President Bush

Well, howdy, BillGray! Where do you think you are? You started a new thread & it's unlocked! Don't know where you thought you were posting, but welcome to the Board.

 

Well, in that case, can I be your 2nd favorite? Welcome to the board! If you haven't learned all of the ins and outs yet you soon will. It doesn't take too long to figure it out.

By the way, to answer your post, I don't like it when some people think they can read other peoples' hearts. How do these who say Bush is a fake know that he is not sincere in what he says?

I would hate for someone to call me a fake when I'm calling to my Lord.

God Bless. Bro. James

 

James,

Since I am a regular critic of Bush I assume that you refer to me. Anyway, I'll step up to the plate to try to answer your question.

If someone says one thing but does the opposite, repeatedly, how can you conclude anything other than insincerity?

If Bush claims to be a Christian conservative pro-lifer, I expect him to do certain things. Chief among them would be:

1) Use the "bully pulpit" of the presidency to lend support and momentum to the pro-life cause. 3500 babies die each day while he is largely silent.

2) Seek and implement means of stopping abortion legally. There are things that can be done, perhaps a subject for another thread. But, no action here, either.

3) Propose massive cuts in the federal government, which has grown to massive proportions. Instead he is increasing the scope and expense of gov't much faster than Clinton did.

4) Get the federal gov't out of education. He has done the opposite.

5) Appoint exemplary people to key positions. Bush has earned high marks from the "log cabin" Republicans for his work in appointing a large number of homosexual activists to key positions.

So, you see, it's not so much a matter of "judging the heart". It's a very simple matter of comparing a person's actions with their claims.

 

Too many today are ready to accept, and laud someone who names the name of Christ regardless of their actions. Some say we can't judge whethter a person is saved or not. The Bible teaches otherwise but I'll not start that debate, only post the below verses that show the Apostles didn't hesitate to bring up short those who were in error, and the results, which in this case produced repentance.

Acts 8:
13Then Simon himself believed also: and when he was baptized, he continued with Philip, and wondered, beholding the miracles and signs which were done.
14Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John: 15Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost: 16(For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.) 17Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost. 18And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money, 19Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost. 20But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money. 21Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God. 22Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee. 23For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity. 24Then answered Simon, and said, Pray ye to the Lord for me, that none of these things which ye have spoken come upon me.

Remeber too, that the new apostle, Paul, questioned veteran, Peter, about his teaching!

Just because someone uses words of faith is no indication they believe those words, it is only those who live thse words and walk with the Lord have a heart felt belief.

 

How much of the President do we see and hear. Usually whatever the media gives us. I have never seen the media emphasize anything religious, so maybe we just see the tip of President Bush's religious stands. For him to be portrayed as a religious man by the secular media is seeing only a portion of what really goes on in that man's heart. IMHO

 

My point in refusing to judge Mr Bush is exactly that. I do not know him personnally. I can look at what the media reports and say I don't understand this action or that action, but I certainly don't know his heart.

 

Wether we agree with President Bush or not, Paul instructs Timothy to pray for "...all that are in authority...". (1Tim 2:2)
Also you must remember the persicution Paul was under by the government when he wrote these words.
It is our duty to pray for our country's leaders, and especially for President Bush, that he will follow God's will for America.
We know one thing... that Sadam is an enemie of the Lord Jesus Christ. So be careful of whose side you take on this issue.
Woe unto them that all evil good, and good evil: that put darkness for light, and light for darkness....Is.5:20

 

You don't have to know his heart to judge his actions.

How can you enter the voting booth if you think that you can't judge a politician's actions unless you know his heart?

 

The condition of the heart will be revealed by the actions of the body.

 

I can judge the man's actions, based upon the evidense presented. I do not trust the media to present a complete picture of the man or his charactor. If I did I would have to judge many of our religous leaders as crackpots and heretics and hatemongers. I am young (well comparatively at 37) and have found that the media is not to be trusted. I have seen how they twist facts to show whatever they want. Folks have been jailed wrongly because of the biased reporting of today.

I have not said he is or is not a Christian. Just that I really can't say whether he is or is not a Christian, so I will let our Lord and Savior decide.

 

jbarner,

I don't trust the media either. But, we have to be discerning, and get at the truth.

And, of course, I'd bet that you DO trust the media enough to make tha kind of judgements that I am speaking of.

Do you believe that there was a terrorist attack on 9/11/01? Of course you do, because you believed what the media told you.

Do you think that Bush has proposed massive increases in federal spending? I do, because, although I think that the media is really tricky, I think that the numbers published are factual.

Funny thing, how so many don't believe bad things about Republicans but believed all the bad stuff about Clinton.

 

the discussion was about George Bushes personal relationship with Christ. Not about whether we agree with his policies. It is not republican vs Democrat. I refuse to even say that Clinton is not a Christian. I will say some of his behavior is not a good example. I will say that I disagree with some of Bushes policy, but, there are Christians whom I am sure are the Lord's who I disagree with.

 

Just a reminder to all, Pres Bush has publicly stated that he has accepted Christ as his savior. So his salvation is not an issue.

 

j barner..I finley find someone that I agree
with....& it's you! I don't agree with Bush on
something's either..& no I would not want to
judge Bill C. Either because He stood before
the world asking for the people's forgiveness
for what He had done...So whome are We to say
No..you are not worthy..& for stateing you are
a Saved person does not make it so...But action
speak louder then word's...I will not be His
judge either...The good Lord above Will..

WILLOW 2

 

Boy I like what I'm hearing here!! Not everone
is for MR.Bush..I new I was not the only one
out here..Believeing He need's to prove himself.
Everone was so qick to down Bill C.But they
better wait & see what MR.Bush does first.I
never judged Bush..I only stated in a nother
post that I believe He's in to serten thing's
for all the wrong reason's..Now day's you can-
not take a person's word for anything...

I know I will wait & see..Bush need's to prove
himself to be of God..or not & he will sooner or later..Action's alway's speak for themself's..
I'm I write or wrong..

WILLOW 2

 

Pensylvania Jim. Thanks, brother, for standing upon your convictions. I do understand what you are saying. I am just speaking from experience in how false( incorrect, incomplete???) third party judgement can harm someone. I once was not as strong a Christian as I am now. I was pretty lukewarm. My wife and I were treated poorly by a church because of rumors that were (when we found out about them) easily refuted and proven to be inaccurate depictions of circumstances. Since then I have been very careful to be observant and reasonably sure before I pass judgement. I see that Bush does some things that I do disagree with, but I am not ready to brand him a hippocrite.