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I have become an agnostic.

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Travelsong, Oct 23, 2005.

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  1. Travelsong

    Travelsong Guest

    I don't know why I feel compelled to announce this except for those who feel they are headed toward a similar experience and don't know what to do.

    I don't expect this thread to last very long, but I just want to implore you to please listen.

    This process did not happen over night. Looking back I realise it's probably been inevitable for about two years.One thing I've come to understand is that Christianity made me hate myself. I mean really, really hate myself. How else am I to achieve perfect humility without an equally opposite self chastisement? I was aware of every sin and every transgression at all times. The more I became aware of my own sins, the more I became aware of others' sins. I have been slowly driving myself nuts constructing elaborate explanations for every inconsistency and contradiction in god's character as it can be discerned from the bible.

    Seriously, how am I suppposed to harmonize the idea of an all knowing, and in all other ways infinite god holding me accountable for something I have no control over?

    Why do we speak of god's perfect love yet neglect to extoll the virtues of his wrath? I mean god hates the state that you're in. Despises it. Only he can save you though. But here's the real hoop to jump through: The trick is, worship him or burn forever. That's right, god is angry and he knew he'd be angry before the foundation of the world. Just like he knew that most everyone who ever lived would die as unbelievers without even the slightest chance of knowing his fantastic message of peace and love. That's right Aztecs! You lose! You don't even get to be a tribe in the old testament for the Israelites to defeat! The only reason you heathen tribesmen were spawned is to demontrate how wonderful and loving god is...err, I mean vengeful and just.

    Anyway, I know what this process feels like, and if anyone else is going through it there is help in numbers. I know it's not easy. The courage comes in much the same way you understand faith, the same way I understood faith. These demons are not easy to overcome because we've put them there. Fear is a powerful tool.

    To all those who I talked with in the music forum I just want to say I'll miss our good discussions. Especially you Aaron. You're quite reasonable.

    Yes Aaron, I was Odemus. The guy you had banned before teaching to be as reasonable as yourself. ;)

    Peace.

    [ October 24, 2005, 06:11 PM: Message edited by: Barnabas J. Halo ]
     
    #1 Travelsong, Oct 23, 2005
  2. Gina B

    Gina B Active Member

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    No, the "trick" is that everyone is destined for destruction, and God has provided a way for the end to not be destruction.

    I'm sorry to hear you've decided God doesn't exist. I'm glad that his existance isn't dependent upon your ideas, but sad to know that you choose denial.

    If you ever decide you really want to discuss this, not for the purpose of debate but for discussion, feel free to email me at the address in my profile.
     
    #2 Gina B, Oct 23, 2005
  3. Bro. James

    Bro. James Well-Known Member
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    Not sure what the last post is about. I may be a big kibbitzer.

    "...how can we be accountable for something over which we have no control?"

    There is only one thing for which we have to account: what have we done with Jesus? God in His grace and mercy has taken care of that shortcoming too: He gives the faith to believe.

    One must be born again--Jesus takes care of that too.

    We have no excuses!!!

    Go back to John Ch. 1; let it sink in; then go to John Ch. 3. Let Jesus in this time.

    Selah,

    Bro. James
     
    #3 Bro. James, Oct 23, 2005
  4. Travelsong

    Travelsong Guest

    Sorry, I don't understand how it could have come off that way Gina, but I have no intention of baiting anyone into argument. My only goal is to connect with anyone who is going through a similar experience. My path is already chosen. Sorry for any confusion. The intensity of my words was more reflective of my actual thoughts before I came to terms with them. I hold no grudges and no bitterness toward Christianity. I gave it a heck of a run. It's just time for me to move on and make the transition as smoothly as possible, perhaps helping others to do so as well.

    Of course I realise this presents a threat and will likely be responded to as such.

    I apologize in advance for any feelings of discomfort.
     
    #4 Travelsong, Oct 23, 2005
  5. bapmom

    bapmom New Member

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    Actually Travelsong,

    it would be far better for you to connect with someone who is NOT going through this struggle right now, but rather has overcome it and gone on to real faith in Christ.

    Those who are struggling with this are exactly the people who should NOT be talking with you.
     
    #5 bapmom, Oct 23, 2005
  6. Bro. James

    Bro. James Well-Known Member
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    "I gave it a heck of a run"-- by whose estimation?

    There is only one truthful statement we can make using the pronoun "I" : "I" am totally depraved.

    When God brings us to that point we quit using the ego pronoun altogether. God calls, convicts, saves, and keeps. He does not need any help from us. Is that not wonderful?

    What have we done with Jesus?

    Now what?

    Selah,

    Bro. James
     
    #6 Bro. James, Oct 23, 2005
  7. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    Truthfully,

    I don't think this should be a forum where you are allowed to connect with others who may be weak in their faith and drag them down further. If you wish to do that, then you should purchase a domain name, and create an agnostic website. That is not the purpose of this website. The purpose of this website is supposed to be for Christian fellowship and to exalt the name of Christ. If you cannot do that, then perhaps, you should:

    A. Stick to non-religious, secular topics such as politics where there could be some common ground.

    or

    B. Stick to reading the threads here and not posting.

    I am sorry about this new event in your life and I will pray that God will save you and show you grace and mercy.

    Bro. James,

    Amen!

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #7 Joseph_Botwinick, Oct 23, 2005
  8. TexasSky

    TexasSky Guest

    The simple fact is - God is Holy.
    That is the nature of God.
    So Holy that unholiness in His presence is destroyed. The thing I noticed in reading my bible is that this isn't even presented as a willful destruction by God, it is presented as a statement of fact. Unholiness cannot bear the glory the God.

    Its like putting ice in a furnace. The ice can't take the heat, and you can't blame the furnace.

    God is so much love though, so pure and so Holy, that He offered Himself to erase the impurity of mankind, leaving only those parts which CAN survive in the presence of God.

    He offers love. Freely.
    He offers grace and mercy and forgiveness, freely.

    More freely than man has ever offered it.
     
    #8 TexasSky, Oct 24, 2005
  9. All about Grace

    All about Grace New Member

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    I can hear it now ...

    "see what happens when you listen to that ungodly contemporary music"

    Travelsong -- amidst your journey don't forget the relentless pursuit of God's grace and love.
     
    #9 All about Grace, Oct 24, 2005
  10. fatbacker

    fatbacker New Member

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    Well Travelsong good luck. I am not sure if you are still reading your post but I will leave you with one thing that I had told a homeless man one time when I lived in California.

    I told him that I would rather struggle with God than without God.
     
    #10 fatbacker, Oct 24, 2005
  11. gb93433

    gb93433 Active Member
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    There is no doubt in my mind that you do not know and understand the God of creation, the one portrayed in scripture. For one, God does not hold you accountable (just like a parent would) for the things you cannot control. He expects you to mature as a child grows to be an adult. What you are experiencing is a heavy-handed nonsensical judgmental theology that is not in scripture. You are focusing on yourself and not Christ. When you focus on self all you see is you. When you focus on Christ you see Him. If a teacher spent all of his time on what the students knew he would focus on how litle the students knew but if he focused on teaching then they would learn and help them to learn more and grow.

    To escape the fact that God is gracious yet judges is to escape the fact that God is God. As a parent I am gracious to my child yet correct her when she does wrong for her betterment not mine. So God does the same. When we are close to God there is a peace and understanding of how much God loves and how He desires nothing more than for us to go on the right path. The right path is without resistance from those who want to mislead us but it is peaceful with God.

    Hebrews 12 talks about how God's discipline yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness.

    A child must be disciplined to get to the point where he can function without parental correction and have self discipline. Without self discipline he will be unrestrained. If he becomes like that to a degree where he becomes undisciplined the police will take care of that business to ensure the safety of society.

    One cannot judge Christianity solely by its followers but by its leader-Christ.
     
    #11 gb93433, Oct 24, 2005
  12. Brother James

    Brother James New Member

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    From the westminster confession:

    v. The most wise, righteous, and gracious God doth oftentimes leave, for a season, his own children to manifold temptations, and the corruption of their own hearts, to chastise them for their former sins, or to discover unto them the hidden strength of corruption and deceitfulness of their hearts, that they may be humbled;(t) and, to raise them to a more close and constant dependence for their support upon himself, and to make them more watchful against all future occasions of sin, and for sundry other just and holy ends.(u) (t) 2Chron. 32:25,26,31; 2Sam. 24:1 (u) 2Cor. 12:7-9; Ps. ch. 73; 77:1-12; Mk. 14:66-72 with John 21:15-17.
     
    #12 Brother James, Oct 24, 2005
  13. TexasSky

    TexasSky Guest

    I know this probably doesn't have to be said, but in the one in 10,000,000 chance it does - please, let us all pray that God shows the truth to Travelsong and to anyone else who is trying to go through this life without God.
     
    #13 TexasSky, Oct 24, 2005
  14. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    I did, though only for a brief time, when I was younger.
    No apology necessary. You're welcome here any time you like. Actually, it's probably us who owe you an apology. It's our job to encourage people, and we frequently fail to do that. You are welcome here 100%, and we invite you to stay and chat with us any time you like.
     
    #14 Johnv, Oct 24, 2005
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