Who may partake...?

Cuz obviously you need a whole big river to pour a cup of water over someone's head with...why in the world would the Bible say that John baptized by the Jordan because there was "MUCH WATER" or in our vernacular "A WHOLE BUNCH OF WATER" if he was just going to pour a little cup of water over people's heads? You've been watching too many cheap NBC movies!

Anyways, I've asked this question before, but it never seems to get answered:

Since baptists don't think that baptism is essential to salvation, why do they make it essential to church membership and communion?

 

The doctrines of men....

 

Hi Ron,

We open up communion to anyone. We say that it is only for believers before the bread and juice are handed out. Knowing for sure is up to God. I believe that goes in any church. I am sure many people have taken communion in my church that were not "saved" people, just because they were embarrased to let the bread and juice go by without taking any. We don't come forward the elements are passed down the rows. Hope that answered the question. Church membership or being baptized are not a consideration. All believers are of the same "body" therefore to deny communion based on earthly church membership seems very unBiblical. Also, just because a person is baptized or joins a church it does not mean they are part of God's family. I am sure many a person has bluffed their way into church membership and baptism.

In Christ,
Brian

 

RIGHT ON!!!!!!!!!

 

CHURCH MEMBERSHIP IS NOT SCRIPTURAL and so they just put this ploy into the bible to get as many names as a member for money reasons....can't get a loan from the bank without revealing how many members there are and what they contribute per month...MANS DOCTRINE...NOT GOD'S

 

Hi Ron, I knew there wasn't going to be any verses because it is wrong

Ron, maybe I am mistaken but the CC will not give communion (knowingly) to an un-baptized person right? A grade schooler has to be a Baptized Catholic to go through the "first communion" event, right?

If true, what verses do you use to support this tradition?

This was not meant to be a "gotcha" because you have always had a degree of Biblical support for your ideas before and I am sure you will this time as well.

Take care, I will continue to pray for you as the Lord brings you to mind.

In Christian Love,
Brian

 

Hi Briguy,

If I might interject a bit,while there is no explicit verse that says an unbaptized person cannot participate, it is implicate in the nature of the sacrement. For just as the many grains of wheat make up the loaf of bread (i.e. are unified in it) so we though many are one.

1 Corinthians 10:17
Since there is one bread, we who are many are ONE BODY; for we all partake of the one bread.

We can only be one if we are one in faith. The sacrement of faith is baptism. By that sacrement we become one.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit we were all baptized into ONE BODY, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.

We must be unified in baptism before we can partake of the sacrement of unity of the Lord's supper. Though I will agree with Ron that we do not need a specific verse, I always find that Catholic teaching and practice have at least implicit reference in scripture.


Hope that helps.

Blessings

 

Briguy,

By the way there is a big problem with partaking in a sacrement of unity with someone who is not a part of the body. Can you tell what it is?

1 Corinthians 6:15-16
Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take away the members of Christ and make them members of a prostitute? May it never be!
Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her? For He says, "THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH."

 

Hi Thess, Thanks for the post and the scriptual support. I understand what you are trying to say. I agree totally that only a person in the "body" may partake. We, however, interpret "body" differently. You believe entrance happens with Baptism, I believe it happens by belief, through faith. I do not believe that the word baptize always means water Baptism. There is symbolic meanings and there are a time or two when immerse just means immerse, like you do with your job somedays.

Thanks again,
In Christ,
Brian

 

Briguy,

Could you find me one believer who did not undergo water baptism right away in the New Testament after the resurrection (Sorry, the theif on the Cross won't work, he was still in the old law times)? I am having trouble finding one. I am asking this question from a purely sola scriptura point of view you understand, thus trying not to mix Catholic and non-catholic theology. It is interesting that the Jailor and his family were even baptized in the middle of the night. What was the rush?

 

Thess. No time now but read below and see that being Baptized was not the most important thing to Paul.

In Christ, Brian

"14] I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
[15] Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
[16] And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
[17] For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
[18] For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

 

Brian,

I'm afraid the scripture you posted does not support the claim that Paul believed baptism is not important. Notice that the people were still baptized, but they weren't baptized by him. It had to do with the whole "I follow Apollos" thing.

 

Hi Briguy,

I find it unlikely that Paul was slighting baptism as you say considering all he had to say about baptism in other places. That should always be taken in to account rather than proof texting. More likely as Tuor pointed out it is in the context of "SHEEEESH you guys we were baptized in to Christ, buried with him we rise with him. It doesn't matter who you were baptized by and I am glad it wasn't me or you would be dividing over me also.". Now back to my question. Do you know of anyone who accepted Christ and was not baptized after the ressurection?

 

Hi Guys, I understand your points and I don't use those verses as a big anti-Baptism thing. However, there is no way around the fact that Paul seperates "the gospel" and "baptism". Also, by seperating the two it shows that preaching the gospel had more importance then Baptism. I believe Paul was saying he is the mechanic and he leaves the car washing to others because fixing the car is the big thing (strange analogy I know).
Also, to me Paul is making a clear point that baptism does not save otherwise he would have had to say that he came to preach the gospel, which is or at least includes Baptism. Hope that made sense.

Nils, how ya doing, man?

In Love and Truth,
Brian