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1. Spurgeon was a full 5-point, orthodox, Calvinist.Originally posted by Pastor KevinR:
J.D.
I quote CHS for the simple reason is that he said it. I know he is a Calvinists to an extent, to what extent, I'm simply not sure. I thought it was interesting in light of this debate. I have no ulterior motives. Honestly though, this sermon is printed in The Sword of the LORD, March 24, 2006, but I find the Sword a little too man centered, although you'd prolly disagree w/ me how man centered they are. (in my view the current Editor is too KJVO and hyper separatists.)
You are wrong.Originally posted by James_Newman:
1 John is not about looking to your fruit for assurance of your eternal salvation, 1 John is looking to the reward of the inheritance.
John 14:21-24 He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him." 22 Judas (not Iscariot) said to Him, "Lord, how is it that You will manifest Yourself to us, and not to the world?" 23 Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. 24 "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me.Jesus did not say that whosoever loves Him will have eternal life, He said whosoever believes.
Are you saying that those who just believe are not promised a kingdom and to get that privilege you also have to take the additional step of loving Him?He did promise a kingdom, though, to those that love Him.
James 2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?
I guess that is what you are saying. I disagree then. All those who believe do love Him and will reign with Him.People who are 'called' are not necesarily 'chosen'. Everyone is not called, contrary to what Pastor KevinR stated earlier. Many are called, few are chosen, but not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called. You can't assume just because you are saved by faith that God has ordained you to be crowned and reign with Jesus in Glory.
Every believer will have fruit (good works)2 Peter 1:10-11
10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
You don't work for salvation, you work for the kingdom. Whether you have fruit or not, if you believe, you will be saved.
1 Cor 1:30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God--that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord."Man has a choice, he is not a puppet.
Well, we'll just keep hopingOriginally posted by Helen:
good question. I hope they don't ignore it.
Of merit?!!!! HOw out of touch with reality can a person be that is a calvinist! There is none any further! They Rule! According to calvinist if I am in a hole and someone throws me a rope and I grab it I can give all the thanks to myself. If God who sent His son as a payment, sent His Spirit to convict, gave His word etc on and on and someone accepts that work...it is all of the person who accepts the work. What absurdy! I am sorry I am struggling with this, but this is just stupidity at its highest! There is much that makes sense to me about calvinism lately I admitt. But this type of logic is nothing but ignorance!Originally posted by Rippon:
There is the external call in which many hear the gospel -- but it is not the effectual call where someone is brought to Christ by the drawing of the Father . Many are called , but few are chosen .
Getting back to something I said in the beginning : All of you acknowledge that only the people whose names are written in the Lamb's Book Of Life will be saved . Only those will spend eternity in glory with the Lord . They are the redeemed ones without a question . How can any others be in the special number who you say Christ died for ? In what sense ,( I don't know how else to say it )can those whose destiny is perdition be considered people Christ died for ? He died for them , but yet He didn't die for them ? How do you deal with that ? Christ's death for non-Calvinists sounds more and more like the Roman Catholic treasury of merit . It's there . You just have to avail yourself of it .