Day of Atonement

Wopik,

For what it's worth to you, here's some of my reasoning on the verses you've cited:

"Circumsicion is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the Commandments of God (1 Corinthians 7:19)."

It seems that Paul is implying here that obedience to God is what matters--not whether one is circumcised or not. If he was upholding O.T. Law here, how could he say that circumcision is nothing? That constituted a primary area of obedience under the old covenant, but not under the new. God had no concern about that matter in the church, it had become merely a human matter (v. 17, 23).


"We know that we know him if we keep his commandments (1 John 2:2-4)."

I believe John has Christ's commandments in mind here. Love is the theme of the book. Our relationship to God through Christ is stressed throughout. See 1 John 4:15 & 21.


"Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus (Rev.14:12; 12:14)."

Again, I would cite John's clarification in 1 John and apply this to Christ's great commandments. There is nothing specifically pointing to the ten commandments here.


The ten commandments were specifically given to Israel (Ex. 20:2). The Law was (note past tense in Gal. 3:24) the Jews' schoolmaster until Christ came. Through His death and resurrection, Christ brought the Law to its' completion--fulfilling it's purpose, that believers might be united to Him (Rom. 7:4) instead of bound to the Law.

"For what the Law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."(Rom. 8:3,4)


Does that clarify my position?

In Christ,

Tim

 

Day of Atonement is the Jewish holiday of YOM KIPPUR;( is known as the Day of Atonement)

Not to change the subject, but I think that the Jewish holidays seem to have prophectic overtones.

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The Jewish people have Feast Holidays that they keep from the scriptures. If we look closely at these feast, we can see that they seem to have prophetic meaning to them.

If we study these feast and Holidays, we can see that Jesus death, burial and resurrection happened on the spring Jewish holidays.
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His first Coming
PASSOVER; (March or April) Is the remembering of the deliverance from Egyptian bondage. An unblemished firstborn male lamb was sacrificed and its blood poured on the alter.
FULFILLED; Jesus was sacrificed on Passover. Jesus; firstborn, unblemished, Lamb of God.
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THE FEAST OF UNLEAVENED BREAD; (held during Passover). Leaven symbolizes sin. Unleavened bread speaks of sanctification. God told the Jews to cleanse all leaven from their homes for seven days, symbolizing a holy walk with Him.
FULFILLED; Jesus is the “Bread of Life” without sin. Born in Bethlehem. The Hebrew word Bethlehem means house of bread. This Unleavened Jewish feast fell on the day Jesus was buried.
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FEAST OF THE FIRSTFRUITS; (Day of Firstfruits) Always on the Sunday after Passover. The priest would present the first of the harvest unto the Lord.
FULFILLED; Jesus resurrection marked the beginning of the harvest of souls. He was the Firstfruits. He resurrected on this Jewish Holiday (HolyDay).
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SHAVOUT; (May – June)(also known as feast of weeks and Pentecost) The holiday of Shavuot starts 50 days after the Feast of the Firstfruits. This was the day of the giving of the Torah to Moses on Sinai. Also to reminder that the Jews were slaves to Egypt.
FULFILLED; 50 days after Jesus Resurrected, a group of Messianic Jews receive the Holy Spirit. Jesus said; Unless I go the Holy Spirit will not come. The Holy Spirit came on this Jewish holiday called the Feast of weeks (Shavuot), 50 days after the Resurrection (Pentecost)
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If Jesus death and resurrection happened on the spring Jewish festivals (first harvest of the spring) then perhaps his 2nd coming will happen during the autumn Jewish festivals written in Levitcus and other places in the bible. The fall feast do seem to have prophetic meaning to them.
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FALL HARVEST FEAST

ROSH HASHANAH; /Feast of Trumpets (Sept. or Oct.) Jewish New Year begins on this high Holy Day. It is a celebration of the spiritual birthday of the world or creation. It is the blowing of the trumpets and coronation of the King.

SIGNIFICANCE; The blowing of the trumpets is found in book of Revelation. There are to be 7 of them.
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YOM KIPPUR; is known as the Day of Atonement. (Sept or Oct) It following Rosh Hashanah Yom Kippur is one of the Holiest days in the Jewish year it is spent fasting, prayer and confession. This is the one gracious day a year given by God that each individual could receive forgiveness. This is the last day of the year for repentance. This was the one day that the High Priest was allowed to enter into the Most Holy place in the Temple, sprinkle blood on the ark of the covenant, and atone for the sin of Israel. This is the day that God writes in the books of who is forgiven and who is not forgiven for the year. (Also known as The Judgments of Nations.)

SIGNIFICANCE; Last day to repent. The Judgment of the Nations. The books are open. It happens after the trumpets. (of Rosh Hashanah)

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SUKKOTH; (following Yom Kippur) The feast of Tabernacles is a composite of several holidays. The holiday celebrates the ancient fruit harvest in the Holy Land.

SIGNIFICANCE; The celebration of the autumn harvest. If Jesus was the Spring harvest, Then could the Church be the autumn harvest? This is the fall fruit harvest and is the Feast of Tabernacles (Heb. 9:11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle,)

There are many scriptures that suggest that Jesus second coming will be in the autumn months. “Harvest” is always in the autumn months. “Summer is nigh” “First fruits” the latter harvest always came in the autumn.
The autumn festivals all celebrate the fall harvest and are their holiest days. God placed these Feasts in Leviticus (chapter 23 and 25). Also in Col. 2:16-17 “Let no man therefore judge you in meat or in drink or in respect of an holyday or of the new moon or of the sabbath days; which are a shadow of things to come; but the body of Christ.”

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CHANUKAH; The festivals of lights. Is the victory of religious freedom. Some claim that this is when the Temple was to be rededicated.

SIGNIFICANCE; Jesus is the festival of lights coming in his bright glory. The Temple will be rededicated to Jesus.

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Please note that there is 75 days between Yom Kippur and Chanukah.
Dan 9:27 & 12:11, Rev 11:2, 12:6, 13:5 all speak of a 3 ½ period, 42 months or 1260 days.
Dan 12:11 speaks of a 1290 days and says “Blessed is he that comes to the 1335 day. Here we see a 75 day gap from the 1260 days. There is an exactly 75 days between the Jewish holiday of Yom Kippur (day of atonement) and Chanukah (the festival of lights)
Is it a coincidence that it is exactly 75 days between these holidays?
The Holiday between Yom Kippur and Chanukah is Sukkoth which is the Feast of the Tabernacles. Could this be the Wedding Supper?

When Jesus was crucified it happened on the Jewish Holiday of Passover. Then He was buried on the next holiday of the Feast of Unleavened Bread and rose on Feast of the firstfruits. Then the Holy Spirit came 50 days latter on the Jewish holiday of Shavuot. These holidays are in the spring and at the time of the first fruit harvest. Jesus is the firstfruit.

A fact about the fig tree; The fig tree yields fruit twice a year. It yields fruit once in the early spring and again in autumn.

The autumn festivals are during the time of the latter fruit of the fig tree. Did God put these Feasts in the Bible so we could understand the significance of the Jewish Holidays?


Jesus death, burial and resurrection happened on the spring Jewish holidays.
So the question is; Are the Jewish holidays God’s calendar?

[ November 02, 2003, 10:14 AM: Message edited by: In God We Trust ]

 

Quoting Wopik," To my understanding, circumcision was not done away with; it is still practiced today among many races of people. Paul and the Church just said it was useless for salvation. Gentiles did not have to go through it. I believe Paul even circumcised Timothy after the decisions in Acts 15. "


Paul circumcised Timothy in Acts to keep from offending the Jews. But in Galatians, Paul's statement that circumcision is nothing, coupled with his statement elsewhere condeming those who compelled circumision shows that those O.T. requirements no longer applied. Hence at least some (or all)of the Mosaic Law had been fulfilled--the Jews no longer bound to it.


Quoting Wopik, "...But unlike you, I don't think this took away our resposiblity, our duty, to try to live a righteous life."


I would never say we have no requirement to live a righteous life, rather I would say we have a higher standard of righteousness than the O.T. (including the 10 commandments) had to offer. See Mat. 5-7, Christ says, "But I say to you ..." His word was better than that given to Moses.

In Christ,

Tim

 

That quote shows Paul drawing principles from the Law, but doesn't bind us to the literal command. In fact, Paul insinuates that the actual law was less important than the lessons we should apply from it.

Tim

 

Wopik,

IMHO, you've got it exactly upside-down. Loving God and loving your neighbor is far more all-encompassing than the ten commandments, rather than a summary. Of course you won't kill someone if you love them, etc..

Christ's primary point in the Sermon on the Mount is that the ten commandments are not enough--Christ's commandments reach beyond outward actions right to the heart.

As far as the O.T. prophecies go, I believe they are typologically fulfilled--though expressed in O.T. terms. As "InGodWeTrust"s post indicated--these feasts are all typological in nature--pointing to fulfillment in Christ.

As 1 Cor. 5:7,8 illustrates--we "keep the feast" by proper spiritual attitudes and a corresponding manner of life, not by physical observances.

Tim

 

jews for jesus say it this way ...for belivers in jesus are forgiven by His sacrifice one atonement for all time.
Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many.


for the rest of Israel will repent and look to her Messiah one day
Zechariah 12;10,13:1
and I will pour on the house of david and on the inhabitants of jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication then they will look on me whom they pierced yes they will morn for him.....in that day a foutain shall be opened for the house of david and...jerusalm for sin and for uncleanness

 

also on the Law this is how i understand it we humans cant keep the law the law was to show us we are sinners . sin is disobeying gods laws right . when we disobey God our sin seperates us from him. and God said sin = death back in geneis. death is seperation from God forever in hell .so we need a savior to save us so the law was given to Show us what sin is and to show us we need a saviour . if you break one law you break them all. . We needed a savoir to save us because no one is rightous no not one. the bible says this all have sinned and came short of the glory of God. we were born sinners so we needed to know what sin is thats why the Law was giving to isreal . Isreal was the only ones who knew God at that time. Gentiles didnt know God the were worshiping like you said mercry and diana ect.is this right and us gentiles can learn from this too to know Jesus is the savior of the world and the law shows us gentiles to we are sinners in need of a savoiur. Jesus is the savior and if we belive he died for us took our punishment that we desrvered and was raised on the 3rd day. we to are saved wehather we are jewish or gentile.

For God soloved the world he gave his only son that if we belive in him we should not perish but have everlasting life. Truly this is Good news huh? no wonder they call the gospel Good news of Jesus Christ!!

[ November 08, 2003, 09:49 PM: Message edited by: dawna ]

 

Wopik,

First let me correct your misquotation of Christ--maybe you mixed two passages. Regarding HIS WORDS, Christ said, "Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away."(Mat. 24:35 & parallel passages). Regarding the Law, Christ said, "Till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, TILL ALL BE FULFILLED."(Mat. 5:18).

The whole point is they were not merely ignored, they were fulfilled in Christ. In that way He magnified the Law--by bringing it to it's completion, fulfilling it's demands in His very death. And thus He cancelled it (Col. 2:14) by His payment in full.

In Christ,

Tim

 

It doesn't.
But we are compelled to righteousness by the two great love commandments, rather than by adherence to the O.T. Law.

"Brethren, you have been called to liberty: but do not use that liberty as an excuse to fufill the desires of the flesh, but by love serve one another. For all the law is fulfilled in one word, that is; You shall love your neighbor as yourself." (Gal. 5:13,14)

In Christ,

Tim