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Adam represented all men and Christ represented...who exactly?

ReformedBaptist

Well-Known Member
Calvinism seems to presume that Adam represented "all people" while Christ represented "his people"...the "elect."

But the text clearly says Christ died for the same "all" that Adam represented.

There is no argument that we were all represented by Adam, so why would anyone just assume that we weren't all represented by Christ, being the second Adam?

The only reason Calvinists make that assumption is because they presume that providing all men justification must equal salvation unto eternal life for all men (Universalism), but I submit that one can be justified in some sense, yet still condemned. How?

By Christ's death all men are justified in regard to the law (Old Covenant) and therefore will not be judged in regard to the works required by the law in that Covenant. Instead they will be judged by the requirements of the new covenant of Grace. There is only one requirement. FAITH.

So, because of Christ's work on the cross, no one is now born under the curse of the law for it has been fulfilled once and for ALL by Christ. No one is required to meet the standard of the law and in that sense is justified according to the demands of the first covenant. Those under the law will be judged by the law, but we are under Grace and will be judged by our response to the gospel of grace.

John 12:44 Then Jesus cried out and said, "He who believes in Me, believes not in Me but in Him who sent Me. 45 And he who sees Me sees Him who sent Me. 46 I have come as a light into the world, that whoever believes in Me should not abide in darkness. 47 And if anyone hears My words and does not *believe, I do not judge him; for I did not come to judge the world but to save the world. 48 He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him--the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day.

You can see from this verse that Christ is not judging men for their sin in regard to the law, instead he is judging them based upon their response to his Words, which are the gospel message of reconciliation for the world.


What say you?

Skand,

Here are the Scriptures that speak to this subject:

12Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

13(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

14Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

15But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

16And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.

17For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

18Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

19For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

20Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:

21That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

The passages that could be cited from 1 Cor 15 speak to the general ressurection of both the good and the wicked, in paul's arguement to prove that the dead are raised. But this Romans passage is different.

To answer your question plainly, we (Calvinists) do believe Christ represent all who were "in Him" as Adam represented all who were "in him." You may remember this being referred to theologically as federal headship.

Just as the Levitical priesthood payed tithes "in Abraham" so the actions, in our text the disobedience of Adam, was accomplished by all in him (Adam). In other words, when Adam sinned we sinned in him.

And when Christ obeyed, we obeyed in Him. But is each and every man born into this world born in Christ? No. They are yet born in Adam and under bondage. To be in Christ one must be born again.

The reason why we can be faithful to the Scripture is because we are agreeing with it that both Adam and the Second Adam, Jesus Christ, are representing all their offspring.

Verse 21 I think says this well "That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord."

If that representing of Christ for His offspring must mean each and every man, than just as surely as death was the effect of the first man's disobedience, so MUST righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord, be the effect for each and every man..and you end up with universalism.

But this is not the case, but the offspring of Christ are those who recieve it. Verse 17 "For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ."
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
IThis is a false dichotomy used quite often by calvinists. Circumstances dictate the choice. If your children were dying of hunger I guarantee they would eat the brussel sprouts...so to state they "never" would choose it is false.

No, it's not a false dichotomy. We are speaking of choice - not only one choice. Given a starving child and one choice, of course they're going to choose to eat. OK - Let's work with your choices. You have a starving child and you offer them a 1 lb. steak or a single pea. Can they choose a pea? Sure. It's an actual choice but I'll bet 100% would choose the steak.

Does that work better for you?

How about offer that starving person a shoe or a steak? I bet I can guess what they'd choose.
 

webdog

Active Member
Site Supporter
No, it's not a false dichotomy. We are speaking of choice - not only one choice. Given a starving child and one choice, of course they're going to choose to eat. OK - Let's work with your choices. You have a starving child and you offer them a 1 lb. steak or a single pea. Can they choose a pea? Sure. It's an actual choice but I'll bet 100% would choose the steak.

Does that work better for you?

How about offer that starving person a shoe or a steak? I bet I can guess what they'd choose.
Now you are basing the choice on perception...and that is the exact thing free will hinges on! The choices men make are based on what they perceive them as not "according to their nature". At any rate, you have presented man the real choice to accept Christ, an ability which strikes down many doctines reformed theology needs to work (limited atonement, total depravity, irresistable grace)
 
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