Was Jesus raised back up in same Body was born in? Does he still have his wounds on Him now?This was covered in an earlier article. The translation above is faulty, leading to a misconstruction of what Job is actually affirming..
Job’s Resurrection Verse: Job 19:25-26
What does Job actually “know” here?It is different from what many today say He knows. “For I know that my redeemer lives, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:…asterisktom.wordpress.com
Job’s Resurrection Verse: Job 19:25-26:
“For I know that my redeemer lives, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God:”
What does Job actually “know” here? It is different from what many futurists today say He knows.
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Some Thoughts on the Post-Incarnate Christ
- Thread starter asterisktom
- Start date
Excellent article Tom.
Excerpts:
"...2. More importantly, the “see[ing] God” does not come “in” the flesh, but “from” the flesh. In other words, Job is not voicing a confidence that he will, in some future time, have a fleshly body with which he will see God. He is saying that even after his body will be destroyed he will still – afterward – see God. The destruction of his body will have no bearing on his assurance of seeing God. And this interpretation I didn’t get from my fellow Preterists. I knew about it long before. Consider these mainline sources:
“And after my skin, thus torn to pieces,
And without my flesh shall I behold Eloah,”
“Therefore by far the majority of modern expositors have decided that Job does not indeed here avow the hope of the resurrection, but the hope of a future spiritual beholding of God, and therefore of a future life;” – Keil & Delitzsch
“After they shall have destroyed my skin, this shall happen – that I will see God.” – Gesenius
“The literal meaning is, “from, or out of, my flesh shall I see God.” It does not mean in his flesh, which would have been expressed by the preposition ב (b) – but there is the notion that from or out of his flesh he would see him;”
It cannot be proved that this refers to the resurrection of that body, and indeed the natural interpretation is against it.“
– Barnes
“And after this skin of mine is destroyed I will yet, without flesh, see God.” – Luther (translated from the German)
...Our blessed hope does not include eternal life in physical bodies, however glorified. We will have perfect spiritual existence in individual bodies. This is neither (as I have been accused) gnosticism or Eastern pantheistic oversoul existence. It is plainly what the Bible teaches. To get to the proof of this – and it admittedly is a slow and painstaking process – one must first deal with each and every passage that seems to teach otherwise. These two verses in Job are prime candidates, seeing that they are often quoted to teach what they pointedly do not teach...."
The passage from Job is sacred ground to the typical 'anti-Pret'.
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My apologies, Ben. if I've mistaken you for the typical close minded 'anti-Pret'.
Ben1445
Well-Known Member
Thank you for the reply.
I do appreciate your input.
Why do you suppose that translators would translate opposite of what it says. And what is the preterist Bible that translates everything accurately.
A bit tongue in cheek, yes, but still a serious question.
Ben1445
Well-Known Member
You have told me before that I can be a smart mouth. I don’t doubt that I deserve the reaction based on some of our interactions. I’m typically not a closed minded person on things that have not happened yet. It is easier to be definitive about things that are settled and in the history books. (Though history is only as accurate as the writers view is accurate.)
And while I am not a preterist, I don’t mind discussing it.
37818
Well-Known Member
Romans 8:11, But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
In this instance:
Job 19 - YLT
26 | And after my skin hath compassed this [body], Then from my flesh I see God: |
OT Translations
JPS Tanakh 1917
And when after my skin this is destroyed, Then without my flesh shall I see God;
JPS Tanakh 1917
And when after my skin this is destroyed, Then without my flesh shall I see God;
37818
Well-Known Member
.
27, . . . Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. . . .
John 20:24-28.
27, . . . Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. . . .
full blown preterism is heresy
…typical close minded 'anti-Pret'….
True to form the ‘heresy bird’ flys over and drops another splat on another thread.
Amen brother and I believe it will be in incorruptible flesh.
Very true. And how many times do they trot out "reach your hand here, Thomas", as if anyone is denying the physical resurrection.
Then how do you get past flesh and blood not entering into heaven?
Thanks, kyredneck. This was one of the passages I also would preach from. Until I started to really examine the passage. None of these gentlemen I quoted could be call preterists, yet they do a good job of "fleshing out" the passage. (I think there is a good pun there somewhere.)
Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
For this corruptible [body of flesh] must put on incorruption, and this mortal [soul] must put on immortality.
1 Cor 15;50,51,53
Ben1445
Well-Known Member
How do you get beyond the redemption of our bodies?
…raised incorruptible?
"Bodies" does not require flesh and blood. "There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body", 1 Cor. 15:44
The real you is spiritual. We are created in the image of God. God is spirit.
No disagreement here.
For those who insist that humanity inherently requires being physical, two questions concerning Christ's words about Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob:
1. Were those three Patriarchs human at that time Jesus spoke? Yes or no.
2. Were they physical at that time that Jesus spoke? Yes or no.
If you say yes to the first and no to the second then you should see that being physical is not required to be human.
If you say any other combination of answers, then, we would have a totally different problem.
1. Were those three Patriarchs human at that time Jesus spoke? Yes or no.
2. Were they physical at that time that Jesus spoke? Yes or no.
If you say yes to the first and no to the second then you should see that being physical is not required to be human.
If you say any other combination of answers, then, we would have a totally different problem.