A Bible Question

[HopefulNChrist]

Is this the Father's will and should it be discerned as serious since it is a judgment on all believers to heed?

John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

There is no verse that teaches the practice of worshiping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son, but by the latter part of John 5:23, it does strongly dictates that the moment we are not honoring the Son, we are no longer honoring the Father.

Yes, the Holy Spirit is God and one of the three Persons that is of the One God, BUT explain the judgment in John 5:22-23 for how God the Father specifically stated how He wants us to honor Him by.

Is it because the Holy Spirit in us is leading us to testify of the Son ( John 15:26-27 ) to glorify the Son ( John 16:13-14 ), and by honoring & glorifying the Son, we are by the Spirit, honoring & glorifying God the Father as that is the mind of Christ we are to have in worship ( Philippians 2:5-13 )? Since the role of the Holy Spirit has been laid out in scripture, how can He lead us in worship by any other way?

So how important do you regard His words in John 5:22-23 in how you come to God the Father in worship?

 

[Yeshua1]

Is this the Father's will and should it be discerned as serious since it is a judgment on all believers to heed?

John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

There is no verse that teaches the practice of worshiping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son, but by the latter part of John 5:23, it does strongly dictates that the moment we are not honoring the Son, we are no longer honoring the Father.

Yes, the Holy Spirit is God and one of the three Persons that is of the One God, BUT explain the judgment in John 5:22-23 for how God the Father specifically stated how He wants us to honor Him by.

Is it because the Holy Spirit in us is leading us to testify of the Son ( John 15:26-27 ) to glorify the Son ( John 16:13-14 ), and by honoring & glorifying the Son, we are by the Spirit, honoring & glorifying God the Father as that is the mind of Christ we are to have in worship ( Philippians 2:5-13 )? Since the role of the Holy Spirit has been laid out in scripture, how can He lead us in worship by any other way?

So how important do you regard His words in John 5:22-23 in how you come to God the Father in worship?

Only worship that God the father accepts is from ones who are now saved by the Lord jesus Himself!

 

[HopefulNChrist]

Only worship that God the father accepts is from ones who are now saved by the Lord jesus Himself!

Then that is why there is no worship of the Holy Spirit, but of the Son, the Bridegroom, our Saviour, in order to worship God the Father by.

 

[JonShaff]

Then that is why there is no worship of the Holy Spirit, but of the Son, the Bridegroom, our Saviour, in order to worship God the Father by.

Honoring the Son means to live by Faith and Obedience to the Word of God Through the Holy Spirit of God to the Glory of God.

 

[HopefulNChrist]

Honoring the Son means to live by Faith and Obedience to the Word of God Through the Holy Spirit of God to the Glory of God.

John 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.

When we worship the Lord Jesus Christ by ourselves in a singular worship, the only way our testimony of the Son in worship can be true when we are led by the Holy Spirit in worship in doing exactly what the Holy Spirit is doing; honoring & glorifying the Son.

If we honor the Holy Spirit in worship, then our testimony in that worship cannot be true when the Holy Spirit would never lead a believer to do that in according to His role as the scriptures says in John 15:26-27 & John 16:13-14

 

[JonShaff]

John 8:17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.

When we worship the Lord Jesus Christ by ourselves in a singular worship, the only way our testimony of the Son in worship can be true when we are led by the Holy Spirit in worship in doing exactly what the Holy Spirit is doing; honoring & glorifying the Son.

If we honor the Holy Spirit in worship, then our testimony in that worship cannot be true when the Holy Spirit would never lead a believer to do that in according to His role as the scriptures says in John 15:26-27 & John 16:13-14

Who honors only the Holy Spirit in worship? Do you know of a group that says only give honor to the Holy Spirit in local gatherings?

Even with some of the experiences you have testified to, I'd imagine that Christ Jesus's Resurrection is proclaimed, Christ as Savior and Lord is proclaimed, Christ coming again is proclaimed. I'd Hope anyway.

 

[HopefulNChrist]

Who honors only the Holy Spirit in worship? Do you know of a group that says only give honor to the Holy Spirit in local gatherings?

Pentecostals, Charismatics, and Catholics have done it when honoring the Holy Spirit on the calendar day of Pentecost and other occasions. If you pat attention, in your hymnals, if you flip thru them, you will find hymns focusing on the Holy Spirit and even one hymn where believers are singing for the Holy Spirit to come and fall on them.

So there is that.

Even with some of the experiences you have testified to, I'd imagine that Christ Jesus's Resurrection is proclaimed, Christ as Savior and Lord is proclaimed, Christ coming again is proclaimed. I'd Hope anyway.

Well, when Jesus had addressed the workers of iniquity in Matthew 7:21-23, they claimed that they did those things in His name, but that did not win any favors for being workers of iniquity. He went on in Matthew 7:24-27 about how not paying attention to His words is why many houses ( believers ) are falling down as in backwards in those "movements of the spirit'. Jesus points out the iniquity in Matthew 7:13-14 and how it will happen ecumenical wise in Matthew 7:15-16 as it did by the modified Nicene creed that introduced the practice of worshiping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son. The solution to avoid that work of iniquity is found in Luke 13:24 by narrowing the way to the straight gate; the Son of God in worship if one wish to avoid seducing spirits coming in when the focus is on the Holy Spirit in worship that will cause many to fall and thus go astray chasing after them for signs of confusion.

 

[JonShaff]

Pentecostals, Charismatics, and Catholics have done it when honoring the Holy Spirit on the calendar day of Pentecost and other occasions. If you pat attention, in your hymnals, if you flip thru them, you will find hymns focusing on the Holy Spirit and even one hymn where believers are singing for the Holy Spirit to come and fall on them.

So there is that.



Well, when Jesus had addressed the workers of iniquity in Matthew 7:21-23, they claimed that they did those things in His name, but that did not win any favors for being workers of iniquity. He went on in Matthew 7:24-27 about how not paying attention to His words is why many houses ( believers ) are falling down as in backwards in those "movements of the spirit'. Jesus points out the iniquity in Matthew 7:13-14 and how it will happen ecumenical wise in Matthew 7:15-16 as it did by the modified Nicene creed that introduced the practice of worshiping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son. The solution to avoid that work of iniquity is found in Luke 13:24 by narrowing the way to the straight gate; the Son of God in worship if one wish to avoid seducing spirits coming in when the focus is on the Holy Spirit in worship that will cause many to fall and thus go astray chasing after them for signs of confusion.

You are kind of hitting on several issues and bringing them together as one (conflating). What is wrong with singing about the Holy Spirit in a hymn?

 

[Yeshua1]

Then that is why there is no worship of the Holy Spirit, but of the Son, the Bridegroom, our Saviour, in order to worship God the Father by.

The Spirit is Himself the One who produces the worship in and thru us to God.

 

[HopefulNChrist]

You are kind of hitting on several issues and bringing them together as one (conflating). What is wrong with singing about the Holy Spirit in a hymn?

Is that what the Holy Spirit would lead you to do? To honor Himself in worship by singing a hymn specifically to Himself?

That is not honoring the Father. You can only honor the Father by honoring the Son and that is what the Holy Spirit is leading you to do, is that not what His words meant or not?

 

[HopefulNChrist]

The Spirit is Himself the One who produces the worship in and thru us to God.

We are led by the Holy Spirit & scripture to honor the Father by honoring the Son. Jesus said that He is the way and that no man can come to God the father but by me in John 14:6 so how can that not be applied to how we come to God the Father in worship as led by the Holy Spirit and scripture to do?

 

[utilyan]

Is that what the Holy Spirit would lead you to do? To honor Himself in worship by singing a hymn specifically to Himself?

That is not honoring the Father. You can only honor the Father by honoring the Son and that is what the Holy Spirit is leading you to do, is that not what His words meant or not?

Matthew 6

9“Pray, then, in this way:
‘Our Father who is in heaven,
Hallowed be Your name.

The very worship of Jesus Christ, the example he commands, ought to snap you out of it.


"You can only honor the Father by honoring the Son"

Show us a bible verse for that one.

That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father.

If you start with the premise that honor must be given to the son first of equal match of the father, then giving Jesus ZERO would be honoring him as much as the Father.


He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

It can imply He that honors the Son honors the Father.

But it doesn't say the ONLY way to honor the father is honoring the son.

Nor does it say the ONLY way to dishonor the father is by dishonoring the son.



Lets take off the glasses of selfishness, vanity and pride. God's perspective is bit differ from ours.

The best way you can honor me is you honor the ones I care for most.


Matthew 25

35‘For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.’ 37“Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink? 38‘And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You?39‘When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40“The King will answer and say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.’


1 Corinthians 6:19

Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own,


Your very body is the worship of the holy spirit.

 

[HopefulNChrist]

Matthew 6

9“Pray, then, in this way:
‘Our Father who is in heaven,
Hallowed be Your name.

The very worship of Jesus Christ, the example he commands, ought to snap you out of it.


"You can only honor the Father by honoring the Son"

Show us a bible verse for that one.

Philippians 2:5-11

That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father.

If you start with the premise that honor must be given to the son first of equal match of the father, then giving Jesus ZERO would be honoring him as much as the Father.

He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

It can imply He that honors the Son honors the Father.

But it doesn't say the ONLY way to honor the father is honoring the son.

Nor does it say the ONLY way to dishonor the father is by dishonoring the son.

The latter part of John 5:23 does say that to mean it in that way. Otherwise, there is no point adding that to verse 23.

Lets take off the glasses of selfishness, vanity and pride. God's perspective is bit differ from ours.

The two statement in that quote above does not relate to one another at all.

The best way you can honor me is you honor the ones I care for most.


Matthew 25

35‘For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.’ 37“Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink? 38‘And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You?39‘When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40“The King will answer and say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.’

Changing the topic of honor in how God the Father specifically wants us to honor Him by to how we are to honor other people is self defeating, brother.

If you apply that reference to the honor I am talking about, then this scriptural reference below will refute trying to place that honor of others on the same level as honoring the Father & the Son.

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. 41 I receive not honour from men. 42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. 43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? 45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

So your relating the honor given to the Father by also honoring other believers is hardly the same kind of honor I am talking about. Reverential honor can only be given to the Father by honoring the Son. That is what the father wants and John 5:22 speaks of that standard of judgment that is over all believers so I doubt there can be any room for argument.

1 Corinthians 6:19

Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own,

Your very body is the worship of the holy spirit.

Irrelevant application towards the OP at hand since you are not giving reverential honor to God the Father by bowing to yourself in a mirror. You honor the Father as being the FATHER by honoring the Son as being His SON Whom His honor and glory rests in in regards to our redemption. That is the mind of Christ we are to have in worship as to why His name, the name of the Son Whom has died on the cross, is the name that is exalted above every other name TO the glory of God the Father.

 

[utilyan]

Philippians 2:5-11



The latter part of John 5:23 does say that to mean it in that way. Otherwise, there is no point adding that to verse 23.



The two statement in that quote above does not relate to one another at all.



Changing the topic of honor in how God the Father specifically wants us to honor Him by to how we are to honor other people is self defeating, brother.

If you apply that reference to the honor I am talking about, then this scriptural reference below will refute trying to place that honor of others on the same level as honoring the Father & the Son.

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. 41 I receive not honour from men. 42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you. 43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? 45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me; for he wrote of me. 47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

So your relating the honor given to the Father by also honoring other believers is hardly the same kind of honor I am talking about. Reverential honor can only be given to the Father by honoring the Son. That is what the father wants and John 5:22 speaks of that standard of judgment that is over all believers so I doubt there can be any room for argument.



Irrelevant application towards the OP at hand since you are not giving reverential honor to God the Father by bowing to yourself in a mirror. You honor the Father as being the FATHER by honoring the Son as being His SON Whom His honor and glory rests in in regards to our redemption. That is the mind of Christ we are to have in worship as to why His name, the name of the Son Whom has died on the cross, is the name that is exalted above every other name TO the glory of God the Father.

All you have to say is the method by which Jesus Christ commanded worship "THE OUR FATHER" is False.
And you have yourself a winner.



" Reverential honor can only be given to the Father by honoring the Son. "

If John wanted to say this he could have easily wrote it. He did not.


Nothing you quoted states this. You have a mix of mistaken logic and mistaken reading comprehension.



But lets assume and scribble in your bad logic as bible truth, "Reverential honor can only be given to the Father by honoring the Son." Lets assume this vital foundation teaching is clearly and plainly spelled out in the bible ,which its not.

The amount of honor to the SON would equate to ZERO if the standard by which the Son is honored is the amount given to the Father.


The verse clearly specifies: "That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father."

It already says you need to register the honor to the son to what is already assigned to the Father.

We are using your logic here:

The set amount of honor given to the son SHOULD equate to the amount of honor given to the Father.

Now you step in and say you can't Honor the Father directly you have to Register through the son.

Ok so then how much honor does the Father have from the start? ZERO.

The Honor of the Father has to be ZERO because you said yourself it can't be raised unless you do it through the SON.

Whats the amount of Honor to be given to the SON? "honour the Son, even as they honour the Father."

That is ZERO.



You can be pretty sure anyone who murders is not honoring the Father, your reading in the word "ONLY" and its not in there.

 

[HopefulNChrist]

All you have to say is the method by which Jesus Christ commanded worship "THE OUR FATHER" is False.
And you have yourself a winner.

" Reverential honor can only be given to the Father by honoring the Son. "

If John wanted to say this he could have easily wrote it. He did not.

John 5:22 refers to a standard of judgment on all believers by which that standard of judgment is what verse 23 is about

Nothing you quoted states this. You have a mix of mistaken logic and mistaken reading comprehension.

Cause and effect. How come in those crazy movements of the "Spirit" where they address the Holy Spirit in worship to come and fall on them, why would God allow that strong delusion to occur if you believe "slain in the Spirit" and "holy laughter movement" are not of the Lord?

I believe God allowed that to happen because they did not pay attention to His words in Matthew 7:13-27 by how and why they had broaden the way in coming to God the Father by.. by going around the Son ( John 10:1 ) for which is dishonoring the Son and thereby dishonoring the Father for why that is an iniquity allowing strong delusion to occur.

So look at John 14:6 with His help to discern why He said that in the ay He has said it since the solution to the iniquity in Matthew 7:13-14 is to narrow the way back to the straight gate ( Luke 13:24 & John 10:7-9 )

Otherwise, when the devil comes as a roaming lion seeking whom he may devour, when focus is on the Holy Spirit in worship, many will fall because of it, and the hardest thing you would have is convincing believers that are chasing after that phenomenon is that you cannot say that was not the Holy Spirit when they were honoring the Holy Spirit in worship.

That is why Jesus said to narrow the way in Luke 13:24 so that you do not suffer a thief to break through, otherwise one gets left behind from the Marriage Supper as described in Luke 13:25-30. That is why you are to watch out for that by keeping your eyes on the Son in worship and not on the Spirit at any time in worship when the indwelling Spirit would point you to the Son instead.

Luke 12:38 And if he shall come in the second watch, or come in the third watch, and find them so, blessed are those servants. 39 And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. 40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.

 

[utilyan]

John 5:22 refers to a standard of judgment on all believers by which that standard of judgment is what verse 23 is about


Cause and effect. How come in those crazy movements of the "Spirit" where they address the Holy Spirit in worship to come and fall on them, why would God allow that strong delusion to occur if you believe "slain in the Spirit" and "holy laughter movement" are not of the Lord?

I believe God allowed that to happen because they did not pay attention to His words in Matthew 7:13-27 by how and why they had broaden the way in coming to God the Father by.. by going around the Son ( John 10:1 ) for which is dishonoring the Son and thereby dishonoring the Father for why that is an iniquity allowing strong delusion to occur.

So look at John 14:6 with His help to discern why He said that in the ay He has said it since the solution to the iniquity in Matthew 7:13-14 is to narrow the way back to the straight gate ( Luke 13:24 & John 10:7-9 )

Otherwise, when the devil comes as a roaming lion seeking whom he may devour, when focus is on the Holy Spirit in worship, many will fall because of it, and the hardest thing you would have is convincing believers that are chasing after that phenomenon is that you cannot say that was not the Holy Spirit when they were honoring the Holy Spirit in worship.

That is why Jesus said to narrow the way in Luke 13:24 so that you do not suffer a thief to break through, otherwise one gets left behind from the Marriage Supper as described in Luke 13:25-30. That is why you are to watch out for that by keeping your eyes on the Son in worship and not on the Spirit at any time in worship when the indwelling Spirit would point you to the Son instead.

Luke 12:38 And if he shall come in the second watch, or come in the third watch, and find them so, blessed are those servants. 39 And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. 40 Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not.

People will even kill in the name of Jesus Christ and I will wager have done so more then our overly dramatic charismatic brethren.


Pentecostal will tell you:

John 14
26“But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.

And they often repeatedly say "in the name of Jesus". Some will even claim the name of the Father, Son and Holy spirit is Jesus.

Scripture provides a decent check and balance with 1 Corinthians 13.

God himself always provides escape from temptation and idolatry 1 Corinthians 10:13

Now if they are demonically oppressed and/or possessed then YOU do something about it.

I don't think we should vilify the Holy Spirit. Even Jesus declares the Holy Spirit will teach you all things, I'm sure worshiping only Jesus and not the Father or Holy Spirit would come up.

If there is an evil at work, call it like you see it. Lets not start calling evil things good and good things evil.

Matthew 7

11“If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give what is good to those who ask Him!

Not much at all, assuming the requirement is asking Jesus.

 

[HopefulNChrist]

People will even kill in the name of Jesus Christ and I will wager have done so more then our overly dramatic charismatic brethren.

Yet Jesus warned us against false prophets in Matthew 7:13-16 that would broaden the way which I apply His words that they have done so by the modified Nicene creed of worshiping the Holy Spirit with the Father & the Son which is not plainly taught in scripture to do, BUT the scripture does teach how the Father specifically wants us to honor Him and glorify Him by and that is by honoring & glorifying the Son.

Pentecostal will tell you:

John 14
26“But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.

And they often repeatedly say "in the name of Jesus". Some will even claim the name of the Father, Son and Holy spirit is Jesus.

Scripture provides a decent check and balance with 1 Corinthians 13.

God himself always provides escape from temptation and idolatry 1 Corinthians 10:13

Now if they are demonically oppressed and/or possessed then YOU do something about it.

The Lord is enabling me to warn against their preaching the baptism of the Holy Ghost with the evidence of tongues as another gospel, but only God can cause the increase just as only God can inform those not involved to see it for what it is; apostasy as prophesied to occur in these latter days in droves ( 1 Timothy 4:1-2 & 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3:15 )

I don't think we should vilify the Holy Spirit. Even Jesus declares the Holy Spirit will teach you all things, I'm sure worshiping only Jesus and not the Father or Holy Spirit would come up.

It is hardly vilifying the Holy Spirit when you recognize scripture regarding the role of the Holy Spirit in what He is leading us to do and that is to testify of the Son in seeking His glory and not His own glory ( John 16:13-14 & John 15:26-27 ).

If there is an evil at work, call it like you see it. Lets not start calling evil things good and good things evil.

As the 2 Corinthians 11:3-4 & 2 Corinthians 13:5 &Luke 11:9-13 points out, there is no receiving the Holy Spirit apart from salvation by a sign. 1 John 4:1 & 1 John 4:4 would have you test the spirit as not being the Holy Spirit coming over a believer later on in life when He is already in you as promised by faith at the calling of the gospel when you had first believed in Jesus Christ in 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15. The lie in 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12 is believing that you can receive the Holy Spirit apart from salvation after a sign for why Paul reminds believers of the traditions taught of us in 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15 which is after exposing this iniquity that will cause the falling away from the faith in droves in the latter days ( 2 Thessalonians 2:3 ) because of the necessity that this iniquity was even happening back in Paul's days in 2 Thessalonians 2:7 . Paul goes on to address those that are falling away from the faith and no loner following after the traditions taught of us and are disorderly in Paul's days ( 2 Thessalonians 3:1-7 ) that we are not to treat them as the enemy, but withdraw from them in admonishing them as brothers still in 2 Thessalonians 3:14-15.

So that is the evil thing which is the lie that one can receive the Holy Spirit apart from salvation by a sign, thus becoming an adulterous generation, and unless they repent of this spiritual fornication, they run the risk of being left behind at the pre great trib rapture event for following a stranger's voice which is what the devil's tongues without interpretation is; gibberish nonsense. Isaiah 8:19 & 1 Timothy 4:1-2

Matthew 7

11“If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give what is good to those who ask Him!

Not much at all, assuming the requirement is asking Jesus.

Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: 8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. 9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone? 10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent? 11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

Luke 11:9-13 has the "good things" of Matthew 7:11 with the "Holy Spirit" but the message is the same; when you knock at the door of Jesus Christ, you will be saved; you will have the promise of the Holy Spirit at your salvation; therefore to assume that spirit is the Holy Spirit coming over a saved believer later on in life IS NOT the Holy Spirit for that would make the Father look EVIL as if He did not give you the Holy Spirit the first time as a gift as promised for seeking Jesus Christ as their Savior.

 

[HankD]

1 Thessalonians 5:19 Quench not the Spirit.

1 Thessalonians Chapter 5 is concerned with our walk with/in the Lord in light of His return.
5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

Quench – this verb is used of putting out fires almost exclusively.

Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

Again a forward look to “the day of redemption” and in this context we are admonished

31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
32 And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, just as God in Christ forgave you.

Presumably if we are not obedient in this area then we grieve Him.

 

[HopefulNChrist]

1 Thessalonians 5:19 Quench not the Spirit.

1 Thessalonians Chapter 5 is concerned with our walk with/in the Lord in light of His return.
5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

Quench – this verb is used of putting out fires almost exclusively.

Quench may be defined in that way today, but it can hardly be the same meaning in 1 Thessalonians 5:19.

And in context to verses 20-21, we are to test the spirits by knowing that in according to our faith in Jesus Christ, we had received the promise of the Spirit at the calling of the gospel when we had first believed in Him at our salvation. So knowing that the Holy Spirit is in the believer since his salvation, when a spirit comes over us later on in life, that is not the Holy Spirit.

Testing the spirit is not quenching the Spirit.

Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.

Again a forward look to “the day of redemption” and in this context we are admonished

31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
32 And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, just as God in Christ forgave you.

Presumably if we are not obedient in this area then we grieve Him.

Since we are warned not to grieve the Holy Spirit, then it is obvious we cannot quench the Spirit as if we can put Him out of us.

Quench has to have another meaning back in the days of the early church that apparently is not being used today. In context; since originally, chapters nor verses were numbered in the original scripture.

1 Thessalonians 5:9 Quench not the Spirit. 20 Despise not prophesyings.

It stands to reason that we are not to quench the Spirit by despising prophesying. I am sure there will be times when believers will be tempted not to say anything edifying, believing that it is not their place to say when the Holy Spirit is saying it from the Lord Jesus Christ.

So I believe quenching here in context means "do not resist the Holy Spirit by despising prophesying".

The verse should not be applied to accepting whatever spirit that comes over a believer apart from salvation as if that is the Holy Spirit. That would be applying scripture in running against the truths in other scripture which cannot be, thereby no one can test the spirits.