Stupid Gun Control Laws

In Australia, Automatic, Semi Automatic Weapons are banned. Silencers are also banned. Is it neccesary to have Semi Automatic wepons made available to the public?

Owning a Gun to protect yourself from somebody that might have a gun is not consistant with the bibles teaching on turning the other cheek and fearing those that can kill your soul rather than your body.

Constantly on the media reports are comming in from schools in the U.S where a student has taken a gun from home and killed several others at the school. Christians spend alot of time preaching their right to own a gun which is true. Not so much time preaching that it was Gods intention that no one should have a gun. Do you put your faith in your Gun or in your Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ?

"Constantly" is an error of over-generalization. I personally haven't seen a news report of a kid taking a gun to school in at least six months. All I keep seeing is the media re-playing the stories of the kids who brought guns to school over a year ago.

The latest "school shooting" story comes from Germany, my friend, where a man took kids hostage.

Bible teaches not to buy a gun?

Luke 22:36 Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

[ October 19, 2002, 10:09 AM: Message edited by: Don ]

Hi pdp,

I've visited Greenville, SC, and while there I saw guns, lots of guns. I stayed with a friend and in his room where no less than 6 rifles/shotguns. Now, while one weapon may have been understandable for his defense what were the other 5 for?

Part of my problem is that I want to hear gun owners admit that is not simply for noble reasons that weapons are kept. Face it, we guys like big bangs, blowing things up and the feeling of power that such weapons offer. Please, just admit that I will be partially satisfied.

The argument that your government would take over if you did not have guns. Um, if the government really did want to get you, then they would get you. Yes, you could get your peashooters out but they would get their tanks out. It is a flawed argument.

The stats are relevant and helpful. I can understand some of your points. I would not like to see weapons forcibly taken from individuals. I just think it is responsible to have tougher gun laws so that crazy people can't own them and so that individual citizens cannot have stockpiles of weapons that out do some small countries.

Oh, M Wickens, some people here collect guns. Some people here are enamored with gun shows & all the stuff that goes along with it. Some people own guns because they like to hunt. (Not me.) Some people even grow beards during hunting season until they get their first deer. Some people don't even hunt but will grow a beard during deer season just so they can be part of the male bonding thing. Guns are equated with manhood in the USA (in many minds). I'm a woman, so don't understand it. Because plenty of women "pack heat," too. Guns come in handy for shooting snakes and other critters of danger, and for persuading good manners in the two-legged variety of snakes, too (according to some ladies I know). A woman's got to do what a woman's got to do.

Some of the finest guns ever made originated from the USA, Smith & Wesson, Winchester, and others. It's an American thing. It goes with our rowdy & rebellious (Boston Tea Party, etc.) roots. It's just American. And people who want to take 2nd Amendment Rights which our Founding Fathers put into our Constitution are regarded by many of us as anti-American. It is a many layered issue & probably is puzzling to people who live elsewhere.

We are a paranoid bunch sometimes, but for good reason. We've had two Presidents lie to us on TV. We don't believe the Warren Commission & many of us still believe there was a shooter on the grassy knoll. Our government does things they don't tell us about until decades later. Hope this helps explain it just a little bit.

Criminals will always get their hands on guns. And they won't be registered, but smuggled over our borders, or sold out trunks of cars on certain street corners or alleys. The rush to register law abiding citizens does little to curb crime. Just read the other day where Maryland (think it was) already has the gun fingerprinting database but it has been very unfruitful in solving crimes (can't remember where I read it).

American Citizens are guaranteed the right to bear arms. And some of us will fight to the death to keep that Constitutional Right.

"I'll give up my gun when they pry my cold stiff fingers from it."

What is the current tally of teenagers killed in the U.S by a fellow student bringing in a gun to school and going on a shooting rampage? A few hundred?

What are the people of the U.S going to do about it? Being like an Ostrich doesnt help the situation at all. Sometimes you have to make the hard descions. Which mean making people accountable and getting rid of certain weapons. Why is it neccesary to have a semi-automatic weapon in the city areas?

Convincing America to get rid of their guns would be like trying to convince the French to abstain from wine with dinner. It's part of the culture, and it's acceptable. Unfortunately it is quite easy for an outsider to see the negative effects of guns in the US. Especially coming from a country such as Canada, Australia, or the UK where gun control works.

Oh yes, you can point out cases like in Germany or Canada where there were recent shootings. But the average is much lower than that of the US.

I see nothing biblically wrong with owning a gun, but as soon as you shoot it what is your motivation? Guns are made to kill, and even in self-defense I would prefer not to kill anyone. If I die, than it's what God wants.

I can't even begin to understand why God-believing Christians would even want to think about murdering someone such as the sniper in revenge. Wow, I missed that part in the Bible.

#1 - Ben: try a few dozen, not a few hundred.

#2 - Cotton: "Where gun control works"? Please define "works." Do you mean no one has an illegal gun, and there are no gun-related crimes?

#3 - Whoa! Where'd the jump from self-defense and the right to bear arms, to "murder" come from? And that's exactly what sniping and hunting people down is: Murder. Whereas, most of the people on this thread are simply defending their constitutional right to keep and bear arms.

I'm going to make a prediction: They're going to catch the Maryland sniper, and they're going to find out he had an unregistered gun--so required gun registration didn't help them find this murderer. Ballistic fingerprinting has already failed them; either this weapon never had the ballistics test run on it, or its further proof that ballistic fingerprinting doesn't work. And stricter laws, of which we have several hundred, obviously haven't deterred this individual.

With such flagrant disregard for the law and human life, which gun control technique would have stopped this individual?

[ October 20, 2002, 08:44 AM: Message edited by: Don ]

Don,

When I mean works, I mean that there are significantly less gun related incidents. Of course there are going to be illegal guns and murders involving them. Unless we lock down our border with the US and patrol all our coasts, ban hunting, and whatever else, it is going to happen. But with free access to guns as in the US, it is a much more likely scenario.

In Canada, all gun owners must carry a license and attend training. Registration is also coming into effect (amid much outcry). Now I do question the benifits of registration, which this topic is about, but if it stops even one criminal than fine with me.

Here ownership is not a right. Handguns are restricted to police and collectors and that's it.

I realize the situation in the States is much different. Gun control laws would probably take years and years of acceptance and implementation to work.

My murder comment was based upon other comments such as "staking out" and "executing" the sniper. But that really is a different subject so I apologize.

Originally posted by Preach the Word:
When catapults are outlawed, only outlaws will have catapults.

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I want the right to carry a concealed catapult!

Canada needs to take a lesson from the U.S. in this situation: Registration doesn't work!

Knowing my gun is registered is going to keep me from committing a crime? Ain't gonna happen. I'm gonna report my gun stolen, file the serial number off, and see how far registration goes in tracking it down.

I have no problem with registering my gun--because I will never use it to commit a crime. I will use it to hunt, or for self-defense. I have no problem with a 7-day waiting period--because I'm not buying a gun to run out and kill the woman who scorned me last night. I have no problem with ballistic fingerprinting, because unless my gun is stolen, it will never be used to commit a crime.

The only sure-fire way to keep guns out of the hands of criminals is to completely stop making guns. Only keep the ones for military and police, and pull those manufacturers under government contract and control.

Canada needs to take a lesson from the U.S. in this situation: Registration doesn't work!

Knowing my gun is registered is going to keep me from committing a crime? Ain't gonna happen. I'm gonna report my gun stolen, file the serial number off, and see how far registration goes in tracking it down.

I have no problem with registering my gun--because I will never use it to commit a crime. I will use it to hunt, or for self-defense. I have no problem with a 7-day waiting period--because I'm not buying a gun to run out and kill the woman who scorned me last night. I have no problem with ballistic fingerprinting, because unless my gun is stolen, it will never be used to commit a crime.

The only sure-fire way to keep guns out of the hands of criminals is to completely stop making guns. Only keep the ones for military and police, and pull those manufacturers under government contract and control.

Originally posted by M Wickens:
I've visited Greenville, SC, and while there I saw guns, lots of guns. I stayed with a friend and in his room where no less than 6 rifles/shotguns. Now, while one weapon may have been understandable for his defense what were the other 5 for?

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Off the top of my head I would say that your friend may have had some for hunting (you don't shoot a squirral with a shotgun and expect to eat it), one or two for protection (in rural areas it is much more important when you don't always have fast police/sheriff response), one or two for target shooting (a legitimate sport that I enjoy) and perhaps granddad's old rifle that has been in the family for 150 years.

And that's just for one person!

Five or six guns is not unrealistic in a family that hunts. It's hard to share a gun while deer hunting.

Read an article once by a supposed expert on the criminal mind. He stated that the worst thing a thug can hear upon breaking into a home is the ratchet of a shotgun slide.
Jesus commanded us to sell our coat and buy a "sword," if we did not have one. Was He "just kidding" then??

PP

Originally posted by Ben W:
Do you put your faith in your Gun or in your Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ?

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Ben, as Oliver Cromwell once said, "Put your trust in God; but mind to keep your powder dry!"

The only sure-fire way to keep guns out of the hands of criminals is to completely stop making guns. Only keep the ones for military and police, and pull those manufacturers under government contract and control.

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This is exactly what gun registration is for. When the government makes it illegal for private citizens to have guns, they'll know which doors to knock on.

Try this link. It's a story about a premier control advocate who fabricated the "facts" in his book.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20021028-78905499.htm

Nice article, Dan. Thanks.

Do you put your faith in your Gun or in your Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ?

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This question can be asked of any modern dangerous device.
I have two legs that the Lord provided me but I drive my automobile to work.

Do I put my faith in the car or my Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ?

The latter and I thank Him for the car.
BTW there are far more auto deaths than firearm deaths in the USA annually.

I lived in rural Maine for several years.
Many people there earn their sustenance hunting with guns.
Gun deaths are rare in Maine, usually involving "flatlanders".

Maine Joke: A Maine farmer would loose at least one cow to New York (flatlander) hunters every hunting season.
One year he put a sign on each cow: I AM NOT A DEER.
A cow got shot anyway.
He ran out and asked, didn't you see the sigh that said I AM NOT A DEER?

Oh, they answered, we thought it said I AM A DEER.

HankD

I can't believe there was a gun control debate going on for this long and I didn't find it. Most of the pro-gun people have already said what I would have so I'll leave it at that. I will just add that the U.S.A. already has enough gun control laws that they don't/can't enforce. Why add more?

It doesn't matter if you have a gun for protection or not.If you shoot some poor criminal breaking in your house to do you & your family harm you are going to jail any way.The criminal,if he lives will sue you & when you get out of jail he will have already spent all your lifelong savings on drugs.ONLY IN AMERICA