Shepherd's Chapel, Arnold Murray

I used to watch him on TV sometimes when I was a kid. I remember once he said that those who weren't saved would simply cease to exist after they died. I think I carried that idea around in my brain for quite a while, sure didn't put the fear of God into me.

 

We have a woman in our church who watches Pastor Murray and is teaching our SS class. I find nothing seriously wrong with her doctrine. One of Murray's big doctrines involves the "serpent seed". I know she believes that but lets that open for the students to interpret. In other words, she does not care if you do not believe in that doctrine--- it's not a major thing.

As for the Anglo-Saxons, etc, being the lost tribes, I believe that myself. That is because they fulfilled the promises that God gave to Israel and not the Jews--- it's a long story tracing the prophecies, the history, and archealogy. However, if anyone can find a race other than the Anglo-Saxons that BETTER fulfilled the biblical promises, then I am open-minded enough to listen. But so far, I found that nobody else passed that criteria to date.

It is a historical fact that Jews are mainly from the tribe of Judah, with some from Benjamin and Levi. The rest of the tribes were "lost" to history. Yet, the tribe of Joseph (one of the dominant lost tribes) were the ones that had the birthright promised to become a multitude of nations, great in population size, etc. This was not promised to the Jews. The Jews do not have the birthright.

The problems with mainline biblical interpretation is the theologians do not address this critical doctrine that God's people were to become populous and physical inheritors of the world, from which a chosen (spiritual) group would come to spread the gospel. The bible never said the Israelites would reject the gospel. The Jews, however, did.

I leave the readers of this post with a question--- Besides the Jews, who else is HATED in this world, even though they brought advances to better the world??? The dreaded WASP people. The hatred of them (in the name of diversity) only demonstartes to me who they are. When I studied the lost tribes, race was the furthest thing from my mind. I only wanted to know where they ended up.

 

I agree with you that some have taken to the extremes. I think Satan takes any newly discovered thuth and then twists it out of proportion with fanaticism. Then the baby gets thrown out with the bathwater.

I always taught that the lost tribes, no matter who they were (and I believe its the people of NW Europe, the Brithish Isles and the US) were to include people of all races--- that's the gospel message. And I always quote the scripture in Ezek 17:23 that says about the lost tribes,

In the mountain of the height of Israel will I plant it: and it shall bring forth boughs, and bear fruit, and be a goodly cedar: and under it shall dwell all fowl of every wing; in the shadow of the branches thereof shall they dwell.

Clearly, that includes all people.

I've done debates with others who "prove" by DNA that the Celts/Anglo-Saxons are not the lost tribes. This DNA stuff is the biggest racist and sham evidence I saw so far. No one can tell for sure what one's origin is by "race"--- it has to be done by genealogy. I may have more in common genetically with a different colored person than my so-called Anglo or Germanic ancestors.

Here at the Celtic festival in Bethlehem Pa (which is one of the biggest in the nation if I may add), there are some black Celts that compete in the sports. Doesn't bother me. Black has to do with the amount of pigmentation, just like if one has dark hair or blond hair. It does not need to indicate race. I bet the black Celts can trace their genealogy to the Celts in general. Then there may be some "Irish" people in traditional looks and appearance that may NOT be related at all to the lost tribes. God ultimately knows. I'm just looking at general trends.

I would love if the moderator would have us start this topic. It would be interesting.

 

Yes, I agree. With the straightforward teaching in the Bible (and even apocryphal books), the text comes across to me that any offspring of Eve came from relations with Adam, i.e. ("Adam knew Eve his wife..."). However, I have here a Jewish encyclopedia that tells of the doctrine that Cain was conceived by the serpent (not that I believe that), but it may come as a surprise to many that this is not unique to Murray's teaching, but old Jewish thought.

Murray seems to further the cause with the Kennite doctrine from the lineage of Cain, and does not believe in a world-wide flood (I believe there was a world-wide flood because there was some sort of H2O canopy over the earth that apparently broke, and that would have world-wide implications if the whole atmosphere changed--- that's why after it changed God put his bow in the sky. Before then the atmosphere's chemistry was not right for such a spectral phenomenon.)

However, I have an apocryphal book that sheds light on that supposed enigma as to how Cain's descendents can still be around after the flood. The book makes the claim that Noah's wife was of the lineage of Cain, and therefore God preserved the best of both races (from Cain and Seth) before wiping everyone else out. If you read the Bible carefully, God gave Cain's lineage a chance to repent (something even that woman teacher claims) and if that line was truly from Satan, I do not know how that could possibly be. Therefore, some of Noah's offspring may have decided to trace their lineage via their mother's side and preserve the memory with names reflecting Cain.

 

I watched him a few times. He seemed a little pompous and opinionated. I never realized he was that crazy!