The Holy Roman Catholic Church...

The Holy
Roman Catholic Church
is it biblically sound or doctrines of demons
by John C. Ferreira

1 Timothy 4:1-3 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

1 John 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world.

God calls us to test the spirit to make sure it's from Him. How we test the spirit is by the words of God which are found in the Scriptures.

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Test all things; hold fast what is good.

2 Timothy 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,

John 17:17 "Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.

Within this limited post we will be testing the spirit of the Roman Catholic Church comparing what it teaches to what the word of God says. In doing this we will be testing the spirit of it to see if it's of God.

God warns us not to follow after the traditions of men. Colossians 2:8 Be careful! Don't let anyone capture you with philosophy or misleading theories that can fool you. These come from the traditions of men and worldly standards, not from Christ!

How does God feel when we call another man "Father" in His place? Matthew 23:9 Don't address anyone here on earth as "Father," for only God in heaven should be addressed like that.

What day did God give as a picture of the Sabbath? Exodus 20:10 The seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates.

Does God like when we make statues or images to be used in worship? Exodus 20:4-5 "You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me.

How does God feel when we repeat prayers? Matthew 6:7 When you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words.

Does God want us to exalt Mary the mother of Jesus? Luke 11:27-28 It happened, as Jesus spoke these things, a certain woman from the crowd raised her voice and said to Him, "Blessed is the womb that bore You, and the breasts which nursed You!'' But Jesus said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.

Was Mary born without sin? Romans 3:9 What should we think? Are Jews better off? Not at all! We have already proved that all Jews and also non-Jews are under sin.

Is God Mary's Savior? Luke 1:46-47 Mary said: "My soul magnifies the Lord, and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior.

Is Mary an eternal virgin? Matthew 1 24-25 When Joseph woke up from sleeping, he did as the angel of the Lord had ordered him to do; he took to be his wife. He did not have sexual relations with her, until she gave birth to the little boy. Joseph named him Jesus.

Did Mary have any other children after Jesus? Mark 6:3 "Is this not Jesus the carpenter, the Son of Mary, and brother of James, Joses, Judas, and Simon? And are not His sisters here with us?"...

Is Mary or anyone else the mediator between God and mankind? 1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

Can bishops or priests be married? 1 Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach.

Was Peter married? Matthew 8:14 When Jesus had come into Peter's house, He saw Peter*s wife's mother lying sick with a fever.

Is Jesus the Christ the Son of God or God the Son? John 20:31 These are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

He is a liar and antichrist who denies that Jesus is the Christ the anointed Son of God. 1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son.

Daniel 7:25 The beast shall speak words against the Most High God, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and shall think to change God's times and the law... READ YOUR BIBLE!!!

[ February 08, 2005, 05:18 AM: Message edited by: jcf ]

 

Which became true in the teachings and practices of many a gnostic sect throughout the centuries.

Amen

But whose interpretation? yours? mine? Marcionites'? Arians'? Sabellians'? Gnostics'? Ebionites'? Apollinarians'? Nestorians'? Or is it the Church's interpretation since the Church is "the ground and pillar of truth". (I Timothy 3:15)

Test the spirit with Scripture as whole using Scripture to interpret Scripture.

Amen, to all of the above.

I'm not Roman Catholic, but many of your arguments to follow are simply fallacious.

These are not my arguments they're God's. He is the one who sets the standard.

But Paul also commands us to follow the apostolic traditions which are from God passed down in the church by the apostles(1 Cor 11:2, 2 Thess 2:15, and 2 Thess 3:6)

Yes, the God ordained apostolic traditions.

So you don't call your own father, "father"? Christ was probably referring to the practice of adherents of rival rabbinical schools of addressing their particular teacher as "father" to the exclusion of others. (Or else we're absolutely forbidden call anyone a "teacher" as well) OTOH, Paul considered himself a "father" in a spiritual sense to the Corinthians (1 Cor. 4:15). That's the sense in which Catholics, Orthodox, and Anglicans refer to their pastors as "father".

If you read it carefully you would see that God says not to call anyone "Father" in His place . Nothing to do with my earthly father.

But the Church has been worshipping on the Lord's Day, Sunday, from the beginning since that is the Day Christ rose from the dead.

You can worship on anyday you want but you can't call anyday the Sabbath.

You mean like the images of the cherubim on the ark of the covenant or of the cherubim, oxen, and lions in the Temple (1 Kings 7:28)? Or is it possible that not all imagery (icons) used in worship is necessarily idolatrous?

No images or statues to be used in worship, in other words, to give them a place deity, power and reverence.

Are you referring to Psalm 136, for example, in which the phrase "for His mercy endures forever" is repeated 26 times? Or is not all repetition necessarily "vain"?

God's mercy does endure forever and needs to shouted from the roof tops. God says no vain repetitions of prayer. If you look up the verses that follow this statement you will find the Lord's prayer. It's like a slap in the face of God and a mockery when it's repeated time and time and time again as seen in the rosary.

Yes. Luke 1:48: "Henceforth all generations will call me blessed". If the Angel Gabriel can declare her blessed among women and highly favored (v.28), why can't we? Why should we not exalt those whom God has exalted? And who else among the daughters of Eve has God so exalted by choosing her to be His mother?

Being blessed of God is one thing but being exalted to a place of worship is another. This woman in the crowd with Jesus was not just stating that Mary was blessed she was doing more than that and Jesus knew it and corrected her.

Without personal sin, "yes". Without ancestral (or original sin), "no". Of course, God (and therefore Christ) is Mary's Savior.

The wages of sin is death. Did Mary die?

The word "until" doesn't prove anything either way about her virginal status subsequent to giving birth to Christ. Just as "'Sit at My right hand till I make Your enemies Your footstool'" (Matt 22:44) does not prove that after Christ's enemies are defeated He will no longer sit at the Father's right hand.

I'm not sure what you're saying but according to God's word, Mary is no longer a virgin and there is nothing wrong or unholy about that.

The earliest tradition is that these children were Joseph's by a previous marriage, as Joseph was an older widower.

WOW! where do you draw the line in resisting the truth?

Christ is the Mediator because of His Person and Work. However, Christians are mediators in a secondary sense. We are a "royal priesthood" and we are to intercede for others with our prayers. Mary and the other glorified saints are also mediators and intercessors in this secondary sense. But you're right--Mary is not the fourth person in the Trinity as some(but not all) modern Catholics are dangerously close to implying.

We are a royal priesthood in a personal sense in that we are able to approach the Holy of Holies through the blood of Jesus Christ.

But he doesn't have to be married. Paul discussed the benefits of celebacy in regards to serving God in 1 Corinthians 7:1-9. This is a matter of practical church discipline. In the Orthodox Church, priests can be married, but bishops are chosen from among the non-married priests because of their added administrative responsibilities.

If they forbid them to marry then it's agaist God's truth.

Yes. He was married. (I'm guessing this was aimed at the papacy)

Just showing the fact that Peter gave the thumbs up to marriage for thoes who say Peter was the first pope of the RCC.

It's both, unless you are by implication advocating a form of the Arian heresy.

Jesus was given the title (God, judge) because of His obedience to His Father's will even unto death.

And which Catholic teaching has denied the Father and the Son?

When you deny that Jesus was a man anointed of God and teach a co-eternal, co-equal godman then you deny the Father and Son relationship.

Yes, read your Bible, but by all means read it in context. This includes the grammatical, historical, and ecclesiastical context.

The bible as a whole speaks and interprets for itself.

Just some food for thought. </font>[/QUOTE]

 

Which became true in the teachings and practices of many a gnostic sect throughout the centuries.

Amen

But whose interpretation? yours? mine? Marcionites'? Arians'? Sabellians'? Gnostics'? Ebionites'? Apollinarians'? Nestorians'? Or is it the Church's interpretation since the Church is "the ground and pillar of truth". (I Timothy 3:15)

Test the spirit with Scripture as whole using Scripture to interpret Scripture.

Amen, to all of the above.

I'm not Roman Catholic, but many of your arguments to follow are simply fallacious.

These are not my arguments they're God's. He is the one who sets the standard.

But Paul also commands us to follow the apostolic traditions which are from God passed down in the church by the apostles(1 Cor 11:2, 2 Thess 2:15, and 2 Thess 3:6)

Yes, the God ordained apostolic traditions.

So you don't call your own father, "father"? Christ was probably referring to the practice of adherents of rival rabbinical schools of addressing their particular teacher as "father" to the exclusion of others. (Or else we're absolutely forbidden call anyone a "teacher" as well) OTOH, Paul considered himself a "father" in a spiritual sense to the Corinthians (1 Cor. 4:15). That's the sense in which Catholics, Orthodox, and Anglicans refer to their pastors as "father".

If you read it carefully you would see that God says not to call anyone "Father" in His place . Nothing to do with my earthly father.

But the Church has been worshipping on the Lord's Day, Sunday, from the beginning since that is the Day Christ rose from the dead.

You can worship on anyday you want but you can't call anyday the Sabbath.

You mean like the images of the cherubim on the ark of the covenant or of the cherubim, oxen, and lions in the Temple (1 Kings 7:28)? Or is it possible that not all imagery (icons) used in worship is necessarily idolatrous?

No images or statues to be used in worship, in other words, to give them a place deity, power and reverence.

Are you referring to Psalm 136, for example, in which the phrase "for His mercy endures forever" is repeated 26 times? Or is not all repetition necessarily "vain"?

God's mercy does endure forever and needs to shouted from the roof tops. God says no vain repetitions of prayer. If you look up the verses that follow this statement you will find the Lord's prayer. It's like a slap in the face of God and a mockery when it's repeated time and time and time again as seen in the rosary.

Yes. Luke 1:48: "Henceforth all generations will call me blessed". If the Angel Gabriel can declare her blessed among women and highly favored (v.28), why can't we? Why should we not exalt those whom God has exalted? And who else among the daughters of Eve has God so exalted by choosing her to be His mother?

Being blessed of God is one thing but being exalted to a place of worship is another. This woman in the crowd with Jesus was not just stating that Mary was blessed she was doing more than that and Jesus knew it and corrected her.

Without personal sin, "yes". Without ancestral (or original sin), "no". Of course, God (and therefore Christ) is Mary's Savior.

The wages of sin is death. Did Mary die?

The word "until" doesn't prove anything either way about her virginal status subsequent to giving birth to Christ. Just as "'Sit at My right hand till I make Your enemies Your footstool'" (Matt 22:44) does not prove that after Christ's enemies are defeated He will no longer sit at the Father's right hand.

I'm not sure what you're saying but according to God's word, Mary is no longer a virgin and there is nothing wrong or unholy about that.

The earliest tradition is that these children were Joseph's by a previous marriage, as Joseph was an older widower.

WOW! where do you draw the line in resisting the truth?

Christ is the Mediator because of His Person and Work. However, Christians are mediators in a secondary sense. We are a "royal priesthood" and we are to intercede for others with our prayers. Mary and the other glorified saints are also mediators and intercessors in this secondary sense. But you're right--Mary is not the fourth person in the Trinity as some(but not all) modern Catholics are dangerously close to implying.

We are a royal priesthood in a personal sense in that we are able to approach the Holy of Holies through the blood of Jesus Christ.

But he doesn't have to be married. Paul discussed the benefits of celebacy in regards to serving God in 1 Corinthians 7:1-9. This is a matter of practical church discipline. In the Orthodox Church, priests can be married, but bishops are chosen from among the non-married priests because of their added administrative responsibilities.

If they forbid them to marry then it's agaist God's truth.

Yes. He was married. (I'm guessing this was aimed at the papacy)

Just showing the fact that Peter gave the thumbs up to marriage for thoes who say Peter was the first pope of the RCC.

It's both, unless you are by implication advocating a form of the Arian heresy.

Jesus was given the title (God, judge) because of His obedience to His Father's will even unto death.

And which Catholic teaching has denied the Father and the Son?

When you deny that Jesus was a man anointed of God and teach a co-eternal, co-equal godman then you deny the Father and Son relationship.

Yes, read your Bible, but by all means read it in context. This includes the grammatical, historical, and ecclesiastical context.

The bible as a whole speaks for itself.

 

Which became true in the teachings and practices of many a gnostic sect throughout the centuries.

Amen

But whose interpretation? yours? mine? Marcionites'? Arians'? Sabellians'? Gnostics'? Ebionites'? Apollinarians'? Nestorians'? Or is it the Church's interpretation since the Church is "the ground and pillar of truth". (I Timothy 3:15)

Test the spirit with Scripture as whole using Scripture to interpret Scripture.

Amen, to all of the above.

I'm not Roman Catholic, but many of your arguments to follow are simply fallacious.

These are not my arguments they're God's. He is the one who sets the standard.

But Paul also commands us to follow the apostolic traditions which are from God passed down in the church by the apostles(1 Cor 11:2, 2 Thess 2:15, and 2 Thess 3:6)

Yes, the God ordained apostolic traditions.

So you don't call your own father, "father"? Christ was probably referring to the practice of adherents of rival rabbinical schools of addressing their particular teacher as "father" to the exclusion of others. (Or else we're absolutely forbidden call anyone a "teacher" as well) OTOH, Paul considered himself a "father" in a spiritual sense to the Corinthians (1 Cor. 4:15). That's the sense in which Catholics, Orthodox, and Anglicans refer to their pastors as "father".

If you read it carefully you would see that God says not to call anyone "Father" in His place . Nothing to do with my earthly father.

But the Church has been worshipping on the Lord's Day, Sunday, from the beginning since that is the Day Christ rose from the dead.

You can worship on anyday you want but you can't call anyday the Sabbath.

You mean like the images of the cherubim on the ark of the covenant or of the cherubim, oxen, and lions in the Temple (1 Kings 7:28)? Or is it possible that not all imagery (icons) used in worship is necessarily idolatrous?

No images or statues to be used in worship, in other words, to give them a place deity, power and reverence.

Are you referring to Psalm 136, for example, in which the phrase "for His mercy endures forever" is repeated 26 times? Or is not all repetition necessarily "vain"?

God's mercy does endure forever and needs to shouted from the roof tops. God says no vain repetitions of prayer. If you look up the verses that follow this statement you will find the Lord's prayer. It's like a slap in the face of God and a mockery when it's repeated time and time and time again as seen in the rosary.

Yes. Luke 1:48: "Henceforth all generations will call me blessed". If the Angel Gabriel can declare her blessed among women and highly favored (v.28), why can't we? Why should we not exalt those whom God has exalted? And who else among the daughters of Eve has God so exalted by choosing her to be His mother?

Being blessed of God is one thing but being exalted to a place of worship is another. This woman in the crowd with Jesus was not just stating that Mary was blessed she was doing more than that and Jesus knew it and corrected her.

Without personal sin, "yes". Without ancestral (or original sin), "no". Of course, God (and therefore Christ) is Mary's Savior.

The wages of sin is death. Did Mary die?

The word "until" doesn't prove anything either way about her virginal status subsequent to giving birth to Christ. Just as "'Sit at My right hand till I make Your enemies Your footstool'" (Matt 22:44) does not prove that after Christ's enemies are defeated He will no longer sit at the Father's right hand.

I'm not sure what you're saying but according to God's word, Mary is no longer a virgin and there is nothing wrong or unholy about that.

The earliest tradition is that these children were Joseph's by a previous marriage, as Joseph was an older widower.

WOW! where do you draw the line in resisting the truth?

Christ is the Mediator because of His Person and Work. However, Christians are mediators in a secondary sense. We are a "royal priesthood" and we are to intercede for others with our prayers. Mary and the other glorified saints are also mediators and intercessors in this secondary sense. But you're right--Mary is not the fourth person in the Trinity as some(but not all) modern Catholics are dangerously close to implying.

We are a royal priesthood in a personal sense in that we are able to approach the Holy of Holies through the blood of Jesus Christ.

But he doesn't have to be married. Paul discussed the benefits of celebacy in regards to serving God in 1 Corinthians 7:1-9. This is a matter of practical church discipline. In the Orthodox Church, priests can be married, but bishops are chosen from among the non-married priests because of their added administrative responsibilities.

If they forbid them to marry then it's agaist God's truth.

Yes. He was married. (I'm guessing this was aimed at the papacy)

Just showing the fact that Peter gave the thumbs up to marriage for thoes who say Peter was the first pope of the RCC.

It's both, unless you are by implication advocating a form of the Arian heresy.

Jesus was given the title (God, judge) because of His obedience to His Father's will even unto death.

And which Catholic teaching has denied the Father and the Son?

When you deny that Jesus was a man anointed of God and teach a co-eternal, co-equal godman then you deny the Father and Son relationship.

Yes, read your Bible, but by all means read it in context. This includes the grammatical, historical, and ecclesiastical context.

The bible as a whole speaks for itself.

 

SORRY FOR MULTIPLE REPLYS, MY COMPUTER WAS GIVING ME TROUBLE...