heard the word without understanding the TRUTH behind those words.

You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder. - James 2:19 [NASB]

And He said, "To you it has been granted to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest [they are told] in parables, so that while seeing they may not see, and while hearing they may not understand.” - Luke 8:10 [NASB]

"Yet to this day the LORD has not given you a heart to know, nor eyes to see, nor ears to hear.” - Deuteronomy 29:4 [NASB]

When the Gentiles heard this, they [began] rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed. - Acts 13:48 [NASB]
 
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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
atpollard said:
No, I don’t think that “hearing” the word of God is enough. There are lots of atheists and heretics that can quote scripture better than most Christians. Clearly, they heard the word without understanding the TRUTH behind those words.

You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder. - James 2:19 [NASB]

And He said, "To you it has been granted to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest [they are told] in parables, so that while seeing they may not see, and while hearing they may not understand.” - Luke 8:10 [NASB]

"Yet to this day the LORD has not given you a heart to know, nor eyes to see, nor ears to hear.” - Deuteronomy 29:4 [NASB]

When the Gentiles heard this, they [began] rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord; and all who had been appointed to eternal life believed. - Acts 13:48 [NASB]
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That's the difference in hearing with the ear and hearing with the heart.

Those "atheists and heretics" have heard with the ears but have already made the decision they don't want Christ.

They cannot hear from the heart just as the Pharisee's could not hear, they have already made that choice.
 
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