Anna Duggar: Would you be as gracious?

[righteousdude2]

http://www.etonline.com/news/171410_anna_duggar_puts_a_smile_on_as_she_steps_out_without_josh/

I like to ask all of you on the board if the shoe was on the other foot, how you would handle a cheating spouse?

I have to give her tons of credit and hand full of kudos for her strength and love so far. After all, she is a young mother of four! Many that I talk to think she should have filed for divorce the day after she discovered his infidelities!

 

[Scarlett O.]

Honestly, I don't know what I would do. No one does unless you experience it firsthand.

Hypothetically speaking, here's what I would HOPE that I would NOT do:

• I would not talk to the press or give interviews of any kind.
• I would not live with my in-laws.
• I would not speak about my private issues except with only a small handful that I trusted and/or sought out their counsel.
• I would not allow anyone - even immediate family - to talk about this in front of my children.

Hypothetically speaking, here's what I would HOPE that I WOULD do:

• I would pray daily for my husband to "get it" - what he has done to our marriage, his Christian testimony, our children, and ultimately, himself.
• I would pray for his deliverance from evil.
• I would focus daily on protecting my children from busy-bodies and well-intended, but misguided family members who business it is NOT to raise my children who might want to "counsel" them. I would have 100% sole discretion as to what they are told.
• I would agonize over every word that I spoke to my children about their father. They are too young. Do I lie? Do I hint at the truth? Can they tell something is really bad?

Anna was raised in a far different culture than me - one I don't truly understand. Odds are, she will return to him. While I believe in marital restoration, I also believe that she MUST be allowed to grieve, express anger, question the future, and receive long-term and Godly help if when she does go back to him that she won't blend into the background and the whole mess start all over again.


She is going to have to be a different person when she goes back to him. With God's help, he will be a different man.

 

[righteousdude2]

Honestly, I don't know what I would do. No one does unless you experience it firsthand.

Hypothetically speaking, here's what I would HOPE that I would NOT do:

• I would not talk to the press or give interviews of any kind.
• I would not live with my in-laws.
• I would not speak about my private issues except with only a small handful that I trusted and/or sought out their counsel.

Hypothetically speaking, here's what I would HOPE that I WOULD do:

• I would pray daily for my husband to "get it" - what he has done to our marriage, his Christian testimony, our children, and ultimately, himself.
• I would pray for his deliverance from evil.
• I would focus daily on protecting my children from busy-bodies and well-intended, but misguided family members who business it is NOT to raise my children who might want to "counsel" them. I would have 100% sole discretion as to what they are told.
• I would agonize over every word that I spoke to my children about their father. They are too young. Do I lie? Do I hint at the truth? Can they tell something is really bad?

Anna was raised in a far different culture than me - one I don't truly understand. Odds are, she will return to him. While I believe in marital restoration, I also believe that she MUST be allowed to grieve, express anger, question the future, and receive long-term and Godly help if when she does go back to him that she won't blend into the background and the whole mess start all over again.


She is going to have to be a different person when she goes back to him. With God's help, he will be a different man.

Wow! Scarlett, I don't know if anyone else needs to respond! That was EXCELLENT! And I appreciate it coming from a woman's point of view!

Actually, I was cheated on, didn't know it until months later, when members of the church started to tell me how they saw her out with other men, when I was working three day weekends as Supervisor at a juvenile holding and treatment center!

And that is why I hope some men will open up and share their heart experiences and views too!

Again, thanks sister. I think you thought that out quite well. :applause:

 

[annsni]

Infidelity is a very difficult event in a marriage (to put it lightly) and having dealt with this within our congregation, I can safely say it is easy to say what we would do from the outside but once it happens to you, I do think things change. Healing from unfaithfulness is a very long and hard process and it can take years to get to a point where it is no longer daily affecting your relationship with your spouse. I do hope that I would be as gracious but a lot depends on the spouse as well. I'm grateful my husband has put obvious safeguards up and I know his heart pretty well after 30 years and yet we never know what sin hides in the heart of others. Honestly, in the last 6 months, I've realized that infidelity is standing at the door of every marriage and we MUST be on guard against it.

 

[Aaron]

What Ann said. :thumbs:

 

[JamesL]

Infidelity is a very difficult event in a marriage (to put it lightly) and having dealt with this within our congregation, I can safely say it is easy to say what we would do from the outside but once it happens to you, I do think things change. Healing from unfaithfulness is a very long and hard process and it can take years to get to a point where it is no longer daily affecting your relationship with your spouse. I do hope that I would be as gracious but a lot depends on the spouse as well. I'm grateful my husband has put obvious safeguards up and I know his heart pretty well after 30 years and yet we never know what sin hides in the heart of others. Honestly, in the last 6 months, I've realized that infidelity is standing at the door of every marriage and we MUST be on guard against it.

I find this to be the most worldly, unbiblical response I've ever seen on the subject. Good night. Your husband has to put up safeguards? How faithful is he if he has to wrangle himself into not cheating?

Where does scripture speak about "years" of healing from being cheated on?


My son's mom cheated on me, numerous times. And when she would deny her wrongdoing, I forgave her as though she had done nothing wrong. And when she became pregnant and thought it was a result of her cheating, I forgave her as though nothing had ever happened.

I remembered her sin no more, as it were. I didn't think about last time, I wasn't adding up offences, and it didn't take years.

1Cor 13:4-8
Love believes all things, hopes all things....and love never ends.

If you're counseling women to allow this thing to fester for years, you're doing a great disservice to them and the church

 

[annsni]

I find this to be the most worldly, unbiblical response I've ever seen on the subject. Good night. Your husband has to put up safeguards? How faithful is he if he has to wrangle himself into not cheating?

Yes, he puts up safeguards. That is just healthy and proper.

Where does scripture speak about "years" of healing from being cheated on?

Where does scripture speak of healing from infidelity in marriage? I'm just speaking of reality.

My son's mom cheated on me, numerous times. And when she would deny her wrongdoing, I forgave her as though she had done nothing wrong. And when she became pregnant and thought it was a result of her cheating, I forgave her as though nothing had ever happened.

I remembered her sin no more, as it were. I didn't think about last time, I wasn't adding up offences, and it didn't take years.

1Cor 13:4-8
Love believes all things, hopes all things....and love never ends.

The fact that you say you didn't remember it anymore - acted as if nothing happened - and yet she continued to be unfaithful and even pregnant tells me that there was much more going on here than your supposed perfectly biblical stance.

If you're counseling women to allow this thing to fester for years, you're doing a great disservice to them and the church

No, I'm not counseling women to allow this to fester for years but instead we work on forgiveness, accountability and grief. Just like losing a spouse to death, infidelity is losing a spouse to unfaithfulness even if the marriage continues. This can take a VERY long time to heal from and it will never heal to what it once was. To think one just says "You're forgiven" and it's done is honestly a HUGE disservice to those who have gone through this.

 

[Revmitchell]

Infidelity is a very difficult event in a marriage (to put it lightly) and having dealt with this within our congregation, I can safely say it is easy to say what we would do from the outside but once it happens to you, I do think things change. Healing from unfaithfulness is a very long and hard process and it can take years to get to a point where it is no longer daily affecting your relationship with your spouse. I do hope that I would be as gracious but a lot depends on the spouse as well. I'm grateful my husband has put obvious safeguards up and I know his heart pretty well after 30 years and yet we never know what sin hides in the heart of others. Honestly, in the last 6 months, I've realized that infidelity is standing at the door of every marriage and we MUST be on guard against it.

It is a very wise man or woman who safeguards their hearts and minds from temptations. It would be the height of arrogance to believe that we are immune to any kind of temptation. Very wise indeed. Just as it is hard to know how we would react it is also hard to know how long healing would take place. I would never say it is only a short time. I would also not assume it must always be a long time. When God is part of it the timing is His not ours.

 

[Revmitchell]

This can take a VERY long time to heal from and it will never heal to what it once was.

It might but then God may work in ways we never thought of however, We have a God who can restore the years the locusts have eaten. There is no doubt it can be again what it once was. That is a choice to be made not something imposed on us.

To think one just says "You're forgiven" and it's done is honestly a HUGE disservice to those who have gone through this.

We were made by God to mourn and work through loss and hurts. There is nothing wrong in working through our emotions when these tragedies occur.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Everybody has to have safeguards in their lives to keep sexual sin at bay (from thought to deed to addiction). No one is immune from this: not men, not women, not husbands, not wives, and not single people.

From prayer, accountability groups, to getting a grip on what your way of escape is, to blocking certain channels on TV, to purposefully avoiding people, places, and mindsets that trigger your sinful desire and more - one cannot go through this world today unguarded against lust and sexual sin.

When a person gets to a point that the immoral sexual desire has a grasp on them, they may believe that they can "talk themselves down", but it's like trying to talk down a drunk person from a rooftop.

 

[Aaron]

Safeguards are needed against the accusations, too. Just the accusation can ruin an individual.

 

[Aaron]

I find this to be the most worldly, unbiblical response I've ever seen on the subject. Good night. Your husband has to put up safeguards? How faithful is he if he has to wrangle himself into not cheating?

Where does scripture speak about "years" of healing from being cheated on?


My son's mom cheated on me, numerous times. And when she would deny her wrongdoing, I forgave her as though she had done nothing wrong. And when she became pregnant and thought it was a result of her cheating, I forgave her as though nothing had ever happened.

I remembered her sin no more, as it were. I didn't think about last time, I wasn't adding up offences, and it didn't take years.

1Cor 13:4-8
Love believes all things, hopes all things....and love never ends.

If you're counseling women to allow this thing to fester for years, you're doing a great disservice to them and the church

You're right that God can, and will if asked, release individuals from bitterness and grant them power to forgive. Truly forgive. It's no wonder the saying is "to forgive, divine."

 

[Aaron]

But, it's also no wonder that infidelity breaks the bonds of a marriage.

 

[OnlyaSinner]

Everybody has to have safeguards in their lives to keep sexual sin at bay (from thought to deed to addiction). No one is immune from this: not men, not women, not husbands, not wives, and not single people.From prayer, accountability groups, to getting a grip on what your way of escape is, to blocking certain channels on TV, to purposefully avoiding people, places, and mindsets that trigger your sinful desire and more - one cannot go through this world today unguarded against lust and sexual sin.

When a person gets to a point that the immoral sexual desire has a grasp on them, they may believe that they can "talk themselves down", but it's like trying to talk down a drunk person from a rooftop.

What I bolded above is absolutely true.

This is a verse I hold close, as it tells me there is no sin, however grievious, of which I am not capable. (Except rejection of Christ - that was settled when He saved me) This merely confirms that I have a Jeremiah 17:9 heart.

1 Cor. 10:12 - Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

Then God graciously had Paul record:

1 Cor. 10:13 - There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

 

[JamesL]

Yes, he puts up safeguards. That is just healthy and proper.

And I guess here's how you figure....

Where does scripture speak of healing from infidelity in marriage? I'm just speaking of reality.

That's a sentiment expressed far too often in Christendom....
"I'm not talking about bible, I'm talking about real life."

Pretty much sums up the worldly part I mentioned.

The fact that you say you didn't remember it anymore - acted as if nothing happened - and yet she continued to be unfaithful and even pregnant tells me that there was much more going on here than your supposed perfectly biblical stance.

Of course there was something else going on. Someone didn't have any sense of commitment and faithfulness. That's why she left me and my son when he was 6 months old, and only this year (he's 9 y.o.) did he spend two full calendar days in a row with her.

She's on her 2nd husband since me. She left the next one 3 or 4 times, and has left her current one at least twice that I know of.

But regardless of her antics, I was called to love her as Christ loved the church.

No, I'm not counseling women to allow this to fester for years but instead we work on forgiveness, accountability and grief. Just like losing a spouse to death, infidelity is losing a spouse to unfaithfulness even if the marriage continues. This can take a VERY long time to heal from and it will never heal to what it once was. To think one just says "You're forgiven" and it's done is honestly a HUGE disservice to those who have gone through this.

Where do you find scriptural support for the notion that years are needed to forgive? There is none, plain and simple. You can employ the world's philosophy and call it "biblical" counseling if you want, but the *reality* is that it's not scriptural

 

[Thousand Hills]

Not sure how the OP gets that AD is being gracious. We don't know what is going on behind closed doors, but I would guess that with this bunch she's being pressured to "stand by her man".

The article links to a story about the cousin's wedding, her new husband had some interesting comments.

"You don't just surf the Internet and decide to randomly open an Ashley Madison account," he tells ET. "Josh consciously made the decision to cheat. Anna should leave him. People talk about the Biblical aspect of all this -- read Matthew. It talks about how adultery is the one reason to divorce. Josh did it, and I'm going to guess he did it multiple times."

I feel sorry for Anna and the children, it is a sad situation.

 

[OnlyaSinner]

Christ's statement in Matthew 19 tells me that it would not be sinful for Anna to leave Josh due to his infidelity. It certainly does not state that she should leave him. Making that comment immediately after citing the Matthew passage could be taken as going beyond what the Bible says. God still hates divorce, and while Hosea's situation is a picture of God's relationship with Israel, it also has a bearing on betrayal and foregiveness today.