How should this be handled?

Good point, MR,

But, if he truly has repented, the church is to restore him to the fellowship of the saints. I would not put him back in the pulpit, especially before his court date. That would be a bad picture on the body of Christ.

Receive him into the fellowship as prescribed by Paul in 2 Corinthians 2. Pray for him daily and encourage him in the ways of the Lord.

 

I see this as a false dilemma. Why would we assume that the state convention would have to interfere in the affairs of a local church?j</font>[/QUOTE] What if the church chooses not to discipline the man nor withdraw from the state convention?

Don't you think the congregation knows that the convention will move to dismiss them in such a case? If so then there is already interference.

It doesn't resolve the problem even if they do.

Why should the political question, "What should the state convention do?" ever be uttered when considering a local church matter?

 

Thanks for your comments, Scott.
The state convention would be able to act on what it has control over. His position as a state officer.

The national SBC would be able to act likewise on his position as a national officer.

They do not control local churches. They do not have the power to remove pastors. There are some rare examples when a church has been voted out of its local association by the churches in that association. I expect the same thing happens in more independent groups. There are ways to remove a church.

But I think you are presuming a level of national and state control that does not really exist over local SBC churches. Nor should it.

Karen

 

Actually I think I am just recognizing how this lack of control would result in sinful fellowship with those walking contrary to scripture.

For example- There is a former SBC church in KC that did marriage ceremonies for homosexuals. If they hadn't volunteered to leave, what should the state and national conventions then do? Should they give them the boot thus violating their local autonomy or let them stay compromising biblical standards for separation?

Some IFB's definitely take separation too far... but how would the SBC take it far enough in situations like this?

 

It sounds, then, like your objection is not that SBC churches are controlled by a hierarchy but that there isn't ENOUGH control.

I see that independence as one of the historic Baptist distinctives.

Karen

 

I agree with standingfirminChrist.

We must follow godly principles set forth.

For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
But if you forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
Matthew 6:14, 15

 

No. My objection is that the existence of this extrabiblical authority demands one or the other.

Exactly... and as I said, that's why I am an independent Baptist. For a convention to have any meaning or authority at all, it must tread on the autonomy of the local church.

Missions and education are the two biggest convention achievements... and the ones that bother me most. If you are in an SBC church, you more than likely support missionaries who are theological liberals... and almost certainly seminary professors who are- having never met them. It's done blindly. Shouldn't we be better stewards of God's provision than that?

IFB missionaries go on deputation where each church gets to evaluate the actual missionary it chooses to support.

 

We seem to agree except on the point that he should ever be restored to the pulpit.
He is disqualified permanently from being a pastor or deacon under the standards of 1 Tim.

He must be above reproach and he is not.

MR

 

I would like to act as his man's judge. Really more of his picture than of him. But assuming his picture to be a true portrait of his condition I would ask you the following questions. Look at the man's eyes. Look at the man's countenance. Now in Baptist circles you don't hear too much talk about demons. Yet here is a clear picture, to my mind, of a man at the very minimum tormented by a demonic spirit, and perhaps even demonic possessed. In this case we need a Baptist who believes in casting out demons.

 

I don't think that you can make that determination by looking at a newspaper picture of a man in a horrible situation. If he did what he was accused of, he was wrong.
However, no one in the leadership of the Baptist General Convention of OK seems to share your viewpoint as to the cause. I doubt he was able to be demon-possessed and fool thousands of people in his church. That church has godly people in leadership. They are going through hardship because of this whole event.

Karen

 

This should remind all of us to kep our pastors and church leaders in our prayers. When one falls it hurts the whole body of Christ. Our leaders are under attack by the evil one

 

Thank you, Karen and bgoc. I agree.

If you don't like your pastor, pray for him...