Violation

You said-
Probably because you cannot accept more than what is in the bible.

Amen! That is right. Do we need more than what the bible says? That is a herecy! I pray even you arminian brothers see that. You never need more that what is in scripture.

Tou said-
Your response indicates that you too are unaware or that you refuse to accept the totality of man.

I see it as the depravity of man, but I am just looking at scripture. I guess that makes me close minded since I don't look outside of that.

You said-
God has burdened man to choose in order to have Salvation.

You still have yet to prove this with scripture.

You said-
As demonstrated by Jonah, one of God's chosen prophets,

You just cleared up the difference from those who can do good and those who can't. God's Chosen People.

You said-
Jonah exercised his free will and chose to flee from going to Nineveh.

If Jonahs will is truly free he would have never made it to Nineveh. But God took him there by way of a fish.

You said-
He could have saved himself much grief by simply obeying God. Where did Johah's act come from if man has no free will?

Jonah was a prophet of God, that means a child of God, Children of God can obey and they can disobey. Children of the devil can only disobey.

You said-
God made Jonah flee him so that God could demonstrate for his Glory that God has control over the affairs of man....Right!

Yes, Jonah tried to run but could not.

You said-
If you refuse to believe that there is more than the scriptures, there is no truth that I post that you will believe.

AMEN!!!

 

Are you saying that the children of God have the "right" and the "ability", thus the free will to obey God sometimes and Satan other times? Disobedience of God is obedience of Satan is it not?

Well right here you contradict yourself big time, those who are not the children of God do not have free will and cannot obey sometimes and disobey other times. It is only through free will that man can do both. You do both don't you? Therefore you are free to choose to do what you will. If you are free to do what you will, then you are free to believe what you will believe. Your dogmatic reliance on the teachings of Calvin are an indication that you are free to choose to believe what you will. Will you be so bold as to deny that you have free will?


By the way, you missquoted me regarding what was said about Jonah!

 

Yelsew you are completely wrong. And up until now I thought it was because you were misinformed... turns out you are just a fool. I say that in complete love. You really cannot listen to anything without completely screwing it up. I will pray for that, and I am not being sarcastic, I really will.

The only "free will" is Gods will. That is all there is to it. Find in the bible, and I know you say you have to look elsewhere, but for now let us deal with scripture since we cannot decide on how you get the rest of truth. But you will find that it is not there. You slap it in there to prove a point, and a point that you still can't prove.

God has free will... Man has a will that gives him freedom inside his nature. That is all you will find in scripture.

I will pray that God opens your eyes to see the truth.

With much brotherly love and compassion,
sturgman

 

That is sooo funny... I think I just wet myself!

 

If human beings did not have a 'free will' and if their wills would be bound in the sense that Luther taught, God would not have needed to write Exodus 20:3-17. Not all of the Israelites were saved but they had an in tact reason and conscience that the Lord could speak to in their minds. They were not so dead and in traspasses and sins that they could not try to live up to the Ten Commandments. Even the unsaved in our generation attempt to follow God's moral code of, for example, not committing adultery, though in a lost condition. Don't get me wrong, they will never be saved by merely trying to follow His commandments. That takes receiving Christ.

 

Where do you see an agrument? I see none.

 

Yelsew, I think he is pointing out where you said two things that contradict. I think he is asking you to let him know when you finally choose one and not waiver in your theology.

I am pretty sure that is what he is asking, but you might want to check with him.

 

Calling a Christian brother a fool and at the same time saying you have Christian love for him is an oxymoron. The Bible verse for the day is Matthew 5:22 or perhaps less frightening, I Corinthians 13:4b.

Respectfully,
Ray

 

No, actually, many times the bible calls men who lack understanding a fool. I don't see that as a problem. If I left it at that maybe, but that I show true compassion and lift him up out od concern for him means that I mean no harm towards him. Thanks for your imput though.

 

By the way Ray, I called him a fool (not for the sake of name calling, but because he lacks understanding and this is the way scripture uses it) because he said that I was wrong because the only place I look for truth is the bible. Does that sound like a statement from a man who lacks understanding? I think it does. So if anyone is offended that I actually used the word "fool" I am sorry, I mean that Yelsew lacks understanding. It is not that he is misinformed, it is that he lacks understanding even with all the scripture presented to him, he says I am wrong because I don't look outside the scripture for truth. Again, I am sorry if it was offencive. I truly have compassion for him and I am praying that God would open his eyes.

 

How wise does that make you when you say that I am a fool "in complete love" Don't the scriptures say to shun the fool? So now who's the fool? But that's enough of that. Jesus was also thought of as a fool, likewise the Apostles and prophets, so you do put me in good company!

 

There are plenty of things that we as Baptist believe that are not found in the Scriptures, at least in the New Testament, and yet, we believe them because they can be understood by a broad understanding of the message of the Word as well as an understanding of reality. Have a good conversation with someone from the Church of Christ, and you'll understand.

 

Like what? Age of accountability? I don't see it in scripture, so I do not believe it. What else? I think you lump me in with other baptist, and I am not like other baptist. Nor are most of the calvinist in this board.

Second, how can you believe something that is not anywhere in scripture, but only from where man tries to forse it into scripture?

 

1. Using music in NT worship, for one.
2. Having woman teach children's Sunday School classes.
3. The use of electricity.
4. The use of personal computers.

And on, and on, and on.

 

Scott, there is a differnce between practices not found in the NT and doctrines not found in the Bible.

 

When it all comes down to it, is there really? What proof do you have of this?

 

When it all comes down to it, is there really? What proof do you have of this? </font>[/QUOTE]Luke, giuded by the Holy Spirit, thought so. Acts 1:1. There is a difference between practice and theory, and the fact that there are points of contact cannot be used to deny that they are not the same thing.