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Tell Others That Jesus Died For Them ?

rjprince

Active Member
JD,

Sorry. NOW I SEE WHAT I DID. I WROTE "JD" when I meant to write "JN". My Bad.

That should have been to James Newman as my last post could have indicated... (sorry, needed to edit)
 

J.D.

Active Member
Site Supporter
Originally posted by Pastor KevinR:
J.D.
I quote CHS for the simple reason is that he said it. I know he is a Calvinists to an extent, to what extent, I'm simply not sure. I thought it was interesting in light of this debate. I have no ulterior motives. Honestly though, this sermon is printed in The Sword of the LORD, March 24, 2006, but I find the Sword a little too man centered, although you'd prolly disagree w/ me how man centered they are. (in my view the current Editor is too KJVO and hyper separatists.)
1. Spurgeon was a full 5-point, orthodox, Calvinist.

2. No ulterior motives suspected. You're alright in my book. But you better watch me.


3. If by man-centered, you mean "great men" instead of "great doctrine", I agree. But remember the SOL's heritage is in standing against liberalism and modernism, which they continue to do well IMO, and they feature those historical men that stood in the gap.

4. I'm KJO, so I can't agree with you on that one. I think the sword has a moderate KJO position, but I'm not sure exactly what it is.

5. Hyper-seperation: I think they've made some decisions they didn't want to but had to. I am with them when it comes to their stand against contemporary music and other such modern inovations; but on the other hand, we IFB's are WAY too suspicious of others.
 

Calvibaptist

New Member
Originally posted by James_Newman:
1 John is not about looking to your fruit for assurance of your eternal salvation, 1 John is looking to the reward of the inheritance.
You are wrong.

1 John 5:13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Here, John tells us his purpose for writing is two-fold:
1) that you (who already believe) may know (have assurance) that you have eternal life
2) that you (who already believe) may continue to believe.

It is written for assurance and perseverance. Even most Arminians believe that.


Jesus did not say that whosoever loves Him will have eternal life, He said whosoever believes.
John 14:21-24 He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him." 22 Judas (not Iscariot) said to Him, "Lord, how is it that You will manifest Yourself to us, and not to the world?" 23 Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. 24 "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me.

Jesus equates believing in Him with loving Him. Evidence of loving Him is obedience to Him. Sounds pretty simple to me.

He did promise a kingdom, though, to those that love Him.
James 2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?
Are you saying that those who just believe are not promised a kingdom and to get that privilege you also have to take the additional step of loving Him?

People who are 'called' are not necesarily 'chosen'. Everyone is not called, contrary to what Pastor KevinR stated earlier. Many are called, few are chosen, but not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called. You can't assume just because you are saved by faith that God has ordained you to be crowned and reign with Jesus in Glory.
I guess that is what you are saying. I disagree then. All those who believe do love Him and will reign with Him.

Revelation 3:21 To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

All those who overcome will sit with Jesus on His throne.

1 John 5:4-5 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world -- our faith. 5 Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?

All those who believe overcome.

Therefore, all those who believe will sit with Jesus on His throne.

Nice syllogism...

2 Peter 1:10-11
10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

You don't work for salvation, you work for the kingdom. Whether you have fruit or not, if you believe, you will be saved.
Every believer will have fruit (good works)

Ephesians 2:10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.

Philippians 2:12-13 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.
 

johnp.

New Member
Man has a choice, he is not a puppet.
1 Cor 1:30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God--that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord."

You boast of yourself standingfirmin, it is because of God the Father that I am in Christ.

john.
 

Rippon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
There is the external call in which many hear the gospel -- but it is not the effectual call where someone is brought to Christ by the drawing of the Father . Many are called , but few are chosen .

Getting back to something I said in the beginning : All of you acknowledge that only the people whose names are written in the Lamb's Book Of Life will be saved . Only those will spend eternity in glory with the Lord . They are the redeemed ones without a question . How can any others be in the special number who you say Christ died for ? In what sense ,( I don't know how else to say it )can those whose destiny is perdition be considered people Christ died for ? He died for them , but yet He didn't die for them ? How do you deal with that ? Christ's death for non-Calvinists sounds more and more like the Roman Catholic treasury of merit . It's there . You just have to avail yourself of it .
 

James_Newman

New Member
So you believe that there is more than one 'call' in the bible. How would you prove the difference between the calling in 1 Corinthians 1:26 and the called in Matthew 22:14?
 

Timtoolman

New Member
Originally posted by Rippon:
There is the external call in which many hear the gospel -- but it is not the effectual call where someone is brought to Christ by the drawing of the Father . Many are called , but few are chosen .

Getting back to something I said in the beginning : All of you acknowledge that only the people whose names are written in the Lamb's Book Of Life will be saved . Only those will spend eternity in glory with the Lord . They are the redeemed ones without a question . How can any others be in the special number who you say Christ died for ? In what sense ,( I don't know how else to say it )can those whose destiny is perdition be considered people Christ died for ? He died for them , but yet He didn't die for them ? How do you deal with that ? Christ's death for non-Calvinists sounds more and more like the Roman Catholic treasury of merit . It's there . You just have to avail yourself of it .
Of merit?!!!! HOw out of touch with reality can a person be that is a calvinist! There is none any further! They Rule! According to calvinist if I am in a hole and someone throws me a rope and I grab it I can give all the thanks to myself. If God who sent His son as a payment, sent His Spirit to convict, gave His word etc on and on and someone accepts that work...it is all of the person who accepts the work. What absurdy! I am sorry I am struggling with this, but this is just stupidity at its highest! There is much that makes sense to me about calvinism lately I admitt. But this type of logic is nothing but ignorance!
 

Rippon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The ones called in I Cor.1:26 are under the same classification as those described in Romans 8:28-30 . They are effectually called . The ones invited in Matt.22:14 and Luke 14:24 are not chosen , but rejected .
 

Rippon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Mr. Tool get a grip . You did not like my post . I guess the last few sentences especially got to you . What about what I addressed in the rest of my remarks ?
 

Timtoolman

New Member
Didn't read them, just your last post and the absurdity of it. Not much there too make me go back and read more of what you have to say.
 
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