Some Basic Info On John Calvin

Psa 118:8 -- Nobody should believe unless the Spirit speaks.

The whole book so far is a "cat fight." I am surprised either one took on the project! But it is done and what can we glean from it? Both likely -- surely -- have SOME truth.

This is PRECISELY the quote Hunt uses. Do you find repentance here? Do you find ANY initiative/commitment that originated in Calvin???

skypair

 

Your testimony regarding this matter is true. But it is thus undermines Calvin's teaching. How? If we cannot be sure, there is no reason to believe. The Bible says "faith to faith." Rom 1:17 This is not that.

skypair

 

I'll have to look it up.

Yeah, I know. Pathetic, eh?

Do I believe he researched what he says? Yeah. I am still waiting for the "VALID" rejoinder, BTW.

Now you are just getting "overwrought," JA. I could as easily say you are programmed to hate me - or free will. Do you know that gays say they are "programmed" that way? Isn't that what the "elect" contend, too?

skypair

 

Try me. raying: Is your salvation "conditional?"

I was younger than Calvin when I believed and received Christ. I know the mental state. To me, he sounds like someone who fell asleep and, in that vulnerable state, he was 'implanted' with one of those "chips" that the "Invaders" used to reprogram earthlings, no? What would be more descriptive of what happens when one it "regenerated" before one has "faith" and serves Christ??

You're welcome to respond. That is merely a comparison -- not an insult.

skypair

 

maybe its a good idea to know what you are talking about before you post. Just a idea.

What part is pathetic in this statement...

As one that happens to know church history, I can say for sure he did not research it. Trust me on this one.

You tell me what gays say...I don't have a clue myself. But I do know this you have no clue about Calvinism. You prove it each time you post. You have shown yourself either unable to remember, or unable to understand. No one claims men are programmed other then those who don’t understand Calvinim. So..write it down this time and place it in a place you can remember. Now say it with me.

Calvinism does not believe men are programmed.

Got it?

Understand this time?

Need I say it again?

Now go write it on the board 100 times....so you will never forget again.

If you forget, just ask me again before you post lies like you keep doing. People are starting to laugh at you Sky. I’m just trying to help you save face. I’m glad I could help you on this.

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"Gratuitous adoption." Thinking one is adopted on account of one's 'election' rather than on account of one's belief.

Can you prove this? Or are you trained to just deny it?

What would you call it if some are predestined to reprobation? Or how about to election since that also entails the elect, following their regeneration, actually believing every time (100%) in Jesus and repenting. Yet these are not things they would naturally do on their own.

Now those are, admittedly, rather simple "programs." Some Calvinists will say, to boot, that God controls every decision, act, etc. and predestined it before ere the earth was created. What do you call these -- "decrees?"

skypair

 

You may be right, rip. I'm sorry if that wasn't the case. It was my understanding that Beza was a "flaming Calvinist" taking the theology where Calvin hadn't intended. But such is memory that it is imperfect at times. I never meant to study history anyway -- just theology which I can compare with scripture.

skypair

 

Don't be a zero.

If it was "due us" as you claim, it would not be gratuitous.

In other words you did not write it down. Shame on you. I told you, that you would forget.

What would you call it if some are predestined to reprobation?
Bible truth.

Bible truth.

Not in the nature man. You seem to be getting it now. Good job.

It is not. Once again you show poor understanding. Now please write it down this time. This is getting old to go over it again and again. NNE BUY CALVINIST HATERS CALL IT PROGRAMMING.

You want to know why? They are not able to understand.
If anything it is deprogram from the sin nature.

.
You mean they believe the Bible? That's a good thing...right? I mean I think it is.

I can tell now you will never get this. God forces no decisions, but controls all decision. I'll not take the time to help you on this. I'm sure it make no sense to you.

Yes....decrees are by God , Sky. Maybe there is hope for you.

 

I like that -- "due us." Paul used that, didn't he -- "then is grace of debt and no more grace." Fortunately he was referring "works salvation," not to "belief and obedience salvation" where we take God up on His PROMISE!

Anyone who refuses to believe is "predestined" by his own hand to everything in his life including damnation at the end. But you really do believe that God predestines their lives, don't you.

"A rose is a rose by..." How would you describe it that God makes sure that a reprobate doesn't change his mind and believe?

See, maybe that is where you got it wrong. They may -- like me -- understand you just fine. But they don't believe God like I don't believe Calvinism and you take both for lack of understanding.

But know what? The Holy Spirit accompanies the gospel and the word and enlightens the mind to truth. Again, they understand -- they just don't believe or, believing, they just don't obey.

I've ALWAYS said this! We control the decisions -- God controls the outcomes.

skypair

 

You do like to toot your own horn don't you. Arrogance!

 

I wonder how many threads he's going to start or resurrect to propagandize about and idolize the murderer Calvin.

 

This makes for fourth in so many days. We disagree about Calvinism, for lack of a better term, but totally agree about the character of Calvin.

I am not going to participate in any more subjects about the man Calvin. It does nothing but harm my inner self to discuss this man. It is beyond me why in a Baptist forum and authored by a Christian, anyone would post praises to someone who is the pure essence of evil. I am done with this subject. Moving on.

 

Saturneptune one of the reasons I haven't done an indepth study of this subject is because of the division the very mention of him and it causes on this board. How many times threads on other subjects ended up being a fight over this one.

As a tired old layman, keep wondering how much time should be spent devoted to subjects that bring such deep division rather than those that lend to bringing about unity within the membership of HIS Church.

 

When I begin study of a controversial topic, of which I have little knowledge, it begins by looking at BOTH sides of the debate. With time, study, and thought, patterns (for lack of a better term) begin to emerge. One of those, is the ability to begin to recognize half-truths spoken by each side of the debate.

Doesn't your opening comment apply to both sides of this issue? That to state what Arminians do without acknowledging that supporters of Calvin do the very same thing, is indeed a half-truth.

Do you classify anyone who does not hold to Calvin's opinions, on the issues that cause strife, Arminian?

"The flesh is hard to come under the control of the Spirit."

Almighty God has the ability for total control of everything, including the very thoughs we think whether the Holy Spirit is present within us or not. When the Holy Spirit is within us why doesn't He bring our flesh into total control? Could it be free-will?

In closing, by the same token on "controversial things" that does not mean that I need to "study the life and writings of John Calvin for" myself, either. At least not right now. If/when, the Holy Spirit convicts me to take up this challenge, yes, I'll study his life and writings. And, to the extent this aging heart and mind can handle it, I'll also study the lives and writings of those who stood in opposition to him. BOTH sides of the issue.

From past experience, trying to put myself in the position to both defend and oppose an issue reveals much that is often masked with half-truths. Most recent example was creation vs evolution. One piece of information, carefully "hidden" by evolutionists, was the key that decided this issue for me.

2 Tim 2:15 KJB

 

Would have added this to the post about, but edit time has expired.

Non-Christlike remarks: Please note your own in this thread I just finished reading.

John Calvin :Man Of The Millennium
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=85915

Brother, there is nothing in your "testimony" in this thread that leads me to study the life of John Calvin. Your frequent charges of lying and multiple charges of blasphemy against members of the body of Christ, because they disagree with your OPINION, taints your witness, in my opinion.

Please, don't respond by quoting others in that thread. The focus of this post is about your own non-Christlike remarks. Bringing in others words will be the equivalent of the pot calling the kettle black. The focus is on why should I do an indepth study of Calvin's life and writings. What actual incentive, other than posting lists of opinions that agree with you, did you give me to spend hours, days, weeks of study of this man and his viewpoints that have driven a deep wedge into His Church?

If I undertake the study, will you also call me a liar and accuse me of blasphemy? That is if, at the end of my studies, I do not agree that "John Calvin :Man Of The Millennium" -- "Dr. Philip Shaff (not a Calvinst) :"He must be reckoned as one of the greatest and best men God raised up in the history of Christianty." (p.137)."

Think about it, Brother. You sure have given me a lot to think about this morning.

 

There seem to be specific areas that really spark debate, like Calvinism, KJVO, and to some extent, end times and covenant theology. Since being a former Presbyterian, and from reading Scripture, doctrines of sovereignty and grace seem to be quite clear to me. So, one could say that someone like Rippon and I on that specific subject agree.

Why the character of Calvin and Calvinism are linked I do not know. For some reason, Rippon links one who thinks Calvin was truly as described in these threads with being an Arminian, and that is just not true, in any shape, form or fashion. I detest the man, and am very strongly a believer in the sovereignty of God. This mindset causes some of the problem.

Another person who was strongly for doctrines of sovereignty and grace and had no use for Calvin is Old Regular, who I miss greatly for common sense reasoning.

I cannot understand why Rippon is fixated on the character of Calvin and how thinking he was the dictator described makes one an Arminian.

OT, I will say this. After all you have read, I would suggest you google Calvin and read some of his Institutes, and records about his life and reign in Geneva, especially the Servetus case and come to your own conclusions.