Dr. Bob Griffin His Profile says he likes judging others whats that all about?

< Oh how Christians love to judge, condemn, gossip and malign other people while they themselves commit all sorts of other sins. >

We sure does. Ain't it funnnnnn?

< "Righteous Judgement" Who was Jesus talking to? >

Why everybody, of course. That's why the words are preserved for all to read.

< What were these people ordained to do for the Jews at the time? >

Polish the gold earrings for their camels?

< Where is it written that you may go around and judge and comdemn every sinner you come across? >

In the above question, for one place.

< You want to see a sinner? Look in the mirror. >

Is a sinner THAT good-looking?

< Eyes, speck and beam. >

What's this? a new trinity?

< "He who is without sin, cast the first stone" >

Since Jesus is the chief cornerstone and he was cast long ago, I suppose we can cast the rest of them.

< You without sin yet? >

Not sure; how far is the east from the west?

 

Raulf, please accept the humbleness in which this is offered; but just about all of the verses you presented deal with hypocrisy, not "judgement."

You are CORRECT when you talk about the evil of condemning others; but that does NOT mean we are not to judge at all. It means that we are to discern (judge) correctly. Make wise choices, based on righteousness.

For instance, we know that abortion is wrong (most of us, any way). Therefore, we have "judged" that abortion is wrong in God's eyes, and we have "judged" that those who commit abortion are doing something wrong in God's eyes.

Do we now condemn them for this? Totally different matter.

The purpose of judgement is not to be a judge and condemn, but to discern what is right and good. And then to teach others.

We MUST love our neighbor enough to judge that what they're doing is wrong, and tell them in order to restore them (Galatians 6:1).

But not hypocritically; as you've pointed out, it's hard to tell someone not to drink to excess when you're killing off a six-pack yourself.

 

"If I am gossiping and maligning someone (sinning) I also have no right to judge a fornicator because we are both sinning "

Have not though been cleansed by Christ?

Chew on that one for a little bit. I look forward to your response.

Until Next Post, Adam

 

It is you Raulf7, that is judging all the others who are posting. Have you read your replies? Raulf7 writes on this page: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>We cant judge others sins. We have no right to when we also have a sin nature. Thats between them and God. Now if their sin directly affects your life thats a different matter. But, if its someone who isnt affecting your life then you have no right to run around pointing out their sins and judging them.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>And again on this page: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>You want to see a sinner? Look in the mirror. Eyes, speck and beam. "He who is without sin, cast the first stone" You without sin yet?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

&lt; Why do you have to meddle in others affairs anyway? &gt;

How are you not meddling in others' affairs if you ask a person why he meddles in others' affairs? In the same way, how are you not judging if you judge someone for judging?

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Raulf7:
Why dont you stick to the issue instead of strawmen.

I am not judging you. I dont know your sins, I simply asked a question, I didnt make a statement<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Explain the difference then between 'judging' someone and asking them why they 'don't stop' doing something wrong you assume they are doing? If you don't assume they are doing this wrong, then your question is absolutely idle. And *judging a person for judging a person* is completely within the issues here.

 

Raulf7,

I think we are arguing over a definition of terms here, not what is Biblically right or wrong. Natan'el Bar Tholmai stated that there are different definitions of judgement and you are only focusing on the first one. You are right, we are not to be judgemental, but the others are right too, we are commanded to make judgements on our brothers. I too, made the same mistake in an earlier thread and realized that by saying I would not "judge" others was not exactly what I was "supposed" to do.

As for your questions, no, we do not ask about their sins, or command an inspection. We are judging sins that are obvious, that are blantant and do not need to be investigated. I guess we are judging their "fruits".

Here is where we draw the line. We have to keep false prophets out and we are told to help keep our brother from straying from the truth. The "attitude" in which we handle the matter is VERY important, but we are told to do so.


1 Corinthians 5
11 "But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
12
For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
13
But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person."

1 Corinthians 6
3 "Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
4
If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.
5
I speak to your shame. Is it so, that there is not a wise man among you? no, not one that shall be able to judge between his brethren?
6
But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers."

Galatians 6:1 "Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted."

2 Timothy 2
24 "And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25
In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
26
And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will."

Titus 2:15 "These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee."

James 5
19 "Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;
20
Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins."

 

Raulf, I understand what you're saying...but you're not taking it "further." You're taking it too far.

We are not to judge in the manner of condemnation; i.e., we are not to condemn.

But we MUST be able to ascertain what is right, and good, and acceptable--and we MUST be able to teach that to others, while also making ourselves teachable.

If my brother is taken up in a fault, is it because he hasn't been taught that God finds what he's doing displeasing? In this case, I must judge that my brother is doing something displeasing, and then I must restore (teach) him. In this manner, I'm "judging," but NOT condemning. And in the act of restoring, I'm fulfilling the commandment "love they neighbor."

If I do not judge at all, I FAIL to restore my brethren. In this manner, I'm like the man who was given one talent and hid it in the dirt; I benefit no one but myself. And as the apostle Paul tells us in Romans 15, we ARE our brothers' keepers, and it is our responsibility to disciple and train.

We ARE to judge, Raulf; we are NOT to condemn.

 

Not asking you to "poke your nose" into others' lives.

When you learn of someone's indiscretion? Whether by accident or otherwise?

Do you keep your nose out of their business? Or do you attempt to restore such a one?

Don't you love your brethren enough to tell them when they're doing wrong? Because if YOU don't, aren't they more than likely to continue in their folly because no one has taught them?

Or perhaps we should just leave them to the wolves? To their own destruction, because we were too afraid to "judge"?

Or, as the saying goes, perhaps we should just let the sheep starve....

Don't go looking, Raulf; you're correct. But if you see, don't turn a blind eye, either.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Raulf7:
My judging is reserved for those I am responsible for, my family.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Is not the Church your family?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>
The HS is far more effective than me and I leave these matters to God, he is the ultimate source of power. I will not stand in his place and assume I can do a better job than him.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Have you ever let the Holy Spirit work "through" you?

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>
Otherwise I believe in privacy and I wont embarass anyone.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are there not guidelines on exactly how to do that? (Can't think of the reference off the top of my head) We are to go to them alone, then take two or three then bring them before the church? (anyone have the scripture refrence for this one?) I may not have the procedure correct, but we are told how to handle it and the more private method is preferred, but will not always work.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>
If I go to someone and say "hey, you shouldnt do that sin", I am making an issue of my own self righteousness and none of us can stand the test.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

does that go for the unsaved as well? Will let you let them die and go to hell not hearing the salvation message because you do not want to be considered "self righteous" and do not want to invade thier privacy?

Please, if any of you see that I am erring from the way, correct me lovingly, do not let me continue in my sin and grieve my Lord! I may not listen, but God will work, and can work "through" you all to help me see the light!

~Lorelei

 

Raulf, I'm not out to change your mind, believe it or not. Just to make you think.

Read Galatians 6:1, Romans 14, Romans 15. That's all I ask.

Doesn't the Holy Spirit use others, as well as working through each of us?

When we're told that the second greatest commandment is to love our neighbor, does that mean our neighbor is only our family?

Just out to make ya think. God Bless!

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Raulf7:
And yes I truly feel judging others is a sin.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Then stop doing it!