Advice, too late

The Galatian · Jun 29, 2006

Why didn't you just get your daddy to find you a place in the national guard? Heck they don't even care if you just quit showing up!

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2006/06/images/20060627-5_d-0318-1-755v.jpg

ASLANSPAL · Jun 30, 2006

The large untold story is not the deaths but of the maimed and wounded

I don't have the numbers but it may be closing in on 20,000 people like this nice young man.

It is a largely untold story with the majority suffering immensely.

I saw the photo op and news snippet on tv the young man had to remind
bush where he had met him.

Oh well! work is hard for bush.

The story of the maimed needs to be told and not just number of deaths
this occupation of Iraq is filled with powerful bombs that have uped the numbers of the maimed.

emeraldctyangel · Jul 2, 2006

Wow this thread is particularly hate filled. Nice. Instead of celebrating this man's tough fight to recovery, you are being ugly and partitioning him off into a place where you dont have to look at him.

It is my sincere hope that nothing terrible ever challenges either of you - lest you find the same support that you are giving.

My best to him and his family. Long hard battle won. Congratulations and well done.

Hope of Glory · Jul 2, 2006

ASLANSPAL said:

the young man had to remind
bush where he had met him.
Click to expand...

I live in a town of 5,000 people, and I have to be reminded of people that I meet. I can only imagine with how many people the president meets.

Ironically, I didn't hear this man complaining about doing the right thing on behalf of others, but many have taken it upon themselves to take up his "cause".

Do I have empathy for him? Certainly. But, he was doing something honorable, and he is honorable about it.

ASLANSPAL · Jul 2, 2006

Actually bush stuck his foot inside his mouth when he had asserted he met the young man at Walter Reed...the young man corrected him and bush accepted the correction....bush has said himself "work is hard at the white house" but how could you forget a double amputee who says he wants to do one of bushs favorite things.

I think the first post was for satirical purposes and we have an area for that but what it did bring to light is the untold story of the maimed and wounded who have suffered from these enormous blasts.

and it seems to be of late bush is really trying real hard to get his poll numbers out of the low 30's ..fine he can do that with every photo op he can..will the american people buy it??

It is fair game for those who think it is something else ...Iraq is bushs occupation filled with incompetence and the pain and suffering that incompetence has wrought is self-evident, so it has nothing to do with hate and everything to do with speaking truth to power on this holiday that represents speaking truth to power. imho

so do your grandstanding those who want to pigeon hole people..the truth to power is this...bush messed up and their are consequences...nothing wrong with this young man but he is only one of thousands perhaps bush should experience the other thousands as well. Or even send Jenna to Iraq ..oh thats right she is going to South America..forget that.

http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:c3Ntk3sjdEESgM:www.villagevoice.com/blogs/bushbeat/archive/images/kid-amputee-7-7-03-iraq-thumb.jpg http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:_FAlw_0XUGt37M:www.npr.org/programs/morning/features/2005/mar/rozelle/training200.jpg

emeraldctyangel · Jul 3, 2006

Well A-pal, not everyone has the amazing Carnak abilities that you seem to possess. Walter Reed is where the President meets most of the wounded. Stop being coy and work on that attention span problem of yours...the President has jogged with more than this one soldier. I see their taking in a run with the President as a testament to determination and sheer will. That should point to something in everyone as they say "If I can do this, what can YOU do?"

As far as bringing to light a problem, youve only exposed one thing (again): Un-Christian-like attitudes towards the leader of this country and a man who lost his leg and foot.

Additionally youre attempting to invalidate what these injured soldiers stand for, what they fight for, what decisions they make on their own. Youre never going to be able to do that no matter how many posts you make. You might as well take up knitting. The minute this guy was able to walk, he made your opinions on this matter an non event.

The Galatian · Jul 5, 2006

Bush does lots of photo ops with wounded vets. The idea is that maybe people won't remember his lack of fiber when it was his turn to serve.

This is the George W. Bush who decided we were paying our troops too much money to go and risk their lives for us. This is the George W. Bush, who just walked away from his duty.

No photo op will ever clean that stain away.

LeBuick · Jul 5, 2006

I wonder if the soldier is taller or shorter with his new legs?

The Galatian · Jul 6, 2006

Depends on how much weight he puts on them. They are essentially springs, that mimic the natural resiliancy of human tendons and muscles.

LadyEagle · Jul 6, 2006

Sorry to hijack the thread, but this reminded me of the media blackout on returning coffins from Iraq and Afghanistan. We can thank our Congress.

SEC. 1082. SENSE OF CONGRESS CONCERNING MEDIA COVERAGE OF THE RETURN TO THE UNITED STATES OF THE REMAINS OF DECEASED MEMBERS OF THE ARMED FORCES FROM OVERSEAS.

(a) FINDINGS.—Congress makes the following findings:
(1) The Department of Defense, since 1991, has relied on a policy of no media coverage of the transfers of the remains of deceased members of the Armed Forces—
(A) at Ramstein Air Force Base, Germany;
(B) at Dover Air Force Base, Delaware, and the Port Mortuary Facility at Dover Air Force Base; and
(C) at interim stops en route to the point of final destination in the transfer of the remains.
(2) The principal focus and purpose of the policy is to protect the wishes and the privacy of families of deceased members of the Armed Forces during their time of great loss and grief and to give families and friends of the dead the privilege to decide whether to allow media coverage at the member’s duty or home station, at the interment site, or at or in connection with funeral and memorial services.
(3) In a 1991 legal challenge to the Department of Defense policy, as applied during Operation Desert Storm, the policy was upheld by the United States District Court for the District of Columbia, and on appeal, by the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia in the case of JB Pictures, Inc. v. Department of Defense and Donald B. Rice, Secretary of the Air Force on the basis that denying the media the right to view the return of remains at Dover Air Force Base does not violate the first amendment guarantees of freedom of speech and of the press.
(4) The United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia in that case cited the following two key Government interests that are served by the Department of Defense policy:
(A) Reducing the hardship on the families and friends of the war dead, who may feel obligated to travel great distances to attend arrival ceremonies at Dover Air Force Base if such ceremonies were held.
(B) Protecting the privacy of families and friends of the dead, who may not want media coverage of the unloading of caskets at Dover Air Force Base.
(5) The Court also noted, in that case, that the bereaved may be upset at the public display of the caskets of their loved ones and that the policy gives the family the right to grant or deny access to the media at memorial or funeral services at the home base and that the policy is consistent in its concern for families.
(b) SENSE OF CONGRESS.—It is the sense of Congress that the Department of Defense policy regarding no media coverage of the transfer of the remains of deceased members of the Armed Forces—
(1) appropriately protects the privacy of the families and friends of the deceased; and
(2) is consistent with United States constitutional guarantees of freedom of speech and freedom of the press.
Sense of the Congress concerning media coverage of the return to the United States of the remains of deceased members of the Armed Forces from overseas (sec. 1082)
The Senate amendment contained a provision (sec. 366) that would state the sense of the Congress that the Department of Defense policy regarding no media coverage of the transfer of the remains of deceased members of the Armed Forces appropriately protects the privacy of the families and friends of the deceased, and is consistent with constitutional guarantees of freedom of speech and freedom of the press.
The House bill contained no similar provision.
The House recedes with a technical amendment.
Click to expand...

http://www.fas.org/sgp/congress/2004/hr4200conf.html#1082

I don't believe Congress served the American public and I do believe it was done for political purposes, even though the original act of prohibition was created in the 1990s. Sad. One would think that if one was sure the majority of the American public was behind "defending our country" that it would only serve to remind us of the honor of our fallen and help national esteem of our troops who bravely serve, instead of skulking around and banning media in a country who so proudly boasts "freedom of the press." I smell hypocrisy.

The Galatian · Jul 6, 2006

Once, we brought home our dead warriors with sadness, but gratitude and honor for their sacrifice.

Now we sneak them back in the dark of night, so no one will notice.

What have we become, when this becomes a media management issue?

Are there any patriots left in Washington?

emeraldctyangel · Jul 8, 2006

They dont come in in the darkness of night. Dover AFB has a bit of a problem landing their planes without lights on. The people that matter - notice those being the loved ones of the dead.

And it was during Vietnam when people started to become disrespectful over troops coming home - dead or alive.

If you want to throw a parade and have a potluck on church grounds for the returning soldiers, by all means, please do. Nobody is stopping you.

emeraldctyangel · Jul 8, 2006

LadyEagle said:

Sorry to hijack the thread, but this reminded me of the media blackout on returning coffins from Iraq and Afghanistan. We can thank our Congress.

http://www.fas.org/sgp/congress/2004/hr4200conf.html#1082

I don't believe Congress served the American public and I do believe it was done for political purposes, even though the original act of prohibition was created in the 1990s. Sad. One would think that if one was sure the majority of the American public was behind "defending our country" that it would only serve to remind us of the honor of our fallen and help national esteem of our troops who bravely serve, instead of skulking around and banning media in a country who so proudly boasts "freedom of the press." I smell hypocrisy.
Click to expand...

First you should know they are not transported in coffins. They are called transfer cases. Huge difference that you wouldnt have to deal with under a normal burial situation.

I am just curious why you would want to see these transfer cases coming off the planes?

I dont want my remains photographed by some cold newspaper. They dont know me, dont care about me, and are only interested in selling papers. Let my brothers and sisters escort me home and give me back to my family. And you can watch reruns of I dream of Jeanie on tv instead.

genesis12 · Jul 9, 2006

He's showed up every day since he was elected - twice - as CinC, not an LT in the Air Guard. Some folks just can't let go of an incident. They want to ride a dead horse to death. Methinks that if Galatian put his mind to it, he could blame Bush for WW-I.

The Galatian · Jul 10, 2006

They dont come in in the darkness of night. Dover AFB has a bit of a problem landing their planes without lights on.
Click to expand...

They do schedule them at night. Fewer observers. A civilian employee took some pictures. Fired. They are ashamed, of this.

The people that matter - notice those being the loved ones of the dead.
Click to expand...

And God forbid that other people should be reminded what's going on. Used to be, these men and women came home in the light of day, with honor. Now they're furtively returned in the dark of night so no one will know.

And it was during Vietnam when people started to become disrespectful over troops coming home - dead or alive.
Click to expand...

What was done wrongly then is not license to do it now.

If you want to throw a parade and have a potluck on church grounds for the returning soldiers, by all means, please do. Nobody is stopping you.
Click to expand...

I would like to see the president put simple respect for our fallen fighters ahead of his political objectives. Too much to ask, apparently.

GEN.writes, regarding Bush's AWOL during Vietnam:

He's showed up every day since he was elected - twice - as CinC, not an LT in the Air Guard.
Click to expand...

Never thought of that. They just didn't give him the position he wanted. No wonder he cut and ran.:laugh:

Some folks just can't let go of an incident.
Click to expand...

Abandoning your post when you've sworn to do your duty is a bigger deal than some people think.

They want to ride a dead horse to death. Methinks that if Galatian put his mind to it, he could blame Bush for WW-I.
Click to expand...

I, and millions of others, served honorably and well. I have no respect for those who swore to do likewise, and then violated that oath.

That isn't going to change. Bush is responsible for just one war. For the way it's going, for starting it, and for what it's doing to America.

He's

carpro · Jul 10, 2006

emeraldctyangel said:

Wow this thread is particularly hate filled.
Click to expand...

Yes it is.

The Galatian · Jul 10, 2006

I don't hate the guy. Before I knew what he had done, I even voted for him as governor. And he did a pretty good job there.

But that doesn't mean I'm going to forget what he did when walked away from his duty as an American.

They used to call it "loving your country."

Now some people call it "hate." Maybe this is end times.

LadyEagle · Jul 10, 2006

It is. :type:

Terry_Herrington · Jul 10, 2006

carpro said:

Yes it is.
Click to expand...

A lot of the "hate" is directed at those who disagree with Bush's handling of the war.

Joseph_Botwinick · Jul 10, 2006

LadyEagle said:

(2) The principal focus and purpose of the policy is to protect the wishes and the privacy of families of deceased members of the Armed Forces during their time of great loss and grief and to give families and friends of the dead the privilege to decide whether to allow media coverage at the member’s duty or home station, at the interment site, or at or in connection with funeral and memorial services...

(B) Protecting the privacy of families and friends of the dead, who may not want media coverage of the unloading of caskets at Dover Air Force Base.
(5) The Court also noted, in that case, that the bereaved may be upset at the public display of the caskets of their loved ones and that the policy gives the family the right to grant or deny access to the media at memorial or funeral services at the home base and that the policy is consistent in its concern for families.
Click to expand...

I, for one, am glad that Congress stopped the media from exploiting the suffering of fallen soldiers' families for political gain.

Joseph Botwinick:thumbs:

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