Translation Improvement by Minimizing "thing"

Van · Tuesday at 5:05 PM

Luke 2:15 NASB
When the angels had gone away from them into heaven, the shepherds began saying to one another, “Let us go straight to Bethlehem then, and see this thing G4487 that has happened which the Lord has made known to us.”

The Greek word translated as "thing" is "Rhema" and has several meanings, one of which is the "thing spoken of."
So the idea is not any old "thing" but whatever event was verbally described.

Therefore, if the translations more closely adheres to the historical-grammatical meaning of this context, it would read, "...and see this declared event that has happened, which the Lord has made known to us."

The problem with translating a contextually indicated object or event as "thing" is that anything can be read into the text.

For example, most believers take for granted that "All things are possible with God." But what scripture actually says is "all of the contextually indicated things" are possible with God." And what is literally said is All (ellipsis) are possible with God. The word "things" again has been supplied by the translators. Matthew 19:26 and Mark 10:27 should be contextually translated as All salvations are possible with God.

Another verse in the same vein is Luke 18:27. The NASB adds to the text "the things that are impossible with people" when the actual text reads "the impossible with people" are possible with God.

Sadly, the Greek word for "all" (pas) is translated about 170 times as "all things." A simple fix is when we come across the phrase, is to consider it as if it read "all these things."

Van · Saturday at 4:29 PM

Matthew 11:27 NASB
All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son determines to reveal Him.

Here is an example of "all (pas) being translated out of context. Jesus is discussing how the things which God had hidden had now been handed over to Him to reveal, but many in some cities had rejected the revelation authenticated by miracles. Thus the correct, contextual translation should be all these things.

Ben1445 · Saturday at 6:03 PM

Psalms 8:6
Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands;
thou hast put all things under his feet:

Isaiah 44:24
Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer,
and he that formed thee from the womb,
I am the LORD that maketh all things;
that stretcheth forth the heavens alone;
that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;

John 16:15
All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

1 Corinthians 15:28
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Luke 10:22
All things are delivered to me of my Father: and no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.

Ephesians 1:22
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

Matthew 11:27
All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

John 13:3
Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

Hebrews 2:8
Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.

I know I’m going to be scolded for not saying anything so I’ll just say that I think these places help each other in the understanding of all things. Sometimes Scripture says it better than anybody else ever could.
That is my opinion. I reserve the right to disagree with the OP and allow for him to disagree with me.

Van · 2026-05-10T11:55:54-0500

Ben1445 said:
Psalms 8:6
Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands;
thou hast put all things under his feet:

Isaiah 44:24
Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer,
and he that formed thee from the womb,
I am the LORD that maketh all things;
that stretcheth forth the heavens alone;
that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;

John 16:15
All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

1 Corinthians 15:28
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Luke 10:22
All things are delivered to me of my Father: and no man knoweth who the Son is, but the Father; and who the Father is, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him.

Ephesians 1:22
And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

Matthew 11:27
All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

John 13:3
Jesus knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he was come from God, and went to God;

Hebrews 2:8
Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.

I know I’m going to be scolded for not saying anything so I’ll just say that I think these places help each other in the understanding of all things. Sometimes Scripture says it better than anybody else ever could.
That is my opinion. I reserve the right to disagree with the OP and allow for him to disagree with me.

Yes, posters have the right to disagree and provide no basis for their disagreement. Without a basis, we might speculate the disagreement arises from animosity. But that might be an argument from facts not in evidence.

But let us go through them:

Psalm 8:6 God established that mankind would rule of part of His creation, and not everything imaginable; see Genesis 1:26. A contextual translation would read you have place all earthy creation under their rule.

Isaiah 44:24 Simply says God alone spread out the heavens and the earth. Contextually "all things" is not to be found.

John 13:3 says Jesus knew the Father had handed over all His disciples to Him, prepared to serve them one more time before His ultimate service for mankind.

John 16:15 Here Jesus tells His Apostles that when the Holy Spirit comes, the Holy Spirit will disclose to them all the truth about the future known by the Father and the Son.

I could go on but to what point, the context provides the answer, and therefore "all things" is a terrible translation choice. It turns the readers mind away from the context and to "everything imaginable. " Hideous malfeasance that should be obvious to all.

Ben1445 · 2026-05-10T12:55:33-0500

Van said:
Yes, posters have the right to disagree and provide no basis for their disagreement. Without a basis, we might speculate the disagreement arises from animosity. But that might be an argument from facts not in evidence.

But let us go through them:

Psalm 8:6 God established that mankind would rule of part of His creation, and not everything imaginable; see Genesis 1:26. A contextual translation would read you have place all earthy creation under their rule.

This poster denies that all things in heaven and earth are subject to Christ and put under Him as declared in Hebrews 2:8

Colossians 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Van said:
Isaiah 44:24 Simply says God alone spread out the heavens and the earth. Contextually "all things" is not to be found.

John 1:3
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Colossians 1:16
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Van said:
John 13:3 says Jesus knew the Father had handed over all His disciples to Him, prepared to serve them one more time before His ultimate service for mankind.

Now Van is a Calvinist.

Van said:
John 16:15 Here Jesus tells His Apostles that when the Holy Spirit comes, the Holy Spirit will disclose to them all the truth about the future known by the Father and the Son.

I could go on but to what point, the context provides the answer, and therefore "all things" is a terrible translation choice. It turns the readers mind away from the context and to "everything imaginable. " Hideous malfeasance that should be obvious to all.

Some people are willing to take their errors to their graves.

I recommend that you review all things pertaining to “all things.”
The Bible specifically states in some places that all things means that there is nothing left out, contrary to the opinion that you have given.

Van · 2026-05-10T13:55:51-0500

Ben1445 said:
This poster denies that all things in heaven and earth are subject to Christ and put under Him as declared in Hebrews 2:8

Colossians 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

John 1:3
All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Colossians 1:16
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Now Van is a Calvinist.

Some people are willing to take their errors to their graves.

I recommend that you review all things pertaining to “all things.”
The Bible specifically states in some places that all things means that there is nothing left out, contrary to the opinion that you have given.

Hebrews 2:8 NASB
YOU HAVE PUT EVERYTHING IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET.”
For in subjecting all things to him, He left nothing that is not subject to him. But now we do not yet see all things subjected to him.

1) The Greek reads "You have put "all" in subjection under His feet. The question is 'all" of what? And the answer is found in the context.

2) Next we read, "For in subjecting all (elipsis) to Him. Again no answer to the fundamental question which every bible student must ask, "all of what?"

3) He left nothing that is not subject to Him. Here we must answer the question, just who is the "Him?" From the next verse, the "Him" refers to God incarnate, in human form. So His created physical body, the same as ours, was made a little lower than angels. But He, God the Son, was NOT made.

4) So from the context, we find everything - every created thing - was placed under His foot. So the context of this verse supports "all things!"

5) The claim I deny or have denied this is false and might reflect animosity.

6) The rest of the post simply tries to read into one verse an interpretation from another verse. Not the work product of actual bible study.

Ben1445 · 2026-05-10T14:08:43-0500

Van said:
Hebrews 2:8 NASB
YOU HAVE PUT EVERYTHING IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET.”
For in subjecting all things to him, He left nothing that is not subject to him. But now we do not yet see all things subjected to him.

1) The Greek reads "You have put "all" in subjection under His feet. The question is 'all" of what? And the answer is found in the context.

2) Next we read, "For in subjecting all (elipsis) to Him. Again no answer to the fundamental question which every bible student must ask, "all of what?"

3) He left nothing that is not subject to Him. Here we must answer the question, just who is the "Him?" From the next verse, the "Him" refers to God incarnate, in human form. So His created physical body, the same as ours, was made a little lower than angels. But He, God the Son, was NOT made.

4) So from the context, we find everything - every created thing - was placed under His foot. So the context of this verse supports "all things!"

5) The claim I deny or have denied this is false and might reflect animosity.

6) The rest of the post simply tries to read into one verse an interpretation from another verse. Not the work product of actual bible study.

If you look back at my first post here, I didn’t say they were all talking about the same all things. There are even more times that all things is used that I didn’t quote.
I just said that these references would be helpful to review and understand.

In each case, whether or not you come up with accurate answers, it is true that what is meant by all things can be determined by context.
Because of this, I see no reason to ban their use.

Translation Improvement by Minimizing "thing"

Van

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