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did Enoch die ?

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by wopik, Oct 10, 2004.

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  1. Gershom

    Gershom Active Member

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    Me2,

    The question is "Did Enoch Die?" not "did Enoch go to Heaven?"

    I don't know where he went, but the fact of the matter is that Enoch did not die. I don't need to do an internet search to figure that out. Just read the Bible.
     
    #81 Gershom, Oct 15, 2004
  2. blackbird

    blackbird Active Member

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    He went where God took him---where else??
     
    #82 blackbird, Oct 15, 2004
  3. Gershom

    Gershom Active Member

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    Amen. And there is doctrinal teachings that could explain where Enoch went, but that's another topic.
     
    #83 Gershom, Oct 15, 2004
  4. Me2

    Me2 New Member

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    why is it that you guys dont understand that enoch could not receive the indwelling christ spirit.

    he couldnt receive the indwelling spirit, nor could he receive a glorified resurrected spirit body.

    IT DIDNT EXIST.

    Not until Christ was born, died and was resurrected was the indwelling spirit available to be given to mankind. 3000 year after Enochs life.

    the only place for Enoch to go was death, to await Christs very own personal resurrection.

    Joh 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

    there is only one man resurrected.

    to be resurrected into life...
    one must have the "indwelling" spirit "within".

    1Jo 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.

    Enoch didnt have the witness "within" him.
    no OT saint had the spirit indwelling "within" them.
    It simply and plainly wasnt available until christ died FIRST was resurrected and glorified. allowing mankind to receive it after proving its power of righteousness.

    Enochs mortal body was destroyed as all mortal men were.
    Enochs spirit and soul went into death.
    awaiting Christs death and resurrection.
     
    #84 Me2, Oct 16, 2004
  5. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    According to the biblical narrative (Genesis 5:21-24), Enoch lived only 365 years (far less than the other patriarchs in the period before the Flood).

    Neither scripture tells us how or where God took him, only that He did. Did God take Enoch to heaven? Clearly not, because Jesus Himself said that "no one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man ..."

    Further, Hebrews 11 lists many faithful men and women of the Bible (including Enoch) but concludes that "all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise ..." (verse 39). Obviously, then, Enoch neither ascended to heaven nor received
    the promised eternal life.
     
    #85 wopik, Oct 16, 2004
  6. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    Genesis 5:23 makes it clear that Enoch ultimately did die: "So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years." He lived 365 years and no more. He isn't still alive and walking with God. The expression "all the days" is used of eight other people in this same chapter-all of whom obviously died.

    Hebrews 11:5 tells us Enoch was "taken away." The same Greek word refers to the remains of the patriarch Jacob being "carried" from Egypt (where he had died) to Shechem, where he was later buried.
     
    #86 wopik, Oct 16, 2004
  7. tamborine lady

    tamborine lady Active Member

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    [​IMG]

    All the other passages in Gen. 5 end with "and he died".

    The passage about Enoch is different. It says "and he was not for God took him".

    Why is so hard for you to see something that is obviosly there?

    I don't know where he went;where God took him, but he did not die.

    Peace,

    Tam
     
    #87 tamborine lady, Oct 16, 2004
  8. Gershom

    Gershom Active Member

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    They don't listen to sound biblical exegesis, Tam. It all goes back to their false teaching of "soul sleep." They'll do whatever they can to hold onto it.
     
    #88 Gershom, Oct 16, 2004
  9. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    tamborine lady:

    I agree; He was taken away and was not found. But it also says ALL his days were three hundred and sixty-five years- Gen 5:23.
    That's as long as Enoch lived.

    I am of the opinion Enoch died just like anyone else, and perhaps God took such a righteous man away from his evil/corrupt/violent pre-flood environment to save his physical life from harm -- Genesis 6:11-13.
     
    #89 wopik, Oct 16, 2004
  10. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    This just isn't that hard. We read the text - we believe it.


    Enoch: apparently "pleased God" so much that God took him up to heaven. Something
    we do not find among NT saints until the second coming.

    Instead of the formula “so all the days of ABC were nnn years AND HE DIED” we find “So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. 24 Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him.”

    Impossible to miss. “God took him” (“He was Taken UP” Heb 11:5) “So that” he would not see death.

    We find that Moses is on the same footing as Elijah BEFORE the Cross --

    The NT does fully identify that reward that is given to those that please God and
    are taken "UP" by God while still alive (1Thess 4:13-18, 1Cor 15:50-58)


    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #90 BobRyan, Oct 16, 2004
  11. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    I do not believe that Enoch ascended into heaven; I believe he was translated, which is not the same thing.

    good point!

    "....the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more" (was not found) --- Acts 8: 39.


    "But Philip WAS FOUND at Azotus:...." -- Acts 8: 30.

    Sound familiar? "not found" ----- "taken away" (caught away) ----- "God took him"
     
    #91 wopik, Oct 16, 2004
  12. danrusdad

    danrusdad New Member

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    except there is no scripture that says that Enoch was later found as Philip was. The point is irrellevant...
     
    #92 danrusdad, Oct 17, 2004
  13. blackbird

    blackbird Active Member

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    But Enoch is coming again!!!! He'll be part of his prophecy---looking forward to Jesus' Second Coming----"Behold, He cometh with ten thousands of His Saints!!" I wonder what was racing through Enoch's mind when he wrote that???
     
    #93 blackbird, Oct 17, 2004
  14. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    danrusdad

    There is a scripture that says a whole list of people died in the faith.......and Enoch is on that list (Heb. 11:13).

    "ALL the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty-five years" (Gen. 5:23).
     
    #94 wopik, Oct 17, 2004
  15. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    "....the Spirit of the Lord CAUGHT AWAY Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more" (was not found) --- Acts 8: 39.


    the Lord TOOK AWAY Elijah, and Elisha, "saw him no more" --- 2kings 2:12
     
    #95 wopik, Oct 17, 2004
  16. blackbird

    blackbird Active Member

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    The Lord took away Elijah, and Elisha "saw him no more"-----why?? Its because he became part of the Invisible World that Jesus lives in!!

    The people went looking for Enoch---and could not find him---why?? Because he became part of the Invisable world where God's throne is!!
     
    #96 blackbird, Oct 17, 2004
  17. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    good point!

    "....the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more" (was not found) --- Acts 8: 39.


    "But Philip WAS FOUND at Azotus:...." -- Acts 8: 30.

    Sound familiar? "not found" ----- "taken away" (caught away) ----- "God took him"     </font>[/QUOTE]Very true "he WAS NOT for Good took him" is missing for Philip.

    "God Took HIM UP" is missing for Philip.

    "So all the days of Philip were... and Philip was NOT for God took him UP" is missing.

    So also is "God took Philip up SO THAT he should not see death" missing.

    You simply have to "want" to not see the clear meaning in the text to seek to get out of it as those do who try to get Enoch and Elijah "dying in the Old Testament".

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #97 BobRyan, Oct 17, 2004
  18. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    blackbird

    The Bible says the complete OPPOSITE !

    Jesus said, "no man has ascended into heaven except the one who descended from heaven, the Son of Man" --- John 3:13, NRSV.

    I can't find it
     
    #98 wopik, Oct 17, 2004
  19. wopik

    wopik New Member

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    Remember, there is more than one death mentioned in the Bible. There is a first death, and there is a second death (Rev. 20:6).

    Which death did Paul mean?
     
    #99 wopik, Oct 17, 2004
  20. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    I just doesn't get any easier folks!

    We read the text - we believe it.


    Enoch: apparently "pleased God" so much that God took him up to heaven. Something
    we do not find among NT saints until the second coming.

    Instead of the formula “so all the days of ABC were nnn years AND HE DIED” we find “So all the days of Enoch were three hundred and sixty-five years. 24 Enoch walked with God; and he was not, for God took him.”

    Impossible to miss. “God took him” (“He was Taken UP” Heb 11:5) “So that” he would not see death.

    We find that Moses is on the same footing as Elijah BEFORE the Cross --

    The NT does fully identify that reward that is given to those that please God and
    are taken "UP" by God while still alive (1Thess 4:13-18, 1Cor 15:50-58)


    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #100 BobRyan, Oct 18, 2004
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