Kerry's hypocrisy

About what?

Nope. Kerry was a "reserve officer." All non-career officers (like ROTC graduates) are "reserve officers." That doesn't mean that they aren't on active duty, or serve in a "reserve unit." Kerry volunteered for Vietnam. Someone's taken advantage of your trust here.

He also got nailed for going AWOL, and was removed from flight status. Slap on the wrist. But then you have to remember, he was "special." He used political influence to jump the line to avoid the draft, then was given a commission without having to go through the usual training, and then was punished very lightly for failing to appear when ordered.

Not that I know.

"The issue is what you did to us when you came home, John."

He told the truth. As you know, the truth is repugnant to Ollie, who lied under oath, and maintains that it's O.K. to lie if it's politically expedient to do so.

That's a lie, too. Kerry only pointed out that atrocities were happening in Vietnam. If you'll check the record, he never said most American troops did them.

Yep, that's the big lie. If you don't believe me, go check the record. Come back and show us where Kerry said that. Never did it.

In fact, the Pentagon eventually agreed with him, and indicted a number of soldiers who did the worst of it, and changed the rules of engagement to eliminate others.

And they also used the Bombing of Hanoi, and a thousand other things. The notion that we should not tell the truth, because our enemies might twist it to use it against us is a morally bankrupt notion.

Well, that explains it. The scene opens as the NVA general staff convenes...

Gen. Giap:"Comrades, I regret to inform you that the war is going badly, and we must surrender to the US. There is no other way."

(gasps and downcast looks all around, until an officer bursts into the room)

"General, wonderful news! An obscure American officer has revealed that there have been atrocities committed by American troops!"

"Well that changes everything," Giap shouts. "the war can continue."

Yeah, that's the ticket. They'll buy that one.

 

This whole discussion is so ridiculous. Here we has Bush, who unfairly only through high level influence got into the guard rather than risk his life in Viet Nam, taking jabs at Kerry, who volunteered for Nam and was decorated. Then Bush didn't even bother to show up for lond periods while in the military (AWOL) and refused to take a physical because he couldn't use his own private physician. Read that one as not wanting to test positive for drugs. Then Bush uses his henchmen to cast doubts on Kerry's military duty and a lawyer for the swift boats crowd is identified as having a high level role in Bush's campaign. Bush then pretends he's taking the high road even though he was behind the dirty tricks all along.

 

1. Did you read/hear President Clinton's comments?
2. Did he or did he not spend time in Vietnam?

Quite an interesting charge, given the fact that the Army seemingly has lost the records.

Are you referring to the same Oliver North who knowingly broke the law by selling arms to Iran (one of the countries in the "axis of evil") and then diverted the profits to the Contras in Nicaragua? Do a Google search on the term "Boland amendment."

I wonder how many people died at the hands of the Iranians that were armed with weapons supplied by this event.

 

Yep. Ol' "aid and comfort to the Iranians" Ollie.

North should just put his head down and shut up when the subject of loyalty and patriotism comes up.

 

You can charge North with some things, but, IMHO, you are clueless if you question his loyalty and patriotism.

 

BTW, if GW Bush is good enough for Ed Koch, he's good enough for me. (And even if that Democrat of 50 years wasn't going to vote for Bush, he'd still be good enough for me )

 

Handing advanced antiaircraft missiles to our enemies (which were later used against American aircraft in the Persian Gulf) does not sound "Patriotic" to me.

It sounds like treason. They hung people for that in the Revolutionary War.

North, BTW, turned on his fellow conspirators when he was caught, and tried to shift the blame on them. So much for loyalty.

 

You didn't do a google search on "Boland Amendment," did you? If I am indeed "clueless" if I question "his loyalty and patriotism," then what can be said about those who question John Kerry?

John Kerry spoke out against a war, and organized a group of veterans against the war. A point worth noting is that he actually served in that war.

Oliver North KNOWINGLY violated the law:
1. He sold arms to a sworn enemy of the United States
2. He diverted the profits from these arms sales to the Contras, thus violating the Boland Amendment.

The key word here is KNOWINGLY - in other words, he KNEW that he was selling weapons to an enemy, and he KNEW that diverting the profits to the Contras was against the law.

As I am "clueless," please explain how these acts are a testament to his "loyalty and patriotism."

Duly noted, as of August, 2004, Eutychus has become an ally of Ed Koch.

 

You are not telling the truth. Bush has not taken jabs at Kerry. He has consistently and repeatedly said that Kerry served honorably. Others have taken jabs at Kerry, and rightfully so. Bush has not. YOu have absolutely no evidence that Bush was behind these attacks.

 

Other than the fact that a consulting firm used by his campaign set the scam up, Bush's largest contributor is also the main contributor to the Swifties for Smear, and Bush had two of his campaign workers working with the Swifties.

Other than that, no evidence.

 

Kerry's biggest hypocracy is the same as Bush's.

They are both elitists that work for the money marketeers on wall Street and claim they love America...well of course they do, we have the biggest pie in the world for them to slice up and hand out to there buddies in the family business that run the southern and middle eastern plantations.

And the plantation is growing all the time.

 

John Kerry served in Vietnam. Regardless of what the SVFT says about his service/awards, he was actually there. Were his opponents there?

Jane Fonda did more than just protest the war, she went to visit North Vietnam.

One went to serve his country, the other went to work against her country. There is a HUGE difference between the two.

Shame on you. You may not like Kerry, and that is your right. But don't make such horrible comparisons.

 

I don't understand. Are you claiming that someone in the National Guard can simply not show up for months at a time without repercussians? I don't believe that.

 

If there had been less men like him, soldiers would not have come home to the hatred and disgust of their fellow Americans. Kerry lied about his fellow soldiers. Kerry admitted war crimes.

Bush is certainly different than Kerry, and for that we can be glad. Kerry has no business being president. </font>[/QUOTE]So you're claiming that Kerry lied when he said that atrocities were committed by American soldiers in Viet Nam? That's an extremely naive and uninformed statement. How do you support that statement?

 

You are not telling the truth. Bush has not taken jabs at Kerry. He has consistently and repeatedly said that Kerry served honorably. Others have taken jabs at Kerry, and rightfully so. Bush has not. YOu have absolutely no evidence that Bush was behind these attacks. </font>[/QUOTE]Bush was behind these attacks. He simply used surrogates to do his dirty work.


Bush adviser quits after appearing in swift boat ad
Kerry has accused group of illegally working with campaign
http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/08/21/edwards.swiftboat/

Monday, August 23, 2004 Posted: 10:49 AM EDT (1449 GMT)

ROANOKE, Virginia (CNN) -- A volunteer adviser has quit President Bush's re-election campaign after appearing in a veterans group's television commercial blasting Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry's involvement in the Vietnam-era antiwar movement.

A Bush campaign statement said it did not know that retired Air Force Col. Ken Cordier had appeared in an ad by Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. The Kerry campaign has accused the group of illegally working with the Bush campaign.

As a so-called 527 group, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth is barred from coordinating efforts with an election campaign.

Kerry's camp calls it a front for the Bush campaign and has urged the Federal Election Commission to cite the group, the Bush campaign and the Republican National Committee for violating federal election laws.

 

They can ask all they want, but the FEC will press no charges, becase it would be futile to try and prove it.

If I were you, (a Bush-hater) I'd save my appetite, for these sour grapes the Kerry campaign is puckering over will be in abundance come November. 'nuff to feed every libby in the U.S. of A.

John Kerry is a hypocrite. Can dish it out, but can't take it, and all of America now knows it. Thank God he won't be elected.

FOUR MORE YEARS!!!!!!!

God bless the Swift Boat Vets, true American Patriots.

 

Sidebar: I served 7 years in the US Army Reserve. Unless Bush was under some sort of special orders, there is no such animal as being "AWOL" from weekend drill.

They are more lenient than the regular AF, but AWOL is definitely a crime in the Texas Air National Guard. This is from the Texas Code of Military Justice, under which authority Bush was placed:

"§ 432.131. ABSENCE WITHOUT LEAVE. A person subject to this chapter shall be punished as a court-martial directs if the person without authority:

(1) fails to go to his appointed place of duty at the time prescribed;

(2) goes from that place

(3) absents himself or remains absent from his unit, organization, or place of duty at which he is required to be at the time prescribed."

Failing to show for a physical, and being absent from his station for a year are both AWOL under this code.

 

So it is illegal to give to two different groups? What part of the law is that? That is a scam on your part to try to make that fly.

Where is the evidence for your assertion about two campaign workers? One was a lawyer who broke no laws whatsoever. There was a volunteer on teh Bush campaign veterans steering committee whom the Bush campaign reportedly did not know was working with the Swift Boat group. He left when it was found out. What we see is that the campaign immediately discharged the person responsible in a show of integrity and commitment to the law. Too bad others aren't like that.

 

I don't support it since that is not what I said. Kerry made broad brush accusations that were not true. There were atrocities committed, but nowhere near the extent that Kerry would have had people believe. Furthermore, it was simply wrong for him to come back and say those things with our soldiers still in captivity over there. He made the lives of people like John McCain worse for those kinds of unwise comments. This is a man who didn't know when to keep his mouth shut.

Empty accusations with no proof. Your own cited article said the campaign didn't know about this volunteer. As soon as they found out, he was gone. These charges simply will not stick right now. People are going to have to come up with evidence for it.