Christ The Calvinist

As in Adam all die so in Christ (the second Adam) all CAN live. All who are effected by Adams fall can experience God's grace. God uses the simple things to confound the wise...

 

Everyone will be RESURRECTED body, soul, and spirit because Christ died for EVERYONE'S sins. I can't imagine any other way to "get out of hell free" as we see in Rev 20:12-15. Then they are judged according to the "book of works" (good works) and "book of life" (faith in Christ book).

So it's based on God's choice and God's belief in Christ? That's what you are saying. That the Holy Spirit comes into the "elect," That the Holy Spirit believes in Christ and the Spirit's choosing Christ for you is all that matters.

That pretty much leaves your choice and will comlpletely out of it, doesn't it? At some point you can and will believe the Spirit but "choices" and "will" are all His. It's as if, in fact, you were "possessed" by the Holy Spirit and did things you didn't want to do. There's a paradigm for that thought --- it's called "demon possession."

Maybe Calvinists would feel more comfortable with us saying they are "Spirit possessed" rather than "Spirit indwelt?" That would be one way to honestly aver that 1) God is totally sovereign and 2) that we do nothing so 3) He deserves all the glory.

Of course, the other paradigm is that the Spirit speaks to us before salvation and indwells after salvation influencing us into right decisions and choices. But that is not the model Calvinists are looking for, is it.

skypair

 

Tulip

The TULIP is scriptual, but is short of telling what scripture is saying with every word that comes from the mouth of God. There is more to the word of God than the tulip wants men to know The tulip can be supported by scripture and supports itself, but in in of it by itself does not tell the complete story. It leaves so much out.

The only complete work of God is scripture. To me the tulip is a watch tower and men can be looking at scripture through a tulip veil.

 

Here you have me at a disadvantage. I have asked before whether Christ died for ALL the sins of ALL men. In my thinking, if that is true, then ALL will be saved. I have never heard of what you are referring to here.

I did not say this, you are putting words in my mouth. I am trying to understand whether Christ died for ALL the sins of ALL men. If he did, shouldn't all be saved? Since all will not be saved, then how could he have died for all the sins of mankind?

If by choice you are referring to faith, then it certainly is not "out of it." I don't know how it all works. I do believe that we are saved by Grace alone. And that through faith alone. Where does faith come from? Is it my faith? Does God give me the faith, or do I generate it? Whatever happens, I know that my flesh cannot be allowed to boast.

Okay, I don't call myself a Calvinist. I have said in the past I don't know what I am. A Christian yes. But that is not enough. I know people who call themself Christian who teach and believe heresy. Not Calvinism either. I am talking about believing in salvation by works.

I do pray that God would open my mind to learn these doctrines of the gospel of the Grace of God. Thanks for responding.

 

I read the Canons of Dort it was really good until He said something totally against the scripture. It has nothing to do with God inclinning our hearts to believe. He places two roads before us to believe in Jesus and be saved or not and be condemned. God doesn't force any one down a path, we can walk away just like the young rich ruler. It has everything to do with foreknowledge, and the translation is right and God doesn't need any man to retrancelate His word. He is sovreign and His word was translated just the way He wanted it.

I totally agree with calvinism until the Gospel is preached, then as the scripture say's whosoever believes shall be save. Jesus words are Spirit and they are life. His words can breath life unto whosoever, so they can make thier own choice to believe or not to believe. Some will come and some will walk away just like the young rich ruler.

You cannot blame God why they didn't come, because God wants all men to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth.

The elect of God who are the Jews that was cut out for unbelief not because they were not chosen.

We gentiles are included with the believing Jews when we heard the Gospel of our salvation having believed. We are adopted children.

 

So you are aware of 1John 2:2 "...died, not our sins only, but the sins of the whole world." And the problem is, why isn't everyone saved then? Because the lost didn't believe on Christ. It's not just that in death they were turned away from sin -- it's that in life they needed to turn TO Christ.

And truly, that is what conversion is. If you will turn from self and sin you will only be a reformed person. You will have only "turned over a new leaf." But if you turn TO God/Christ, you will be regenerated/born again/saved by Christ. As the parable of the 10 virgins shows, some of the church is waiting for Him and believe He is coming. They had the lamp and the fire and were in the right place at the right time. But the bridegroom never knew them.

Job 32:8 -- "But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding." First there is a "spirit in man." Calvies don't like to separate them but we have a soul (conscience) and a spirit (mind, emotions, and will). Guess what. Conscience is for CONVICTION, John 8:9, 16:8 -- the mind is for inspiration unto understanding. And "understanding" is the truth of the gospel -- the everlasting gospel BTW. "Fear God; give glory to Him... worship Him..." Isn't this the same "gospel" that Paul said came to every man (Rom 1:19) and that, rejecting, men became "vain and their foolish heart was darkened?" (Rom 1:21)

Today, that gospel is focused on Christ, but in the OT it was focused on God (they not at all knowing of God's Son). The main feature is what WE are expected to do with the knowledge God has given us so that HE may save us. Don't go thinking that God gives anyone anything but the testimony of the Word, "the creation of the world" (Rom 1:20) and His own "goodness" (Rom 2:4) in "inspiring" us to choose salvation.

I will join you in that. It is really crucial that you see this and understand that Calvinism tries to say that the OT saints were saved the same way as us when, in fact, they were NEVER yet "regenerated" in the manner Calvinism requires is salvation. Therefore, the pattern of "regeneration precedes faith" is fatally flawed -- or else all the OT saints are lost.

skypair

 

Many Calvinists preach the gospel as if it all depends on man, knowing that it all depends on God.

Some believe God is absolutely sovereign, but sadly He has weak knees and must bow to man's petty wishes.

Foreknowledge is not the cause for salvation, it is a natural absolute nature of a sovereign, eternal God...Obviously He has foreknowledge!

I preach as if it all depends on me, but I know I could not preach effectively without the Holy Spirit..This knowledge does not prevent me from putting all I have into a sermon. I am a Calvinist because I think it is a systematic theology which comes the closest to New Testament teaching. No more and no less.

Cheers,

Jim

I tried reading all 155 posts from the beginning and had to stop around 30. I was getting dizzy from all the roundabout garble.

 

I stated some years ago, before I took a sabbatical, that I thought that use of the term Calvinism initiated so much bias that people would not listen to what was said.

I am not a Calvinist since Calvin held some doctrines that I do not. However, I do believe in the Biblical Doctrines of Grace or the Biblical Doctrine of Election, whatever one might call them. Salvation from beginning to end is entirely the work of the Sovereign Triune God.

 

I agree with this line of thinking. I am not knowledgeable enough yet to know if I agree 100% with Calvinism, but what I know so far rings true with what the Bible teaches.

 

No. Any sermon with a heretical title doesn't fall into the "good stuff" camp.