Secular Humanism

My point, Jim, is that (despite your constant implications otherwise) I hold myself accountable to the larger Christian community (as well as my church and my family) for my biblical interpretation.

You keep saying that it's all about me, as if I'm making this stuff up. But I used to be a fundamentalist (and fiercely anti-gay). Years of serious, prayerful Bible study brought me past that. One of the ways that I can confirm the legitimacy of that journey is by looking seriously at the work of other Christians.

Joshua

 

Joshua,

The problem that I see is that your "journey" and the crowd that you insist on calling "mainstream christians" are, in some points, in direct undeniable contradiction to plain unmistakeable scripture. You can rationalize around it all you want but it doesn't change it one iota.

 

The religious mainstream of Christs time said crucify Him.

[ November 14, 2001: Message edited by: Brian ]

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brian:
The religious mainstream of Christs time said crucify Him.

[ November 14, 2001: Message edited by: Brian ]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

And without them, Jesus would not have been crucified and the whole plan would have failed. I can just see the Savior now walking around Jerusalem: "Will somebody please crucify me so that I can die for your sins!"

Snide remarks aside, I grew up in a "mainstream" church and there was NO doctrine to be recognized at all. It was indistiguishable from humanism + a few parables from the gospels.

Lithopaedion

 

&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;In your profile [Lithopaedion], I've noticed that you claim no religion and are not a member of a Baptist church. You are welcome to post in our "Free for all" section. It is my hope and prayer that you will come to know Jesus Christ as your personal Savior.&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;

He may look for a more welcoming group!

 

Joy: "Women are equal in value, but the Bible has given them different roles."


Yes, separate but equal. That's what our officials use to say back before "Brown vs. Board of Education". I liked those days.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Wester:
Joy: "Women are equal in value, but the Bible has given them different roles."


Yes, separate but equal. That's what our officials use to say back before "Brown vs. Board of Education". I liked those days.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Next time you need to make use of a public restroom, go into the one for the opposite sex; unless you don't want to make a statement opposing "separate but equal."

 

The lack of sound doctrine is not the reason that humanism has crept in and found a home in our churches. While sound doctrine is an absolute must, sound doctrine is not our chief calling.

Our chief calling is to satisfy ourselves in God...not merely His gifts but Him. Look at what Jeremiah says about what really makes God angry:

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Jeremiah 2:12-13 12 "Be appalled, O heavens, at this, And shudder, be very desolate," declares the Lord. 13 "For My people have committed two evils: They have forsaken Me, The fountain of living waters, To hew for themselves cisterns , Broken cisterns That can hold no water. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Humanism is an good idea of what is symbolized by "broken cisterns" here. Of course so is a self-centered desire to impose "pure" doctrine on everyone around you.

You want to make God angry? Replace Him with anything else as the object of your affections. This includes concern for the "health" of the planet, the reconciliation of the races, ending poverty, fixing the tax code, riding the world of terrorism, riding my church of any spec of incorrect (i.e. usually that which disagrees with my own) doctrine, etc...

Each of these things are good things that have value. However, "humanism" (or that which places man as the central concern) can be used to describe the incorrect pursuit of any of these values.

BTW, I am nailing myself here.

Closing thought: What do you think angers God more:

1. A group that preaches the "social gospel".
2. A group that is so down in the mouth angry about making sure that their doctrine is pure that they make a life with God appear boring or miserable.

 

&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;Closing thought: What do you think angers God more:

1. A group that preaches the "social gospel".

2. A group that is so down in the mouth angry about making sure that their doctrine is pure that they make a life with God appear boring or miserable. &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;


Maybe God likes them both.